Another sticker startup -- PQ

[Mark T]

OK...here's the future.

 

There will be a hologram service where you send in your super slabbed coin and they will make you a 3D holographic image of the coin that will be able to be projected by your super duper smart cell phone. (think Star Wars chess game) This same company will also vault your coin in an impenetrable safe and you will still be able to sell the image and the ownership of the coin to another buyer via a finger print transfer.

 

As crazy as this sounds it is not that far fetched.

[Mark T]

I am and have always been a supporter of CAC , personally I don’t care about the other stickers or these new companies that are now popping up. CAC is John A – that is all I need. All my coins have either been approved or rejected by CAC. The raw coins I submitted that got the Green Bean will most likely get me a premium when I sell them for the simple reason that they have the sticker. I must add that my CAC coins are truely PQ and would probably get some premium without the sticker. The CAC sticker confirms it for me and someone buying sight unseen. Ok I am guilty of being a capitalist , I want to maximize profits when I decide to sell them.

[TonerGuy]

Brandon Kelley has his own sticker as well... its in its infancy and only pertains to the toning.

 

Oh this should be interesting... any info on when this may launch ?

[BillJones]

I am and have always been a supporter of CAC , personally I don’t care about the other stickers or these new companies that are now popping up. CAC is John A – that is all I need. All my coins have either been approved or rejected by CAC. The raw coins I submitted that got the Green Bean will most likely get me a premium when I sell them for the simple reason that they have the sticker. I must add that my CAC coins are truely PQ and would probably get some premium without the sticker. The CAC sticker confirms it for me and someone buying sight unseen. Ok I am guilty of being a capitalist , I want to maximize profits when I decide to sell them.

 

Sorry, but I am not comfortable with one man having that much power over the coin market. He is not infallible, and he is not perfect as we have seen from posts here in the past.

[mommam17]

You said he made a mistake on one of your coins, but didn't you go back to him for his opinion on a major purchase, Bill??

[jom]

I am and have always been a supporter of CAC , personally I don’t care about the other stickers or these new companies that are now popping up. CAC is John A – that is all I need. All my coins have either been approved or rejected by CAC. The raw coins I submitted that got the Green Bean will most likely get me a premium when I sell them for the simple reason that they have the sticker. I must add that my CAC coins are truely PQ and would probably get some premium without the sticker. The CAC sticker confirms it for me and someone buying sight unseen. Ok I am guilty of being a capitalist , I want to maximize profits when I decide to sell them.

 

"that is all I need"? Some could say that the original slab was "all they needed".

 

Who's going to sticker the sticker?

 

jom

[zboyle04]

I'm considering opening up a new service called CSS or Certified Sticker Service that verifies all the stickers stuck on slabs, so you know the stickers that are stuck there are indeed authentic. Soon there will be a start-up company just to verify CSS stickers...and the game goes on.

 

I think it would be really funny to get one coin in a slab, and send it to all of the stickering services. I want ALL the stickers on one slab.

 

yes and also make it a coin that has a ton of designations like + and * and even PL, FT or FB

 

i have a MS66+* war nickel that would look great with 5 stickers on its slab hahahahaha

[BillJones]

You said he made a mistake on one of your coins, but didn't you go back to him for his opinion on a major purchase, Bill??

 

Yes, I publicly complained about the grading and CAC endorsement of the piece, and John bought it from me at the price paid. That was much to his and the CAC organization's credit. My point is that there so many people who relay on the CAC - PCGS combination that thing that does not have those endorsements is a second or third class coin in their eyes. That second class status extends to the NGC - CAC combination as well.

 

I do not think that ONE sticker should have that much power. The CAC people condemn me for that opinion, that is my position. Monopoly power usually does not work out to best interests of consumers.

[Tradedollarnut]

The CAC condemn me for that opinion, that is my position. Monopoly power usually does not work out to best interests of consumers.

 

1) who at CAC condemns you for your opinion? I have never seen such.

 

2) some would say that CAC prevents the TPG's from having monopoly power and thus aids the consumers.

[mommam17]

Coins that were certified over 25 years ago and since, are now getting looked at by John Albanese. He looks at coin and decides, nice coin or not? If he likes it he'll probably have a buy price for it. His power comes from his integrity, knowledge of coins and the people's respect for his opinion.

