1910 reverse of 1909 Class III transitional Lincoln Wheat Cent - correction to thread ATS 0

[RWB]

https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/1094653/1910-reverse-of-1909-class-iii-transitional-lincoln-wheat-cent

A message thread on the PCGS board includes this comment:

"Peace1 Posts: 39 ✭✭✭

@robec said:
I suppose then also any 1909 VDB with the dot between the D and B closer to the B will be Barber’s version since that only occurs on reverses where the N in UNITED is deep cut.

"Barber’s reverse has the dot between D and B closest to the D. Brenner’s reverse the dot is centered."

This is incorrect. ALL the reverse hubs with "V.D.B" were made by Charles Barber. Brenner's hub had  "Brenner" in the same position. This was rejected and Barber merely replaced  "Brenner"  with the initials. (See Renaissance of American Coinage 1909-1915 for details and photos.)

[robec1347]

On 4/9/2024 at 8:27 AM, RWB said:

https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/1094653/1910-reverse-of-1909-class-iii-transitional-lincoln-wheat-cent

A message thread on the PCGS board includes this comment:

"Peace1 Posts: 39 ✭✭✭

@robec said:
I suppose then also any 1909 VDB with the dot between the D and B closer to the B will be Barber’s version since that only occurs on reverses where the N in UNITED is deep cut.

"Barber’s reverse has the dot between D and B closest to the D. Brenner’s reverse the dot is centered."

This is incorrect. ALL the reverse hubs with "V.D.B" were made by Charles Barber. Brenner's hub had  "Brenner" in the same position. This was rejected and Barber merely replaced  "Brenner"  with the initials. (See Renaissance of American Coinage 1909-1915 for details and photos.)

I’m not sure whose design is which. My response supposing that Barber’s version differs Brenner’s was based solely on the fact there are two versions of the VDB reverse, one with the filled N and centered dot between the D and B and one with the deep cut N and the dot closer to the D. Peace1 attributed Barber with one and Brenner with the other. If Barber was the creator of both I’m fine with that. Both versions exist with the Philadelphia coin.  The San Francisco version only come with the filled N, centered dot. 

[RWB]

It's a very minor point. The appearance is that "V.D.B." were added manually to two hubs. A little retouching of the strong N hub is also possible. (I've not paid attention to this since it's a deep specialist subject.)

Also, neither obverse nor reverse dies were made for a specific mint. San Francisco dies became that only before final hardening when the mintmark was added. We know almost nothing about the details of die manufacture such as were they kept in a certain production order, the quantity annealed at one time, when and where were die lengths cut to fit specific presses, etc.

Edited April 9 by RWB

[The Tew Legacy]

For the record @RWB I contacted you when this project started. I read your book. My question to you would be have you read mine? Thru science and technology the claims made are proven with handwriting analysis showing two distinct designs, 3D scanning proving a different Galvano were made to correct Brenner’s design, how Barbers version was annealed over Brenner’s version creating the earliest known Class III. I would be more than happy to send you a copy…you have my email address….reach out anytime.

[RWB]

On 4/14/2024 at 9:34 PM, The Tew Legacy said:

For the record @RWB I contacted you when this project started. I read your book. My question to you would be have you read mine? Thru science and technology the claims made are proven with handwriting analysis showing two distinct designs, 3D scanning proving a different Galvano were made to correct Brenner’s design, how Barbers version was annealed over Brenner’s version creating the earliest known Class III. I would be more than happy to send you a copy…you have my email address….reach out anytime.

It would be nice to see the final product, but I insist on paying for it. The draft materials I've read were not convincing --- But, that does not diminish the concepts of you or others. My views are built on original documents and their descriptions.

Edited April 15 by RWB