High Relief 1 1

[Halbrook Family]

I heard someone mention today about a high relief Peace Dollar. What does that mean? I don't see that in the red book glossary

[Coinbuf]

On 1/11/2024 at 6:45 PM, edhalbrook said:

I heard someone mention today about a high relief Peace Dollar. What does that mean? I don't see that in the red book glossary

All 1921 Peace dollars were struck in high relief, this was not successful as the coins did not strike up well and the dies did not survive or last well.   As a result for all subsequent years of Peace dollar production the relief was lowered.

[Sandon]

    Instead of the glossary, take a look at the introductory language in the "Redbook" to the section on Peace dollars and the listings of the 1921 and 1922 issues (p. 236 if you are still using the 2018 edition, p. 239 of the 2023 edition). All 1921 Peace dollars were struck in "high relief", resulting in most pieces being somewhat weakly struck at the centers.  There are a few special strikings of pieces dated 1922 in high relief, but they are so rare as to be essentially uncollectable. All other Peace dollars (1922-1935) are struck in lower relief.

[powermad5000]

The term relief is the part of the coin's design that is raised above the surface. For the 1921 Peace Dollar design, the designer Anthony De Francisci felt if the design had a higher relief that it would produce a better looking coin. However, this created problems at the Mint during production of the 1921 Peace Dollars. This is described in the book titled Comprehensive Catalog and Encyclopedia of Morgan & Peace Dollars by Leroy C. Van Allen & A. George Mallis on p. 411.

George Morgan wrote Francisci : I know you will be disappointed but the pressure necessary to bring up the work was so destructive to the dies that we got tired of putting new dies in.

A January 10, 1922 letter from the Acting Director of the Mint (Mary Margaret O'Reilly) to the Superintendent of the Philadelphia Mint : 

Request you to discontinue all work on preparation of dies for 1922 silver dollars.

     It is understood from your letter of Jan. 6 1922, that the relief model from which dies were prepared for 21 coins is too great, and its distribution and areas not wisely planned; that the highest relief on each side is in the center of the coin and to attempt to drive the metal into this part of the coin brings a fin to the outer edge and breaks the die, and that this results in a decided difference in thickness which mars the appearance of the coin and interferes with stacking. It is also understood that the change is necessary to bring the model nearer to coin relief, and that such changes could be made at the mint without changing design, after consulting with its designer.

     In accordance with your suggestion over the telephone it has been decided to take the matter up with the FAC with a view to procuring from Mr. Francisci a new model of lower relief. In doing this it is understood no change will be made in the design of the coin...

There was extra pressure needed by the presses to try to get the design to strike up fully but by design it was raised so high above the surface of the coin that the details in the hair of Liberty in the center on the obverse were flattened as well as some of the feathers in the eagle on the reverse also in the center of the coin. Not to be confused with wear, but as a problem between design and actual production limitations. Not only was the finished product less than what was to be expected in terms of looks, but also the cost to produce these was significantly higher than expected as the dies wore out too quickly or broke too soon. It was also subsequently found out that the coins did not stack well either due to the higher relief of the design.

According to this book, high relief coins were struck for 1922 early in January 1922, but since the dies were still experimental the struck coins were destroyed. The high relief dies that were sent to the Denver Mint on January 6th were returned to the Philadelphia Mint on January 12th. In mid January 1922, changes were made and 5 trial pieces were struck in matte proof of the slightly modified design but were still of high relief with the 1922 date on them. Three were to be sent to the sculptor and two pieces were to be sent to the Director of the Mint. The pieces were to be returned to the Bureau of the Mint to be destroyed but they never did receive such a fate and are among the rarest of silver dollars today.

[RWB]

The vanAllen book is basic and old.

You'll find better, fully accurate information in the book Renaissance of American Coinage 1916-1921.

[Assikaza]

On 1/12/2024 at 9:13 AM, powermad5000 said:

The term relief is the part of the coin's design that is raised above the surface. For the 1921 Peace Dollar design, the designer Anthony De Francisci felt if the design had a higher relief that it would produce a better looking coin. However, this created problems at the Mint during production of the 1921 Peace Dollars. This is described in the book titled Comprehensive Catalog and Encyclopedia of Morgan & Peace Dollars by Leroy C. Van Allen & A. George Mallis on p. 411.

George Morgan wrote Francisci : I know you will be disappointed but the pressure necessary to bring up the work was so destructive to the dies that we got tired of putting new dies in.

A January 10, 1922 letter from the Acting Director of the Mint (Mary Margaret O'Reilly) to the Superintendent of the Philadelphia Mint : 

Request you to discontinue all work on preparation of dies for 1922 silver dollars.

     It is understood from your letter of Jan. 6 1922, that the relief model from which dies were prepared for 21 coins is too great, and its distribution and areas not wisely planned; that the highest relief on each side is in the center of the coin and to attempt to drive the metal into this part of the coin brings a fin to the outer edge and breaks the die, and that this results in a decided difference in thickness which mars the appearance of the coin and interferes with stacking. It is also understood that the change is necessary to bring the model nearer to coin relief, and that such changes could be made at the mint without changing design, after consulting with its designer.

     In accordance with your suggestion over the telephone it has been decided to take the matter up with the FAC with a view to procuring from Mr. Francisci a new model of lower relief. In doing this it is understood no change will be made in the design of the coin...

There was extra pressure needed by the presses to try to get the design to strike up fully but by design it was raised so high above the surface of the coin that the details in the hair of Liberty in the center on the obverse were flattened as well as some of the feathers in the eagle on the reverse also in the center of the coin. Not to be confused with wear, but as a problem between design and actual production limitations. Not only was the finished product less than what was to be expected in terms of looks, but also the cost to produce these was significantly higher than expected as the dies wore out too quickly or broke too soon. It was also subsequently found out that the coins did not stack well either due to the higher relief of the design.

According to this book, high relief coins were struck for 1922 early in January 1922, but since the dies were still experimental the struck coins were destroyed. The high relief dies that were sent to the Denver Mint on January 6th were returned to the Philadelphia Mint on January 12th. In mid January 1922, changes were made and 5 trial pieces were struck in matte proof of the slightly modified design but were still of high relief with the 1922 date on them. This experiment allowed the researchers to realize that mass production required better dies, which subsequently led to the development of technologies. They were never put into mass production and did not enter the general economic circulation. My nephew, via https://edubirdie.com/economics-help, did research on the role of coins as a physical object in payment. Such coins were the basis for the development of this area. Three were to be sent to the sculptor and two pieces were to be sent to the Director of the Mint. The pieces were to be returned to the Bureau of the Mint to be destroyed but they never did receive such a fate and are among the rarest of silver dollars today.

I read that in 2021 they released a new batch of these coins for the centenary. Though, of course, they still didn't make them as relief. And the metal composition is different.

Edited April 12 by Assikaza

[RWB]

The Mint has produced some sloppy imitations, although they have original casts from 1921.

Also, look in A Guide Book for Peace Dollars, Whitman Pub. 4th edition. (By me...)