[MarkFeld]

Coins that were certified over 25 years ago and since, are now getting looked at by John Albanese. He looks at coin and decides, nice coin or not? If he likes it he'll probably have a buy price for it. His power comes from his integrity, knowledge of coins and the people's respect for his opinion.

 

As well as backing up his opinion with generally strong buy prices.

[BillJones]

1) who at CAC condemns you for your opinion? I have never seen such.

 

People have jumped on me in the past to point where John Albanese has contacted to me to apologize for their behavior. I'm not going to start naming names because that will just deteriorate into something ugly. But as Casey Stengel often said, "You can look it up."

[mommam17]

That's the kind of man John is. He apologized to a man that wanted his business to fail right from the beginning.

[toneddollars]

Brandon Kelley has his own sticker as well... its in its infancy and only pertains to the toning.

 

Oh this should be interesting... any info on when this may launch ?

 

If I'm not mistaken, it is up and running now.

[Hard Times]

That's the kind of man John is. He apologized to a man that wanted his business to fail right from the beginning.

 

When did Bill Jones make the statement that he wanted JA's buisness to fail? If he never said that, I think you are putting words into his mouth?

 

Best, HT

[Mark T]

I am and have always been a supporter of CAC , personally I don’t care about the other stickers or these new companies that are now popping up. CAC is John A – that is all I need. All my coins have either been approved or rejected by CAC. The raw coins I submitted that got the Green Bean will most likely get me a premium when I sell them for the simple reason that they have the sticker. I must add that my CAC coins are truely PQ and would probably get some premium without the sticker. The CAC sticker confirms it for me and someone buying sight unseen. Ok I am guilty of being a capitalist , I want to maximize profits when I decide to sell them.

 

"that is all I need"? Some could say that the original slab was "all they needed".

 

Who's going to sticker the sticker?

 

jom

 

 

The coin was certified by professional’s at NGC or PCGS , CAC certifies the coin as it meets their standards. That is all I need considering that I already like the coin All these other services will turn into overkill.

 

 

[World Colonial]

I hope these stickers never end up on world coin slabs.

 

Did someone mention Wings?

 

http://wingscoins.com/

 

I take it from your comment that you haven't seen many world coins stickered by Wings. I've just recently started looking at world coins and have yet to see a sticker myself, but I don't have the experience that you do in this area.

 

I have never heard of Wings, not until this thread. Given that the vast majority of non-US collectors could not care less about TPG today, I suspect that they will care even less about these stickers. It will only matter to those in the US if at all.

 

I did see NGC's announcement that they have added the "+" designation for world coins but I do not see that most non-US collectors will care about that either, not in the sense where they will pay what can only charitably be called astronomical premiums in many instances for trivial differences in actual quality.

 

I know that those here find this normal because they are used to it, but I find the whole practice completely ridiculous and absurd. It makes sense for US coins because of their current value, but then, the price differences between many grades and between CAC and non-CAC coins are also absurd given the actual differences in quality in many instances. There isn't a dime's worth of substantive difference between many of these coins.

 

Try explaining this whole concept to non-collectors and see if you can get their real opinions. Same goes for the majority of non-US collectors.

 

You're obviously entitled to your opinions regarding differences (or not) in grades and/or values. But you don't bolster your point by saying things like "Try explaining this whole concept to non-collectors and see if you can get their real opinions. Same goes for the majority of non-US collectors". I can't imagine what difference it might make to elicit and receive opinions from non-collectors.

 

You and I have disagreed in the past, we apparently disagree now and I'm sure we will disagree many times in the future. If you want to pretend that these differences are significant, then go ahead and do so.

 

As for that last part of my comments, I was using it as a reality check. Like many other long time US collectors, apparently you are so used to this type of thinking that you do not even see it.

[Mark T]

I am and have always been a supporter of CAC , personally I don’t care about the other stickers or these new companies that are now popping up. CAC is John A – that is all I need. All my coins have either been approved or rejected by CAC. The raw coins I submitted that got the Green Bean will most likely get me a premium when I sell them for the simple reason that they have the sticker. I must add that my CAC coins are truely PQ and would probably get some premium without the sticker. The CAC sticker confirms it for me and someone buying sight unseen. Ok I am guilty of being a capitalist , I want to maximize profits when I decide to sell them.

