What would you look for in an indian gold piece?

[bsshog40]

So I'm looking at some $2.50 indian gold pieces. Looking at about MS62 in an NGC slab. Besides the 1911D, what are some good dates and prices to look for. I was looking at a 1913 MS62 that looked pretty nice with no spots. Price is $485. Any opinions and help would be appreciated. Btw, I know I can get a1925 and up date for a little cheaper, but was looking at 1915 and below. Thanks!

Bobby

[coinman_23885]

My advice is to look for a premium quality piece. Generic gold is dead right now, so you can be very fussy and have your cake/eat it too. Look around.

[bsshog40]

My advice is to look for a premium quality piece. Generic gold is dead right now, so you can be very fussy and have your cake/eat it too. Look around.

What do you consider premium quality? I forgot to mention that the $485 price tag is still a little over my budget but was going to stretch for it if it was worth it. I can get 1928's and 1929's all day for $400 but was looking at a better date for the money.

[Stephon-migration]

I would go for a MS63 Indian Head $2.50 that are 1920s dates because for a little more money or the same amount or even slightly less money depending on the date and seller, you can get a lot better quality. Good quality Indian Head $2.50 and $5 gold pieces are a pain to find. When it comes to gold coins, it is my opinion that the quality of the coin matters more than the date.

[coinman_23885]

My advice is to look for a premium quality piece. Generic gold is dead right now, so you can be very fussy and have your cake/eat it too. Look around.

What do you consider premium quality? I forgot to mention that the $485 price tag is still a little over my budget but was going to stretch for it if it was worth it. I can get 1928's and 1929's all day for $400 but was looking at a better date for the money.

 

PQ = very high end for the grade or solid for the grade but very eye appealing with some unusually nice quality about it (luster, etc.). I am not following this series very closely, but $485 for a 1913 sounds expensive; the PCGS Price Guide Value is around $425, and my experience is that generic gold is dead. I think I would wait and look around. Also, if you are interested in the coin from an investment standpoint, you are better to save up for a little while and purchase a higher graded piece which will likely have more demand than a MS62 in the future. Hopefully someone who has followed this series in MS62 will chime in.

[bsshog40]

Both price guides are different for this specific coin. Pcgs shows $425 while Ngc shows $650. That last HA auctions have gone from about $418-$489.

[RWB]

Go for better condition and fully detailed coins. Most $2.50s of the Pratt design were used during holiday periods and are slightly circulated despite what plastic holders claim. Sometimes it's just a trace due to counting by banks and subtreasuries as the coins were deposited by merchants....but it's there.

 

Just a suggestion.

[Walkerfan]

My advice is to look for a premium quality piece. Generic gold is dead right now, so you can be very fussy and have your cake/eat it too. Look around.

What do you consider premium quality? I forgot to mention that the $485 price tag is still a little over my budget but was going to stretch for it if it was worth it. I can get 1928's and 1929's all day for $400 but was looking at a better date for the money.

 

PQ = very high end for the grade or solid for the grade but very eye appealing with some unusually nice quality about it (luster, etc.). I am not following this series very closely, but $485 for a 1913 sounds expensive; the PCGS Price Guide Value is around $425, and my experience is that generic gold is dead. I think I would wait and look around. Also, if you are interested in the coin from an investment standpoint, you are better to save up for a little while and purchase a higher graded piece which will likely have more demand than a MS62 in the future. Hopefully someone who has followed this series in MS62 will chime in.

 

I agree with Kenny-----I think that 485 is a bit high for a MS 62.

 

Also, I wouldn't buy one that grades below MS 63. Choice examples are much better from an investment standpoint and are still relatively affordable.

 

I would look for one with good luster and clean, smooth surfaces.

 

I like the idea of an NGC slab----maybe a 1908, 1913 or 1915 for around 750-850.

 

They are not my series but that's JMHO.

[coinman_23885]

Both price guides are different for this specific coin. Pcgs shows $425 while Ngc shows $650. That last HA auctions have gone from about $418-$489.

 

That's what I am saying - I wouldn't pay at the higher end of the spread in this market for an average example. I would look around. If you are looking for long term resale, then a higher grade might also be worth checking into (even if it requires you to save for a while).

