Why not collect old coins?

[cladking]

All coin collectors should collect some old coins whether they are ancients or 18th century US but what are some of the reasons that one shouldn't collect old coins?

 

We're treated here to an endless list of reasons not to collect new coins or moderns. Surely someone can think of a reason or two not to collect old coins.

[jtryka]

I don't understand the question.

[HaydenTubbs]

I don't understand the question.

 

He wondering if anyone has any reasons why one should not collect old coins.

 

Well,I guess if you're a dork who considers himself the king of clad coinage and is obsessed with all modern coinage,maybe...

 

 

J/K!

 

 

Personally,I collect both old and new/modern coinage.I have nothing against either,just the way that people collect them.

 

Hayden

[JamminJ]

If you stick with BU rolls and mint set coins you're pretty much assured that coins are genuine and actually in problem-free mint state condition. Alternately, older coins can have counterfeiting issues and are more likely to have difficult to detect problems.

[IGWT]

We're treated here to an endless list of reasons not to collect new coins or moderns.

 

Actually, I've heard endless suggestions not to collect modern coinage but very few reasons. The advice given, though, is generally sound: know the coin and its value -- both numismatic and monetary -- before you pay.

 

There are lots of reasons not to collect old coins. There has already been so much study of the classics that it's very difficult (though not impossible) to contribute to what has already been accomplished. There's more opportunity to move the hobby forward by collecting and studying moderns.

[chinook]

Old coins are just that....old. Who wants to live in the past?

[midwest]

Old coins are just that....old. Who wants to live in the past?

 

But with that logic you can't collect any coin minted in 2004 or earlier

[cpm9ball]

Old coins are just that....old. Who wants to live in the past?

 

I suppose you get a divorce every year.

 

Chris

[truthteller]

All coin collectors should collect some old coins whether they are ancients or 18th century US but what are some of the reasons that one shouldn't collect old coins?

 

We're treated here to an endless list of reasons not to collect new coins or moderns. Surely someone can think of a reason or two not to collect old coins.

 

 

Maybe some old coins carry contagious diseases on their crusty, wild colored surfaces?

 

 

 

 

TRUTH

[Wihlborg]

And the number one reason not to collect ‘old’ coins…..

 

You want to put a registry set together comprising only MS-69 and MS-70 coins.

 

John

[jom]

Why not collect old coins?

 

That's funny. I say that to myself all the time: "Why NOT collect old coins?"

 

jom

[gmarguli]

1) Too long to collect. You can't build an entire Registry Set in a day by hitting the BINs on eBay.

 

2) Too expensive. You won't be able to buy 95% of them in the next to top pop grade for less than slabbing fees.

 

3) It's more of a pure play for your money! The value of these old coins is 95% in the coin itself and 5% in the plastic. With moderns your value is 100% in the plastic.

 

4) Peer pressure. Yeah, that original choice XF Bust dollar might look cool to you, but your co-workers would rather have a shiny State Quarter.

 

5) More chance to win a registry star to put next to your set. The Registry Sets for old coins is set. However, there is an infinite number of Registry Sets and sub-sets, and variety sets, and TV sets for moderns.

 

6) Virtual hand job. Because not many people understand the hard work it takes to assemble a set of Seated Liberty quarters, but everyone knows how difficult it is to put together a 1996 year set.

 

7) Be a commoner. You don't want to appear elitist. Better to claim knowledge about the difficulties in finding gem State Quarters rather than discussing the differences in striking techniques the mint employed in the early 19th century.

 

8) Educating the dealers. It sucks when dealers tell you they don't have any Choice unc Flowing Hair large cents in stock. However, it sucks even more when they look at you strangely when you ask if they have any 1993-P Roosevelt dimes with Full Torches in PCGS MS66. Collecting moderns is a perfect opportunity for you to educate them on the rarity of these coins.

[IGWT]

Hasn't the pot been stirred enough in the past 24 hours?

[IGWT]

It's virtually impossible to unchain oneself from the TPGs -- whether buying or selling -- if you collect old coins. Collecting modern coins can be liberating.

[GAB]

It's virtually impossible to unchain oneself from the TPGs -- whether buying or selling -- if you collect old coins. Collecting modern coins can be liberating.

 

Unfortunate, but true - for most of us.

[Bruceswar]

A reason not to collect an old series.... is that you will never be able to complete it.... take for instance... early dollars... 1804... not gonna happen for 99% of us...

[cladking]

1) Too long to collect. You can't build an entire Registry Set in a day by hitting the BINs on eBay.

 

Actually the classics are mostly easier to put together quickly. At least this is true for the more affordable coins. With moderns there will be many that aren't available at any price or aren't available at any given time.

2) Too expensive. You won't be able to buy 95% of them in the next to top pop grade for less than slabbing fees.

 

Quite true. The coins are far more expensive for equal rarity.

