Coin Hyperbole or Actual Rarity

[rockhobby]

As some of you may know I am on a quest for fullstep Jefferson Nickels. There is one issue in particular that is vexing to me; it is the 1950D in MS67 5FS. The prices for this particular grade in FS are astronomical.

 

I really don't know why this is so. There are plenty available from the two top tier grading services (15 by NGC and 16 by PCGS). It amazes me that this particular coin, in this grade consistantly is bid over a $1,000. From what I can see this is absolutely asinine.

 

Are the collectors of today paying for the mistakes made by the collectors of yesteryear when these coins were selling for $400 to $800 a roll. To my way of thinking this is all based on Hype.

 

 

 

Doug

[michael]

a 1950 p pcgs ms67 5 FS just went up in the pcgs price guide to 6750.00

 

I believe pop 6 at pcgs and they recently have sold for 5k in auction

 

so the 50-d pcgs ms67 fs pop 16 you state for pcgs seems reasonable

at around 1000.00

 

I think you need to seek out raw coins and submit to pcgs and make your own

 

well I think there is huge demand from pcgs collector registry set players and as long as there is greater demand from more than 16+ people for pcgs coins the demand will increase but time will tell

 

no no mistakes were made it is that they are paying for pcgs plastic and registry set fever the key word here is pcgs

 

and this is a good thing as long as the coin is worth just as much out of the holder as in the holder

 

if you break the coin out of the holder and it worth less than let the buyer beware

 

and have fun with your coins!

 

 

[World Colonial]

As some of you may know I am on a quest for fullstep Jefferson Nickels. There is one issue in particular that is vexing to me; it is the 1950D in MS67 5FS. The prices for this particular grade in FS are astronomical.

 

I really don't know why this is so. There are plenty available from the two top tier grading services (15 by NGC and 16 by PCGS). It amazes me that this particular coin, in this grade consistantly is bid over a $1,000. From what I can see this is absolutely asinine.

 

Are the collectors of today paying for the mistakes made by the collectors of yesteryear when these coins were selling for $400 to $800 a roll. To my way of thinking this is all based on Hype.

 

 

 

Doug

 

If you think the prices you see are absurd, they are much lower than I recall. I previously profiled this coin in a prior post when I believe the PCGS pop was 6 and the price was over $17,000 while the MS-66 FS with a count over 500 had a price of about $115. Both prices were from Heritage. So yes, since there isn't a dime's worth of difference between these two grades, it is all hype and plastic buying.

 

I agree with Michael it is predominantly (if not entirely) registry set buying. Like many other (primarily) US coins, many buyers also apparently mostly don't consider or are not aware of what else the same money can buy elsewhere.

[RWB]

More like mental illness.

 

PS: My hourly office rate is a modest $400. On-site rates for corporate executive sessions are $1,000/hr + expenses.

[MarkFeld]

As some of you may know I am on a quest for fullstep Jefferson Nickels. There is one issue in particular that is vexing to me; it is the 1950D in MS67 5FS. The prices for this particular grade in FS are astronomical.

 

I really don't know why this is so. There are plenty available from the two top tier grading services (15 by NGC and 16 by PCGS). It amazes me that this particular coin, in this grade consistantly is bid over a $1,000. From what I can see this is absolutely asinine.

 

Are the collectors of today paying for the mistakes made by the collectors of yesteryear when these coins were selling for $400 to $800 a roll. To my way of thinking this is all based on Hype.

 

 

 

Doug

 

So the combined population between PCGS and NGC is 31 pieces and you think a price in excess of $1000 is "asinine"? It sounds as if you have tunnel vision, as there are a great many coins with greater populations that sell for a lot more than that.

 

Also, the price of rolls (which typically contain much lower quality examples) is largely irrelevant.

[dadams]

The 50-D is a pretty common coin in Mint State and Full Steppers are not scarce either. While prices realized aren't hyperbole those price guides probably are. I agree with Michael, much has to do with plastic and registry. Also if you check auction records many of the higher dollar coins are toned which has to play some part.

 

I'm quite happy with my 1950-D NGC MS66 5FS that I paid 63.27 for. In or out of the holder that's probably close to what it's worth.

 

FWIW take a gamble and buy up a bunch of 66 FS' crack em out and submit.

[rockhobby]

Hi Mark,

 

I will respond as best I can to each of the points you made.

 

So the combined population between PCGS and NGC is 31 pieces and you think a price in excess of $1000 is "asinine"? It sounds as if you have tunnel vision, as there are a great many coins with greater populations that sell for a lot more than that.