[Stephon-migration]

Go for better condition and fully detailed coins. Most $2.50s of the Pratt design were used during holiday periods and are slightly circulated despite what plastic holders claim. Sometimes it's just a trace due to counting by banks and subtreasuries as the coins were deposited by merchants....but it's there.

 

Just a suggestion.

 

I always thought that the sunken relief of the design better protected the Indian Head design from wear for some reason.

[Stephon-migration]

Both price guides are different for this specific coin. Pcgs shows $425 while Ngc shows $650. That last HA auctions have gone from about $418-$489.

 

That's what I am saying - I wouldn't pay at the higher end of the spread in this market for an average example. I would look around. If you are looking for long term resale, then a higher grade might also be worth checking into (even if it requires you to save for a while).

 

In terms of buying higher end coins as an investment for potential resale, I would not even bother with Indian Head $2.50 coins, I would instead go for Saint Gaudens $20 as there are many more of those that exist in higher grades and are relatively affordable through the MS66 grade on the most common dates and are very much renowned as investment pieces. However, he would have to save up for one of those.

[Afterword]

Save your money. When the right coin comes along, you will know.

[bsshog40]

Thanks guys. Looking at MS63 puts me in the $600 range while MS62 puts me closer to the $500 range. The $500 is actually over budget for me. What I have now was a small bonus from work, after that, bills take precedence and they never seem to stop long enough to put money up for something bigger and better. I'm not wanting one for resale, just an addition to my collection. I also don't want to buy one that would depreciate, but would at least hold it's present value. I sincerely understand the reasoning behind everyone's points. I just know by my own experience that the money will dwindle away to other things that pop up at home. I was hoping to find something soon while I have the chance to get one. I also don't want to jump on the first auction that hits my eyes so this is why I'm here first.

[bsshog40]

Both price guides are different for this specific coin. Pcgs shows $425 while Ngc shows $650. That last HA auctions have gone from about $418-$489.

 

That's what I am saying - I wouldn't pay at the higher end of the spread in this market for an average example. I would look around. If you are looking for long term resale, then a higher grade might also be worth checking into (even if it requires you to save for a while).

 

In terms of buying higher end coins as an investment for potential resale, I would not even bother with Indian Head $2.50 coins, I would instead go for Saint Gaudens $20 as there are many more of those that exist in higher grades and are relatively affordable through the MS66 grade on the most common dates and are very much renowned as investment pieces. However, he would have to save up for one of those.

My interest in the indian head gold is purely personal for me. I'm really not interested in sole value as I am to have just one of these in my collection. Being part indian is basically my only reason for wanting one.

[BillJones]

This copied from what I said ATS.

 

To this I would add, auction results don't mean that much without seeing the coin. Sometimes the coins that went for the lowest prices were marginal for the grade. You have to match the coin with the price, and that takes some time spent at the shows.

 

My grade of choice for these coins would be MS-64. I would rather have few very carefully selected MS-64 graded pieces that larger quantities of well selected MS-62 graded coins. The trouble with MS-62 graded coins is that they fall into a less than well tread path. There are prices in the many catalogs for MS-63, 64 and 65 graded coins, but the MS-62 coins tend it get lumped with their less desirable MS-60 and 61 graded sisters. To me it's better to form the collection slowly that to try to fill a bunch of holes all at once.

 

Still there are some good values in MS-62 graded coins, but you have to go to a big show and select them; you can't do it with photos; or you have to have a dealer who is really looking out for you to buy them without a personal inspection.

 

The second most expensive coin in the set in the better grades is the 1914, but that coin how has a Gray Sheet bid of $1,755 in MS-62, which places it beyond the reach of your stated budget. The 1914-D is also higher than your budget.

 

Although you say that you don't want the 1925-D to 1929 coins, those are the dates that best fit in with your budget. I'm just saying this as a reminder.

 

As for what to avoid, I'd advise you this way.

 

• Stay away from coins with spots. I don't care about light copper stains that are not in the focal areas of the design, but too many collectors do. DEFINELY stay away from any coins with dark distracting spots. It does not matter what the grade is, if the coin has any significant dark brown or blue to black spots, avoid it. These coins are very hard to re-sell.

