1857 Toned Flying Eagle cent

[Capone1929]

Testing my grading skills seeing how accurate I am on this toned 1857 Flying Eagle cent! Photos are taken in cardboard fold over protector and didn't want to remove it! Crisp overall, A lot of the finer details appearing and or starting to show on OBVERSE and reverse. On the obverse wing tips, brest, and leg have visible wear, beak is sharp and only high points show wear, same with the wreath on reverse, but the C and E in cent WORN. XF 35-XF 40 is my grade, opinions welcome what is your GRADE? VALUE? Authentic?(I believe its genuine) but any help is welcome, Thank you for your time, Capone1929 

[KMAG100]

Hello,  unfortunately those pictures are on where near good enough to take a guess at grade for me.

[BillJones]

The coin has VF sharpness, but unfortunately the toning is actually corrosion. There appears to be some active green corrosion at least in the area of “CA” of “AMERICA” and perhaps elsewhere.

I am not an expert on how to stop what is going on, but I would at least take the piece out of that holder and get it into something that might have less moisture in it.

Sorry to be so negative, but I learned early on my collecting career (mid 1960s) to recognize corrosion on these copper-nickel pieces.

[Capone1929]

I wasn't sure if that was going on or if it was toning

3 hours ago, BillJones said:

The coin has VF sharpness, but unfortunately the toning is actually corrosion. There appears to be some active green corrosion at least in the area of “CA” of “AMERICA” and perhaps elsewhere.

I am not an expert on how to stop what is going on, but I would at least take the piece out of that holder and get it into something that might have less moisture in it.

Sorry to be so negative, but I learned early on my collecting career (mid 1960s) to recognize corrosion on these copper-nickel pieces.

I wasn't sure if that was going on or if it was TONING, I know to not clean them, I bought the coin that way without it in the holder, and put it into the holder after I bought it to try to stop further escalation of this if that was what was going on, apparently that is what the coin has, kinda coin cancer, however I bought it back east M.D. where it's much more humid, I live in a dry climate the desert of new mexico, it does not seem to have progressed, would you still take it out of that case knowing That? Would cola ruin it like the trick of a corroded battery? Help it? If not left in it, but dipped real quick then ran under cool water quick? Is there a safe way to remove it with minimal damage? Thank you very much for your reply it is very helpful, Capone1929

[Capone1929]

I don't think your being negative at all! That's why I joined, to learn this kind of thing, Thank you, I knew it was probably that, or at least a possibility anyhow, bought it like that because I thought it looked cool, but It's actually hurting it🙁 hope I can save it somehow, too rare to just throw out, but guess I can just buy another better one for my collection and keep this one, have it pro cleaned, who would I send to to clean, any suggestions there?Thanks, Capone1929

[Capone1929]

Hate to do it (clean it) but better cleaned I guess than letting it go further down hill and preserve a still nice RARE coin? Yay? Nay? Opinion? Thanks, David

[BillJones]

Let's see if I can help you. Copper or bronze usually turns green when it corrodes, It can also turn a dull red, but that gets complicated.

A copper-nickel cent, like this Flying Eagle usually turns black. There can be spots of green, but usually the corroded color is black.

I don't have any photos of circulated copper nickel cents, but I can show these Mint State pieces. This 1857 Flying Eagle is a Mint State piece. It has toned to a gray color. This coin is a PCGS graded MS-65.  

 

[BillJones]

Here is another copper-nickel cent, which has not toned. The Flying Eagle Cents and the Indian Cents from 1859 to mid 1864 were made of the same alloy. This coin is a PCGS graded MS-64.

A nice circulated example of this would be a dull gray, something like a circulated Jefferson Nickel.

 

[Just Bob]

You can soak your coin in distilled water. It may slowly loosen the grime and gunk, which can then be flushed off. This is not a quick process. It may take weeks or months. If that does not remove all of the junk, you may want to try olive oil.I have had good success using it on copper, brass, and aluminum tokens and coins, and I have a few copper-nickel Indians cents soaking at the moment. I have read that it can darken copper coins, so you may want to check it every other day or so, just to be safe. I have soaked copper tokens for as long as six months, with no adverse effects. It sounds strange, but a green rose thorn ( that is not a brand name or slang term - it is an actual thorn from a rose bush) can be use to pick the softened, loosened gunk from the crevices. It has a sharp point to get in those tiny spots, but is not so hard that it will scratch the coin.

