The 'Rona made me do it! (Picked up a couple of Morgans) 1 1

[Thompson2]

It must have been boredom... or wine... or some combination of the two.. I didn't / don't intend to collect, but these two Morgans appealed to me on the 'bay... I'm 90% sure they're over-graded, so I figured I'd give you chuckle-heads something to chuckle at. I paid a few grades down and I like both of them, so I won't be horribly upset, regardless.  I'll post the slabbed grade in a few days.

Pics have been sized way down to get to a good file size.  I can post full size if you're really curious...

For your amusement, an 1879, Rev of '78 (guess I'm still sore about the really nice one that came back as "cleaned", lol)

 

And an 1885 CC

Yeah, there's a bit of rim damage by the second U in Unum, but not at the first.. that's just slab filler.  And what's up with the arc on the reverse that runs along "D States Of"?  

Edited May 26, 2020 by Thompson2

[Just Bob]

First one is AU, and the second is a nice 63, with a shot at 64, if the tics on the cheek are not as noticeable in hand as they are in the picture. That's a die crack across the top on the reverse.

[Terence:)]

11 hours ago, Just Bob said:

...... and the second is a nice 63, with a shot at 64

On a side note for the 85cc it looks like a VAM3 as well. While that may not add any more value it's just nice to know to some .... nice looking coin.

And the arc is a very prominent die crack. Perhaps jGrinz can help with that.

Edited May 22, 2020 by Terence:)

[Conder101]

You will also see cracks from U to the star and through the bottom of ONE and from the R to the star to A3, and another from the wing through Am and the top of E.

Edited May 22, 2020 by Conder101

[Coinbuf]

AU53 and MS63 is my call on grades.

[Thompson2]

On 5/21/2020 at 6:31 PM, Just Bob said:

First one is AU, and the second is a nice 63, with a shot at 64, if the tics on the cheek are not as noticeable in hand as they are in the picture. That's a die crack across the top on the reverse.

Yeah, the light wasn't in the best position and made the tics look deeper than they do in hand.  Moved the light a bit and got a better shot.

On 5/22/2020 at 6:11 AM, Terence:) said:

On a side note for the 85cc it looks like a VAM3 as well. While that may not add any more value it's just nice to know to some .... nice looking coin.

And the arc is a very prominent die crack. Perhaps jGrinz can help with that.

Good eye!  Had to look it up, but it's a match.  Shot of the die details and a close up of the mint mark

 

On 5/22/2020 at 11:10 AM, Conder101 said:

You will also see cracks from U to the star and through the bottom of ONE and from the R to the star to A3, and another from the wing through Am and the top of E.

It runs almost all the way around.  Crazy.  

On 5/22/2020 at 11:38 AM, Coinbuf said:

AU53 and MS63 is my call on grades.

Almost spot on!  AU53 and IMS64  You can blame it on the bad pic!   

 

Now a follow-on question - if I'm holding these for future value and ease of moving them (in the event of my untimely demise) should I get them reslabbed by NGC?  The 1879 is Anacs and the 1885 is IGC.  

 

[Coinbuf]

12 hours ago, Thompson2 said:

 

Now a follow-on question - if I'm holding these for future value and ease of moving them (in the event of my untimely demise) should I get them reslabbed by NGC?  The 1879 is Anacs and the 1885 is IGC.  

 

I would leave them as is I do not see you gaining any value on the 1879-S in that grade; too common a coin worth $35-$40 at this grade so not worth spending another $35 to have it crossed.  I think the 1885-CC would drop a grade (ICG is liberal with grades imo) and while there is not a big price spread between MS64 and MS63 ($50-$75) unless you bought it real cheap between the lost value of a grade point reduction and the cost to cross you are likely to spend more than you stand to gain.  You will gain some added liquidity by changing the plastic to NGC or PCGS, but I don't see the cost offset by that liquidity, but its your dime so your choice.

[Thompson2]

11 hours ago, Coinbuf said:

I would leave them as is I do not see you gaining any value on the 1879-S in that grade; too common a coin worth $35-$40 at this grade so not worth spending another $35 to have it crossed.  I think the 1885-CC would drop a grade (ICG is liberal with grades imo) and while there is not a big price spread between MS64 and MS63 ($50-$75) unless you bought it real cheap between the lost value of a grade point reduction and the cost to cross you are likely to spend more than you stand to gain.  You will gain some added liquidity by changing the plastic to NGC or PCGS, but I don't see the cost offset by that liquidity, but its your dime so your choice.

Well, at $40. I did -not- get a deal on the 1879... hopefully it’s worth a bit more than that.  Where is a good place to look for values?  NGC, PCGS, and the Red Book all said I didn’t do quite that bad.  If I did, I’ll blame the wine...  