 

• Stay away from scratched coins and pieces with rim nicks. Nice coins are available so there is no need by coins with even minor problems.

 

I really like this 1908 quarter which is in a PCGS MS-64 holder because the color and preservation. If I could for a entire collection that looked like this, I'd so it. The only drawback to the 1908 as a date is that the eagle on the reverse does lacks feather detail on the shoulder (upper wing). This was due to defect in the dies, which was corrected in all of the later years.

 

 

And to wet you appetite for something really nice, here is a 1925-D in MS-65.

 

[bsshog40]

This copied from what I said ATS.

 

To this I would add, auction results don't mean that much without seeing the coin. Sometimes the coins that went for the lowest prices were marginal for the grade. You have to match the coin with the price, and that takes some time spent at the shows.

 

My grade of choice for these coins would be MS-64. I would rather have few very carefully selected MS-64 graded pieces that larger quantities of well selected MS-62 graded coins. The trouble with MS-62 graded coins is that they fall into a less than well tread path. There are prices in the many catalogs for MS-63, 64 and 65 graded coins, but the MS-62 coins tend it get lumped with their less desirable MS-60 and 61 graded sisters. To me it's better to form the collection slowly that to try to fill a bunch of holes all at once.

 

Still there are some good values in MS-62 graded coins, but you have to go to a big show and select them; you can't do it with photos; or you have to have a dealer who is really looking out for you to buy them without a personal inspection.

 

The second most expensive coin in the set in the better grades is the 1914, but that coin how has a Gray Sheet bid of $1,755 in MS-62, which places it beyond the reach of your stated budget. The 1914-D is also higher than your budget.

 

Although you say that you don't want the 1925-D to 1929 coins, those are the dates that best fit in with your budget. I'm just saying this as a reminder.

 

As for what to avoid, I'd advise you this way.

 

• Stay away from coins with spots. I don't care about light copper stains that are not in the focal areas of the design, but too many collectors do. DEFINELY stay away from any coins with dark distracting spots. It does not matter what the grade is, if the coin has any significant dark brown or blue to black spots, avoid it. These coins are very hard to re-sell.

 

• Stay away from scratched coins and pieces with rim nicks. Nice coins are available so there is no need by coins with even minor problems.

 

I really like this 1908 quarter which is in a PCGS MS-64 holder because the color and preservation. If I could for a entire collection that looked like this, I'd so it. The only drawback to the 1908 as a date is that the eagle on the reverse does lacks feather detail on the shoulder (upper wing). This was due to defect in the dies, which was corrected in all of the later years.

 

 

And to wet you appetite for something really nice, here is a 1925-D in MS-65.

 

 

This copied from what I replied.

 

Very nice examples Bill. Anything over MS62 is over my budget. I wish I could say I could save for one but life always seems to get in the way. My small work bonus sets at about $450 and I was going to add about another $50 to get a decent indian. This is not for resale but just a gold coin that I've always wanted in my collection. My heart is set on an indian gold also. Not interested in anything else.

[RWB]

What you are saying is that your budget is $450.00.

 

Your task is to find the best possible coin for that amount of money --- not to find a so-called "MS-62" coin. Please, get the plastic grading stuff out of your mind and focus on the important part: the best for your budget.

[bsshog40]

What you are saying is that your budget is $450.00.

 

Your task is to find the best possible coin for that amount of money --- not to find a so-called "MS-62" coin. Please, get the plastic grading stuff out of your mind and focus on the important part: the best for your budget.

More explanation please Roger. I don't want a raw coin, to much chance to get a bad piece from pictures. So what do you think is best for my budget? I have at least been looking for any carbon spots or distracting marks. I know it's a very small piece also and what AU coins I've been seeing are pretty scratched up.