3) It's more of a pure play for your money! The value of these old coins is 95% in the coin itself and 5% in the plastic. With moderns your value is 100% in the plastic.

 

This isn't true but has been repeated so many times that it has prompted this thread. While many people collect for enjoyment rather than profit, the fct remains that moderns have been the most profitable coins for nearly a decade now.

4) Peer pressure. Yeah, that original choice XF Bust dollar might look cool to you, but your co-workers would rather have a shiny State Quarter.

 

It is true that non collectors are more impressed by a high grade clad than most old coins but I'm not sure this is really a good reason not to collect old coins.

5) More chance to win a registry star to put next to your set. The Registry Sets for old coins is set. However, there is an infinite number of Registry Sets and sub-sets, and variety sets, and TV sets for moderns.

 

I'm not sure what this means but I'm pretty sure it's not a good reason to not collect old coins.

6) Virtual hand job. Because not many people understand the hard work it takes to assemble a set of Seated Liberty quarters, but everyone knows how difficult it is to put together a 1996 year set.

 

Seated liberty quarters are difficult enough to assemble in nicer grades that this doesn't really constitute a reason not to collect them.

7) Be a commoner. You don't want to appear elitist. Better to claim knowledge about the difficulties in finding gem State Quarters rather than discussing the differences in striking techniques the mint employed in the early 19th century.

 

Much more is known about mint practices in the early 19th century than is known about moderns. There are books where one can look up most of this information. Some might consider this a good reason not to collect classics.

 

So that's one, anyway.

 

8) Educating the dealers. It sucks when dealers tell you they don't have any Choice unc Flowing Hair large cents in stock. However, it sucks even more when they look at you strangely when you ask if they have any 1993-P Roosevelt dimes with Full Torches in PCGS MS66. Collecting moderns is a perfect opportunity for you to educate them on the rarity of these coins.

 

Good point. This is a hoot and something most classic collectors miss unless they are an expert in their series.

[jom]

Greg mentioned that older coins 95% of the value is in the coin rather than the plastic. Clad King refutes this. Can either you are Greg prove/disprove this point with an example?

 

If not, I might suggest a better way of putting it is that HIGH GRADE moderns have MUCH of their value based on the plastic more so than classics anyway. Probably because many classics do not come in those types of grades.

 

jom

[cladking]

Greg mentioned that older coins 95% of the value is in the coin rather than the plastic. Clad King refutes this. Can either you are Greg prove/disprove this point with an example?

 

If not, I might suggest a better way of putting it is that HIGH GRADE moderns have MUCH of their value based on the plastic more so than classics anyway. Probably because many classics do not come in those types of grades.

 

jom

 

This claim has been repeated ad nauseum despite several very cogent refutations. It is true that some moderns are very dependent on a grading opinion simply because they are at the high end of the spectrum or they are a liner where there is a very wide spread in price between grades. But this applies to specific or individual coins and not all are modern. Most making this claim are merely observing that the corner coin shop doesn't buy moderns and would only take a flyer on one if it's in a holder.

 

Many solid for the grade moderns will bring nearly as much in the holder as out. This includes not only rarities but also high grade coins like an MS-66 '76 type I Ike or an MS-67 1969 25c.

 

Certainly you won't be able to get PR-70 money for a coin out of the holder. There are numerous reasons for this and not the least of which is that one can't be certain of getting the coin back into the same holder. Even if it were a sure thing, the tiniest mark would degrade it. There is a simple solution though; don't break it out. If it bothers you then don't buy it.

[cladking]

This was really intended as a classic bashing thread.

 

I don't know where it failed.

[michael]

i myself have NEVER SAW ANY POSTS HERE OR ON PCGS BOARDS BASHING raw MODERN COINS for collectors

 

now bashing the plastic and tag surrounding certain modern coins worth around a few dollars raw but with a plastic holder and tag around the coin then some hucksters selling the plastic holdered coin for hundreds if not thousands of dollars yes!!!

 

better get your facts straight are you awake?

 

this thing about raw modern collecting bashing NEVER

 

YOU TAKE THINGS OUT OF CONTEST

 

only modern era coins worth around a few dollars THAT ARE SOLD IN HOLDERS for hundreds to thousands of dollars

 

modern bashing no

 

bashing plastic holdered modern coins selling for hundreds to thousands of dollars that if broken out of their respective holders lose 80% 90% 95% or more of its demand YES

[JamminJ]

This was really intended as a classic bashing thread.

 

I don't know where it failed.

 

You're too outnumbered.

[cladking]

i myself have NEVER SAW ANY POSTS HERE OR ON PCGS BOARDS BASHING raw MODERN COINS for collectors

 

now bashing the plastic and tag surrounding certain modern coins worth around a few dollars raw but with a plastic holder and tag around the coin then some hucksters selling the plastic holdered coin for hundreds if not thousands of dollars yes!!!

 

better get your facts straight are you awake?