Appreciate the input on the cross.  I’ll need to figure out actual (current) market on the CC to see if a cross makes sense. According to the same 3 sources, I paid 2-6 grades lower... so i only overpaid a little?  Ha!  

But, since I like them, I’m less concerned with the current value.  Liquidity is more for “future” considerations.  

 

 

[Coinbuf]

Opps sorry I forgot you have the rev of 78 and pulled the value for a regular 1879-S.  Having said that both the NGC ($230) and PCGS ($250) price guides are well over the recent auction results which over the past 4yrs have a wide range from a low of $60 to a high of $200 and a median of around $150.  Those results are for NGC and PCGS graded coins that were auctioned by HA, DL, and SB; I didn't look at CG to see what their results have been.  Auction history on the 1885-CC shows a very tight price range from AU58 to MS64 with a slight price jump at MS65 for NGC and PCGS graded coins.  Because the market often discounts the ICG holder and the tight price range likely explains why you got a deal.

[Thompson2]

6 hours ago, Coinbuf said:

Opps sorry I forgot you have the rev of 78 and pulled the value for a regular 1879-S.  Having said that both the NGC ($230) and PCGS ($250) price guides are well over the recent auction results which over the past 4yrs have a wide range from a low of $60 to a high of $200 and a median of around $150.  Those results are for NGC and PCGS graded coins that were auctioned by HA, DL, and SB; I didn't look at CG to see what their results have been.  Auction history on the 1885-CC shows a very tight price range from AU58 to MS64 with a slight price jump at MS65 for NGC and PCGS graded coins.  Because the market often discounts the ICG holder and the tight price range likely explains why you got a deal.

Lol... easy to overlook that.  Good thing these forums offer a money back guarantee on the free input.    I didn't get the steal of the century on the 1879, but not too bad (still not enough to justify a cross, I think).   

Do you have similar data for the 1885?  Now I'm really curious on how it's trending... 

Or, instead of just providing the info, is there somewhere that tracks the auction info (I noticed that most sold listing for both of these went below NGC/PCGS Pricing)?  ePay only leaves sold items up for a few months.  I've not looked at HA (assuming Heritage Auctions?)  Who are DL, SB and CG?  

 

[Coinbuf]

18 hours ago, Thompson2 said:

Lol... easy to overlook that.  Good thing these forums offer a money back guarantee on the free input.    I didn't get the steal of the century on the 1879, but not too bad (still not enough to justify a cross, I think).   

Do you have similar data for the 1885?  Now I'm really curious on how it's trending... 

Or, instead of just providing the info, is there somewhere that tracks the auction info (I noticed that most sold listing for both of these went below NGC/PCGS Pricing)?  ePay only leaves sold items up for a few months.  I've not looked at HA (assuming Heritage Auctions?)  Who are DL, SB and CG?  

 

A couple of places you can look, first is the NGC coin explorer found on the main NGC page.  Once you have selected the coin you want you can move down the page to the auction prices realized table where you can find info on each grade like pop number, guide price, current auctions, and previous auctions.  By clicking on view all another page will be opened and you can select the grade (or range) auction houses you want to see info from and such.  The second is the Auction prices realized available from the PCGS main page, generally the same info just a different format.  Sometimes the PCGS search is more up to date for some reason, in the case of your 1879 the PCGS search shows two auctions from 2020 that the NGC search doesn't.

 

HA = Heritage Auctions

DL = David Lawrence

SB = Stacks and Bowers auction house

CG (my bad should be GC) = Great Collections auctions

Most of these will come up by using the TPG search functions but sometimes by looking at the closed auction history on the auction website you can see photos and descriptions that help to understand why a coin may have sold very high or very low.  The TPG search's are what I use to get a feel for what the real world pricing is and then compare to the guide prices.  The only issue is with coins that have low pops and therefore fewer auction results, to draw info from.

[Thompson2]

Great... first you give me two bum pieces of info, then you make me feel like a complete <edit>id10T</edit>...  I demand a refund! 

 

I've clicked past at least the NGC auction results about 150 times and just never paid attention to it... ugh... 

Thanks for the info... sorry I never found it myself...   

Cheers!

 

Edited May 26, 2020 by Thompson2

[KarenHolcomb]

Very nice, my friend. I'm so glad I found the posting. I shall now do some research for you. I absolutely LOOOVE that Reverse Crack.

[Thompson2]

18 minutes ago, KarenHolcomb said:

Very nice, my friend. I'm so glad I found the posting. I shall now do some research for you. I absolutely LOOOVE that Reverse Crack.

Why does that not surprise me, Ms. Error Queen?   

It is pretty cool though.  Best of both worlds.. Cool defect on a "straight grade" coin.