 

Sorry, but I am not comfortable with one man having that much power over the coin market. He is not infallible, and he is not perfect as we have seen from posts here in the past.

 

I never said he was not infallible – find me someone better for a second opinion on a coin that has the respect in this hobby that John has. My comments are based on a very good experience with CAC , they have helped the hobby not hurt it. Bill are you that comfortable with PCGS having the amount of power over the coin market ? Add NGC to the mix , basically they have a market monopoly over the coin grading business.

[MarkFeld]

1) who at CAC condemns you for your opinion? I have never seen such.

 

People have jumped on me in the past to point where John Albanese has contacted to me to apologize for their behavior. I'm not going to start naming names because that will just deteriorate into something ugly. But as Casey Stengel often said, "You can look it up."

 

Perhaps other people have condemned you for your opinion, but I have never heard of CAC having done so, as you stated. And I don't believe they have.

[BillJones]

That's the kind of man John is. He apologized to a man that wanted his business to fail right from the beginning.

 

Yes, I would like to know I said I wanted CAC to fail. I would like to see the NGC - CAC coins do well because it would enhance the image of NGC graded U.S. coins.

 

And, no, I am not comfortable with the power the PCGS - CAC combination has.

[MarkFeld]

I hope these stickers never end up on world coin slabs.

 

Did someone mention Wings?

 

http://wingscoins.com/

 

I take it from your comment that you haven't seen many world coins stickered by Wings. I've just recently started looking at world coins and have yet to see a sticker myself, but I don't have the experience that you do in this area.

 

I have never heard of Wings, not until this thread. Given that the vast majority of non-US collectors could not care less about TPG today, I suspect that they will care even less about these stickers. It will only matter to those in the US if at all.

 

I did see NGC's announcement that they have added the "+" designation for world coins but I do not see that most non-US collectors will care about that either, not in the sense where they will pay what can only charitably be called astronomical premiums in many instances for trivial differences in actual quality.

 

I know that those here find this normal because they are used to it, but I find the whole practice completely ridiculous and absurd. It makes sense for US coins because of their current value, but then, the price differences between many grades and between CAC and non-CAC coins are also absurd given the actual differences in quality in many instances. There isn't a dime's worth of substantive difference between many of these coins.

 

Try explaining this whole concept to non-collectors and see if you can get their real opinions. Same goes for the majority of non-US collectors.

 

You're obviously entitled to your opinions regarding differences (or not) in grades and/or values. But you don't bolster your point by saying things like "Try explaining this whole concept to non-collectors and see if you can get their real opinions. Same goes for the majority of non-US collectors". I can't imagine what difference it might make to elicit and receive opinions from non-collectors.

 

You and I have disagreed in the past, we apparently disagree now and I'm sure we will disagree many times in the future. If you want to pretend that these differences are significant, then go ahead and do so.

 

As for that last part of my comments, I was using it as a reality check. Like many other long time US collectors, apparently you are so used to this type of thinking that you do not even see it.

 

I don't pretend that our differences of opinion are significant. Why are you pretending that I do?

 

And I still don't see any relevance in the opinions of non-collectors, regarding the grading and value of coins. I would say the same about non-art collectors with respect to the significance and/or value or art objects.

[mommam17]

When CAC started you said you wanted them to fail because it was going to cost you so much money to send your coins there. That's the truth.

[Mr.Mcknowitall]

When CAC started you said you wanted them to fail because it was going to cost you so much money to send your coins there. That's the truth.

 

I know you are responding to Mark,but, having been deeply involved in the original discussions on a public forum about the good, the bad, and the ugly about the formation of CAC at the time it was first contemplated and became known, a discussion that continued ad infinitum, with sextrillion Posts, by the end of that discussion, there were maybe 4-5 of us Posters still standing. Not once did Mr. Feld ever use that position in the discussion. He certainly voiced a lot of other positions, none unreasonable, some with logic posit differences between us, but never did he mention wanting the Enterprise to fail because of the reason you state, or actually, for any other reason. In fact, he was, in general, for the Enterprise, and the value of CAC to the collector.

 

This Thread still exists.

 

I am not stating that this may not have been stated to you, but I would certainly be interested in the context of the statement, if he made it.

 

I will also state, from first hand knowledge, that he has personally submitted coins to CAC on behalf of the collector, without being reimbursed, because it would benefit the seller. Even when the seller said it was of no import, and tried to pay for his efforts, he refused reimbursement, because he believed it to be in the interests of the collector, whose wishes were that the coin be preserved as is.