I have never tried using cola, but I would think it would be way too harsh, and would alter the appearance of the coin. I wouldn't recommend it.

 

Edited to add:

I went back and found an old thread of mine from 10 years ago. It concerned conserving a token.

This reply was from Conder101:

 

"Looks like active corrosion. Might try a soak in an oil based product such as olive oil, mineral oil or blue ribbon, then use a rose thorn to remove any loosened corrosion product. You may have to do a few cycles of soak then thorn. (The thorn is also good for getting any dirt or "crud" out from around the devices, it is soft enough it should not scratch, strong enough to dig out the crud, and comes to a small enough point that it gets into the smallest places.)

 

Then use acetone to remove all of the oil and to throughly dry the token. (one thing the corrosion need to work is to water and the rough area of the corrosion will hold onto water molecules very well. The acetone gets in there and "dissolves" out the water and carries it off. It acts as a drying agent.) After the acetone you might want to then apply a very thin layer of blue ribbon or mineral oil to the token to seal out moisture from the corrosion area. (The oil fills the nooks and crannies in the corrosion keeping the water vapor in the air out of them.)

 

Now the corroded areas will still look rough and pitted but it should look better than the active corrosion and will help stop it from getting any worse."

 

[Capone1929]

17 minutes ago, Just Bob said:

You can soak your coin in distilled water. It may slowly loosen the grime and gunk, which can then be flushed off. This is not a quick process. It may take weeks or months. If that does not remove all of the junk, you may want to try olive oil.I have had good success using it on copper, brass, and aluminum tokens and coins, and I have a few copper-nickel Indians cents soaking at the moment. I have read that it can darken copper coins, so you may want to check it every other day or so, just to be safe. I have soaked copper tokens for as long as six months, with no adverse effects. It sounds strange, but a green rose thorn ( that is not a brand name or slang term - it is an actual thorn from a rose bush) can be use to pick the softened, loosened gunk from the crevices. It has a sharp point to get in those tiny spots, but is not so hard that it will scratch the coin.

I have never tried using cola, but I would think it would be way too harsh, and would alter the appearance of the coin. I wouldn't recommend it.

 

Edited to add:

I went back and found an old thread of mine from 10 years ago. It concerned conserving a token.

This reply was from Conder101:

 

"Looks like active corrosion. Might try a soak in an oil based product such as olive oil, mineral oil or blue ribbon, then use a rose thorn to remove any loosened corrosion product. You may have to do a few cycles of soak then thorn. (The thorn is also good for getting any dirt or "crud" out from around the devices, it is soft enough it should not scratch, strong enough to dig out the crud, and comes to a small enough point that it gets into the smallest places.)

 

Then use acetone to remove all of the oil and to throughly dry the token. (one thing the corrosion need to work is to water and the rough area of the corrosion will hold onto water molecules very well. The acetone gets in there and "dissolves" out the water and carries it off. It acts as a drying agent.) After the acetone you might want to then apply a very thin layer of blue ribbon or mineral oil to the token to seal out moisture from the corrosion area. (The oil fills the nooks and crannies in the corrosion keeping the water vapor in the air out of them.)

 

Now the corroded areas will still look rough and pitted but it should look better than the active corrosion and will help stop it from getting any worse."

 

Yeah cola very acidic and I know it would and could be bad, I do have a lot of roses in my yard so a thorn for a dental pick easy to come buy, I have heard of the distilled water and olive oil, but have never tried it! I think your saying it is possible to clean it, without it being considered "cleaned"? I think that is what your trying to get across to me, but is that what a lil luck and TLC could Do? Clean it without being cleaned? If that makes sence? Thank you for all the help and advice to try to save this lil peice of history, If the coin wasn't so fine n detailed and already poor CONDITION, I wouldn't mind as much, but with its still VF condition it's worth the effort! Anyway I will get right on it before it builds thicker or attaches more, I'm going to start with distilled water and frequently check it, try to undo enviro damage without doing More! Thank you very much for your help, I will keep you posted and post pics as well on progress or lack of lol, guess its off to the ICU for this wounded eagle, Sincerely, Capone1929