 

I agree with that point but the crux of the matter is; Is the 1950D MS67 FS Jefferson Nickel worth the high prices that it commands? We are not talking about other coins here. I am talking about one specific series, mintmark, grade, and descriptor within that series. I maintain that it does not based on the following:

 

1. Current populations in MS66 FS are NGC - 288, PCGS - 587. These are sold on a regular basis for approx. $100 . Out of these 875 coins would it be reasonable to suggest that maybe 3% would upgrade to MS67 FS equating to an additional 26 coins. Maybe....

2. The diference between an MS66 coin and an MS67 coin are minute. Are they worth a minimum of 10x the cost of an MS66, to me, the answer is no.

3. I happen to believe that a large portion of this cost is based on the perception of the 1950D as the keydate within the Jefferson Nickel series. I really don't know if most collecters realize that out of all the years the Jefferson has been minted the 1950D stands out as the one that experienced the most hoarding by collectors and non collectors alike.

4. Based on the amount of OBW's (original bankwrapped rolls) still available and collections of Jeffersons put together in the 50's and 60's it is reasonable to extrapolate that there are still quite a few MS67 FS out there in "the wild" so to speak. What that number is, is anyone's guess. If there are it would dramatically affect future prices.

5. IMHO the registry is partly to blame for the cost. Bidiots with more money than sense drive the prices of these coins through the roof. Personally I participate in the registry but will never have a number one set. I use it as a showcase to display my coins only. I prefer to buy OBW rolls that my granddaughter and I can go through on a rainy day and we also look for undesignated FS coins on various auction sites.

 

Also, the price of rolls (which typically contain much lower quality examples) is largely irrelevant

 

I disagree with this statement. I feel that this validates part of my query. They had to pass the cost on and we are still feeling its impact today (again for the 1950D MS67 FS Jefferson Nickel only).

 

Thanks for your reply,

 

Doug

 

[rockhobby]

Hi dadums,

 

I am quite happy with my MS66 6FS coin also. I was just postulating as to why they were so expensive. The color I understand but if you go back through auction records you will see that a high percentage are white or off white.

 

 

Doug

[MarkFeld]

Hi Mark,

 

I will respond as best I can to each of the points you made.

 

So the combined population between PCGS and NGC is 31 pieces and you think a price in excess of $1000 is "asinine"? It sounds as if you have tunnel vision, as there are a great many coins with greater populations that sell for a lot more than that.

 

I agree with that point but the crux of the matter is; Is the 1950D MS67 FS Jefferson Nickel worth the high prices that it commands? We are not talking about other coins here. I am talking about one specific series, mintmark, grade, and descriptor within that series. I maintain that it does not based on the following:

 

1. Current populations in MS66 FS are NGC - 288, PCGS - 587. These are sold on a regular basis for approx. $100 . Out of these 875 coins would it be reasonable to suggest that maybe 3% would upgrade to MS67 FS equating to an additional 26 coins. Maybe....

2. The diference between an MS66 coin and an MS67 coin are minute. Are they worth a minimum of 10x the cost of an MS66, to me, the answer is no.

3. I happen to believe that a large portion of this cost is based on the perception of the 1950D as the keydate within the Jefferson Nickel series. I really don't know if most collecters realize that out of all the years the Jefferson has been minted the 1950D stands out as the one that experienced the most hoarding by collectors and non collectors alike.

4. Based on the amount of OBW's (original bankwrapped rolls) still available and collections of Jeffersons put together in the 50's and 60's it is reasonable to extrapolate that there are still quite a few MS67 FS out there in "the wild" so to speak. What that number is, is anyone's guess. If there are it would dramatically affect future prices.

5. IMHO the registry is partly to blame for the cost. Bidiots with more money than sense drive the prices of these coins through the roof. Personally I participate in the registry but will never have a number one set. I use it as a showcase to display my coins only. I prefer to buy OBW rolls that my granddaughter and I can go through on a rainy day and we also look for undesignated FS coins on various auction sites.

 

Also, the price of rolls (which typically contain much lower quality examples) is largely irrelevant

 

I disagree with this statement. I feel that this validates part of my query. They had to pass the cost on and we are still feeling its impact today (again for the 1950D MS67 FS Jefferson Nickel only).

 

Thanks for your reply,

 

Doug

 

Doug, thanks for your reply.

 

While I agree with much of your reasoning, I am still of the opinion that the same arguments could be made against many other coins, as well. It is the nature of the the rare coin market. You just happen to be focusing on a single issue which which you're familiar. That said, I suppose that's what most of us do.

[thebeav]

I think you need to seek out raw coins and submit to pcgs and make your own

 

Michael figured it all out for you.....You buy rolls, cherry pick them, sell the rolls....repeat.....

 

Paul