That doesn't equate with a person that would want an Enterprise to fail, much less fail at his own expense.

[MarkFeld]

When CAC started you said you wanted them to fail because it was going to cost you so much money to send your coins there. That's the truth.

 

I know you are responding to Mark,but, having been deeply involved in the original discussions on a public forum about the good, the bad, and the ugly about the formation of CAC at the time it was first contemplated and became known, a discussion that continued ad infinitum, with sextrillion Posts, by the end of that discussion, there were maybe 4-5 of us Posters still standing. Not once did Mr. Feld ever use that position in the discussion. He certainly voiced a lot of other positions, none unreasonable, some with logic posit differences between us, but never did he mention wanting the Enterprise to fail because of the reason you state, or actually, for any other reason. In fact, he was, in general, for the Enterprise, and the value of CAC to the collector.

 

This Thread still exists.

 

I am not stating that this may not have been stated to you, but I would certainly be interested in the context of the statement, if he made it.

 

I will also state, from first hand knowledge, that he has personally submitted coins to CAC on behalf of the collector, without being reimbursed, because it would benefit the seller. Even when the seller said it was of no import, and tried to pay for his efforts, he refused reimbursement, because he believed it to be in the interests of the collector, whose wishes were that the coin be preserved as is.

That doesn't equate with a person that would want an Enterprise to fail, much less fail at his own expense.

 

John, he was responding to Bill Jones, not to me. I do, however, very much appreciate your kind thoughts and words.

[mommam17]

Sorry, that was to Bill. Also, Bill- was it the 1796 Half Dime you sold to John? Thanks.

[Mr.Mcknowitall]

When CAC started you said you wanted them to fail because it was going to cost you so much money to send your coins there. That's the truth.

 

I know you are responding to Mark,but, having been deeply involved in the original discussions on a public forum about the good, the bad, and the ugly about the formation of CAC at the time it was first contemplated and became known, a discussion that continued ad infinitum, with sextrillion Posts, by the end of that discussion, there were maybe 4-5 of us Posters still standing. Not once did Mr. Feld ever use that position in the discussion. He certainly voiced a lot of other positions, none unreasonable, some with logic posit differences between us, but never did he mention wanting the Enterprise to fail because of the reason you state, or actually, for any other reason. In fact, he was, in general, for the Enterprise, and the value of CAC to the collector.

 

This Thread still exists.

 

I am not stating that this may not have been stated to you, but I would certainly be interested in the context of the statement, if he made it.

 

I will also state, from first hand knowledge, that he has personally submitted coins to CAC on behalf of the collector, without being reimbursed, because it would benefit the seller. Even when the seller said it was of no import, and tried to pay for his efforts, he refused reimbursement, because he believed it to be in the interests of the collector, whose wishes were that the coin be preserved as is.

That doesn't equate with a person that would want an Enterprise to fail, much less fail at his own expense.

 

John, he was responding to Bill Jones, not to me. I do, however, very much appreciate your kind thoughts and words.

 

Fine, however, his response was in relation to your Post, or so it shows, at the top.

But (blah, blah) you are welcome, and I am now free to take it all back.

 

I don't know nothing about nothing about Mr. Jones, or what he said or didn't say, except I do know he was not part of the Thread I referred to, unless he is the reincarnation of Pharmer.

[Mr.Mcknowitall]

Sorry, that was to Bill. Also, Bill- was it the 1796 Half Dime you sold to John? Thanks.

 

I see. Thank You.

Then I am free to take back everything I stated about Mr. Feld.

[TonerGuy]

 

If I'm not mistaken, it is up and running now.

 

Is there a website up yet ? Got a link ?

[mumu]

Slabs with unique serial numbers, online databases,online pictures, money back guarantees, and a 3 person grading and certification process were not enough.

 

The community needed STICKERS.

 

One day stickers will not be enough and there will be a checkmark written in permanent marker on the slab.

 

Eventually a grunt of approval will take the hobby where it really needs to be.

[toneddollars]

 

If I'm not mistaken, it is up and running now.

 

Is there a website up yet ? Got a link ?

 

Yes, Brandon has a web site I'll try to find it. I'll post the name but linking it, I am computer challenged