 

this thing about raw modern collecting bashing NEVER

 

YOU TAKE THINGS OUT OF CONTEST

 

only modern era coins worth around a few dollars THAT ARE SOLD IN HOLDERS for hundreds to thousands of dollars

 

modern bashing no

 

bashing plastic holdered modern coins selling for hundreds to thousands of dollars that if broken out of their respective holders lose 80% 90% 95% or more of its demand YES

 

 

Well, let's just go ahead and get this started then:

 

You need to be very wary of surfaces on old coins. They've had many decades to have their surfaces change, degrade, repaired, toned, cleaned and otherwise become other than original. Unless you're very knowledgeable you might buy a coin that will be very much less appreciated by collectors in the future. You might get a great coin at a great price that soars in value but your example tanks because of a little something funny on the surface.

 

This isn't a problem with moderns. If it looks unc or proof then it's unc or proof.

[cladking]

This was really intended as a classic bashing thread.

 

I don't know where it failed.

 

You're too outnumbered.

 

 

I very seriously doubt it.

[GAB]

i myself have NEVER SAW ANY POSTS HERE OR ON PCGS BOARDS BASHING raw MODERN COINS for collectors

 

now bashing the plastic and tag surrounding certain modern coins worth around a few dollars raw but with a plastic holder and tag around the coin then some hucksters selling the plastic holdered coin for hundreds if not thousands of dollars yes!!!

 

better get your facts straight are you awake?

 

this thing about raw modern collecting bashing NEVER

 

YOU TAKE THINGS OUT OF CONTEST

 

only modern era coins worth around a few dollars THAT ARE SOLD IN HOLDERS for hundreds to thousands of dollars

 

modern bashing no

 

bashing plastic holdered modern coins selling for hundreds to thousands of dollars that if broken out of their respective holders lose 80% 90% 95% or more of its demand YES

 

Michael,

Was this intended as a reply to ME ??

[michael]

 

definately NO

 

 

 

not you gab

 

[EZ_E]

 

Well, let's just go ahead and get this started then:

 

You need to be very wary of surfaces on old coins. They've had many decades to have their surfaces change, degrade, repaired, toned, cleaned and otherwise become other than original. Unless you're very knowledgeable you might buy a coin that will be very much less appreciated by collectors in the future. You might get a great coin at a great price that soars in value but your example tanks because of a little something funny on the surface.

 

This isn't a problem with moderns. If it looks unc or proof then it's unc or proof.

 

Actually, in most cases, if an older coin has a thick, original skin then that barrier will protect the coin from further changes on the down-spiral of corrosion as long as it is properly kept. Red copper would be the exception.

 

Modern coins (of which I am definitely a collector) do not have this protective coating so they will deteriorate that much faster if not stored in a proper environment. Man, some of my proof sets in the original packaging sure have turned. This is one of the reasons that I'm opposed to ms/pr 70 products along with the ridiculous mark ups.

 

I love your contributions to the boards, Clad. I've learned alot from you and am certainly not coming down on you. Just stating my opinions based upon the knowledge of my experiences is all.

 

p.s. I agree with michael's statement:

 

modern bashing no

 

bashing plastic holdered modern coins selling for hundreds to thousands of dollars that if broken out of their respective holders lose 80% 90% 95% or more of its demand YES

[cladking]

 

p.s. I agree with michael's statement:

 

modern bashing no

 

bashing plastic holdered modern coins selling for hundreds to thousands of dollars that if broken out of their respective holders lose 80% 90% 95% or more of its demand YES

 

I don't disagree with it either.

 

The problem is that it is usually presented so as to appear to refer to all modern coins. Even where there is a decrease in price when a coin is broken out of a holder this decrease can be misunderstood. Any maxed out coin loses a lot of value if busted out. If it's a modern (or any coin with large spreads between grades) then there is some chance this drop will be significant.

 

It's ironic that most collectors who are so afraid of moderns are the same ones who harp on buying the coin and the most afraid of any changes to the grading system. Here we have a system that merely prices coins rather than grade them and most of the modern bashers can't stop talking about slabs and what they are worth. They find the prices of moderns to be out of their understanding so attack the slabs.

[chinook]

Any maxed out coin loses a lot of value if busted out

 

So true.

 

Here's another reason.

 

Nobody recognizes old coins. Most people think they are foreign.

[EZ_E]

I think that the misunderstanding lies in what you said. Most bash the unreasonable prices that accompany the high graded slabs, no the actual modern coin itself.

 

However, I can concede that some business strike moderns will be ultra rarities in ms67 or ms68 (apart from the commems) and should demand a premium. However, due to the quest to be first in the registry, should these coins actually sell for more than 10 grand which some do? Well, it's not my money so it is not for me to judge but I will lay out caveats to those who know no better.

 

As stated: I love my modern commem dollar collection and my clad/silver proof sets and mint sets. This is the gravy of the hobby of which I want a second helping.