[rrantique]

Bobby I think what Roger is saying is that for $450 a very nice raw coin can be obtained. There will be or should be a coin show toward the end of the month at convention center in Bossier City. That one should have what your looking for. Remember always one with eye appeal and good strike. (thumbs u

 

(Public) ArkLaTex Annual Coin Show (by rrantique)

Time: July 24, 2009 to July 26, 2009

Location: Bossier City Covention Center

Street: 620 Benton Road

City/Town: Shreveport-Bossier City, Louisiana

Event Type: coin, show

Organized By: Shreveport Coin Club-

 

[BillJones]

What you are saying is that your budget is $450.00.

 

Your task is to find the best possible coin for that amount of money --- not to find a so-called "MS-62" coin. Please, get the plastic grading stuff out of your mind and focus on the important part: the best for your budget.

 

I have to disagree, Roger. Gold is one of those areas where novice collectors can get stuck with a counterfeit, and sadly in this day age, counterfeits are out there. Although I have seen more counterfeit $5 Indians than $2.50 Indians, counterfeits are still a concern. And many counterfeits, by definition are "Uncirculated."

 

Also many coins that are not in PCGS or NGC plastic are not certified for a reason, and that reason usually is not in the best interest of the collector.

[Stephon-migration]

What you are saying is that your budget is $450.00.

 

Your task is to find the best possible coin for that amount of money --- not to find a so-called "MS-62" coin. Please, get the plastic grading stuff out of your mind and focus on the important part: the best for your budget.

More explanation please Roger. I don't want a raw coin, to much chance to get a bad piece from pictures. So what do you think is best for my budget? I have at least been looking for any carbon spots or distracting marks. I know it's a very small piece also and what AU coins I've been seeing are pretty scratched up.

 

The best possible coin would be a 1920s dated MS63 as those tend to be cheaper than the earlier dates depending on the seller.

 

If you want MS 62, mintproducts.com has coins that are BELOW your price range at the MS 62 level compared to a better quality MS 63

 

http://www.mintproducts.com/2.50-indian-gold-coin-certified-ms-62.html

 

This is just to show what MS 62 would really set you back and how easy a coin at the MS 62 level is to obtain

 

[bsshog40]

Bobby I think what Roger is saying is that for $450 a very nice raw coin can be obtained. There will be or should be a coin show toward the end of the month at convention center in Bossier City. That one should have what your looking for. Remember always one with eye appeal and good strike. (thumbs u

Thanks Irvin. I prefer a slabbed one. I would like one already slabbed just to put in my collection. I don't want my wife or whoever having to deal with a raw gold coin after I'm gone.

I would love to go to the show. I will have to see what my schedule is. Work has been keeping me out of town a lot lately.

[coinman_23885]

Bobby I think what Roger is saying is that for $450 a very nice raw coin can be obtained. There will be or should be a coin show toward the end of the month at convention center in Bossier City. That one should have what your looking for. Remember always one with eye appeal and good strike. (thumbs u

Thanks Irvin. I prefer a slabbed one. I would like one already slabbed just to put in my collection. I don't want my wife or whoever having to deal with a raw gold coin after I'm gone.

I would love to go to the show. I will have to see what my schedule is. Work has been keeping me out of town a lot lately.

 

Without examining the specific coin you are looking at, there is lot that we cannot advise you on. Have you considered waiting until an example of the desired date/MM and grade comes up to Heritage and having Mark Feld look at it for you? That way, you would have someone with a lot of experience with gold looking at the piece for you.

[bsshog40]

Bobby I think what Roger is saying is that for $450 a very nice raw coin can be obtained. There will be or should be a coin show toward the end of the month at convention center in Bossier City. That one should have what your looking for. Remember always one with eye appeal and good strike. (thumbs u

Thanks Irvin. I prefer a slabbed one. I would like one already slabbed just to put in my collection. I don't want my wife or whoever having to deal with a raw gold coin after I'm gone.

I would love to go to the show. I will have to see what my schedule is. Work has been keeping me out of town a lot lately.

 

Without examining the specific coin you are looking at, there is lot that we cannot advise you on. Have you considered waiting until an example of the desired date/MM and grade comes up to Heritage and having Mark Feld look at it for you? That way, you would have someone with a lot of experience with gold looking at the piece for you.

I hear ya Kenny. I am also being very realistic here that I can't expect and eye popping coin for my budget. I don't want an ugly one but as I stated, just a nice one for my collection. I'm hoping posting here and ats may also bring out someone that knows of a nice one or has a nice one that would fit my budget.

[Stephon-migration]

Bobby I think what Roger is saying is that for $450 a very nice raw coin can be obtained. There will be or should be a coin show toward the end of the month at convention center in Bossier City. That one should have what your looking for. Remember always one with eye appeal and good strike. (thumbs u

Thanks Irvin. I prefer a slabbed one. I would like one already slabbed just to put in my collection. I don't want my wife or whoever having to deal with a raw gold coin after I'm gone.

I would love to go to the show. I will have to see what my schedule is. Work has been keeping me out of town a lot lately.

 

Without examining the specific coin you are looking at, there is lot that we cannot advise you on. Have you considered waiting until an example of the desired date/MM and grade comes up to Heritage and having Mark Feld look at it for you? That way, you would have someone with a lot of experience with gold looking at the piece for you.

I hear ya Kenny. I am also being very realistic here that I can't expect and eye popping coin for my budget. I don't want an ugly one but as I stated, just a nice one for my collection. I'm hoping posting here and ats may also bring out someone that knows of a nice one or has a nice one that would fit my budget.

 

The easiest gold coin to find in high grades and in eye popping states are the Saint Gaudens $20 coins. The indian head $5 and $2.50 are the hardest to find in eye popping states and high grades. The fields are the highest points of the coin and makes the coins very vulnerable to bag marks.

[bsshog40]

Bobby I think what Roger is saying is that for $450 a very nice raw coin can be obtained. There will be or should be a coin show toward the end of the month at convention center in Bossier City. That one should have what your looking for. Remember always one with eye appeal and good strike. (thumbs u

Thanks Irvin. I prefer a slabbed one. I would like one already slabbed just to put in my collection. I don't want my wife or whoever having to deal with a raw gold coin after I'm gone.

I would love to go to the show. I will have to see what my schedule is. Work has been keeping me out of town a lot lately.

 

Without examining the specific coin you are looking at, there is lot that we cannot advise you on. Have you considered waiting until an example of the desired date/MM and grade comes up to Heritage and having Mark Feld look at it for you? That way, you would have someone with a lot of experience with gold looking at the piece for you.

I hear ya Kenny. I am also being very realistic here that I can't expect and eye popping coin for my budget. I don't want an ugly one but as I stated, just a nice one for my collection. I'm hoping posting here and ats may also bring out someone that knows of a nice one or has a nice one that would fit my budget.

 

The easiest gold coin to find in high grades and in eye popping states are the Saint Gaudens $20 coins. The indian head $5 and $2.50 are the hardest to find in eye popping states and high grades. The fields are the highest points of the coin and makes the coins very vulnerable to bag marks.

You are correct but as I stated, the indian is a personal preference of mine that I just want one decent example of for my collection.

[Stephon-migration]

You are correct but as I stated, the indian is a personal preference of mine that I just want one decent example of for my collection.

 

I understand, I was just addressing gold coins generally.

[bsshog40]

This MS61 doesn't look bad to me. What do ya'll think? It looks better than some 62's I was looking at with my unknowledgeable eye.

[RWB]

I was not saying that one should necessarily buy a "raw" coin or an authenticated one. My point is that the OP seems trapped in the "MS-62" number - which of itself is meaningless. (Put your hand over the number junk on any slabbed coin - judge only the coin. There are beautiful pieces available for the same price as garbage.)

 

He will have to invest more time than money. But to stick with his budget, he should buy the best looking (not "numerical") that he can locate. Time and weak demand of this design type work in his favor.

 

(PS: Indian quarter and half eagles have been extensively counterfeited including many with full gold content and correct dimensions. Authentication is almost mandatory.)

[jom]

I'd suggest making an effort to save your money and try to buy the best one you can find. I'd look for pieces with good luster. Often these pieces lack this attribute and I find those coins a bit ugly...my opinion only of course. The coin you posted in the 61 holder looks rather dull to me. But I guess you have to decide what it is you want.

 

These are not rare coins so just take your time to look at a LOT of them before you pull the trigger. They are not really all that hard to find....

 

jom