How Does Ngc Graders Evaluate Scarce Jeffersons with FS?

[James G. Berline]

Is there a golden rule the graders go by when examining/judging hard to find scarce dated Jeffersons?

 

Reason being' - I do have and own a 1964-D Jefferson MS66 With designated fullsteps, and Certified by NGC.

 

The Quality of the Strike I've found is really nice, but I've noticed some minor hits/nicks on the Obverse I'm curious about. The Reverse is really in nice

shape considering the year, and have (Imo) nice complete steps go to along

with it. I'm guessing the graders do or might overlook some distractions due

to this rarity having complete steps. (But just how much do they overlook, is

there a cutoff or limit? )

 

Any knowledgable Jefferson Collector that can give me their thoughts on this

would be appreciated.

 

Have a great day! Jim Berline

 

[MarkFeld]

I am not a Jefferson nickel collector. But I seriously doubt that the coin was graded in a more forgiving fashion, due to its scarcity.

[mkman123]

Listen to the guy above, he was a former grader

[dimefreak]

By rule of thumb NGC Jeffersons are usually a grade below PCGS.... Same goes for some other series such as Kennedys and Roosies..... not always...... but most the time...

[mkman123]

buy the coin not the holder. There are PCGS coins that don't seem properly graded and same with NGC ones. Don't fall into the trap of the koolaid monster early on!

 

[dimefreak]

Hah good one Mike.... I keep my coins in PCGS plastic because quite honestly they get more money. But I will buy and crack NGC holders all day long... Modern stuff NGC seems to be more lenient but, I think the grading flip flops for the earlier stuff. I believe NGC is harder on the early stuff.... about equal in between... The point I was trying to make for the OP is that he might be better off comparing his graded coin with other NGC graded coins.... Another thing worth noting is 1964's typically come beat up... They are more lenient on them at NGC (Lehigh taught me that)

[James G. Berline]

 

 

Hey' Thanks to all of you with your thoughts/opinions on this coin. I did

appreciate your feedback on it. There's a couple other Jeff-Specialists

I'll call after this weekend- that I know that are very knowledgeable in

this field also.

I hope each of you enjoy and excel in your collections.

 

Have a great year collecting,,, Jim Berline

[e1cnr]

Jim, you have a nice set - what are you asking?

 

Tell us about your 64-D, is it 5FS or 6FS?

 

My impression is usually it goes the other way than what I think you are asking -> if coin close or 'liner', it gets bumped one or the other but not both

[rockhobby]

Jim,

 

I was looking through the NGC facts on Jeffersons and noticed this;

 

NGC utilizes two designations to reflect the relative degrees of fullness in these steps: 5FS indicates that five of the six steps are complete, while 6FS is a rare designation reserved for those coins displaying six, uninterrupted steps. The presence of full steps on a nickel does not affect its numerical grade at all, and gems can exist both with and without this additional asset

 

Hope this helps.

 

Doug

[WoodenJefferson]

As far as I know and as far as I'm concerned, the 'Full Step' designation is independent of the MS grade of the nickel, in other words you can have a banged up MS-64 but still have FS or a pristine MS-66 where the step count fails to meet the criteria, which is about 90% of the time for pre-1989.

 

There is a significant disparagy between the grading services as to what constitutes FS...I wish they would have a pow-wow and resolve these issues.

[James G. Berline]

Hello e1cnr,

 

I was just curious with seeing light scratches what the graders limit

themselves to when grading these. The step area I really don't see any

distractions there at all. I got this in a trade, got several photos before

trading. I'm looking thru a 10 x 17 mm loupe, so it will pick up just the

slighest scratch. I'm very happy I have it, just wanting to see how graders

think of these. hey' thanks for inquiring, I appreciated it! I'll be putting this

one in my collection soon, so your always welcome to view it then?

 

take care my friend, Jim Berline

[James G. Berline]

 

Hello Doug, thanks for the post, I'll be sure to keep this on hand, it always

comes in handy. take care, Jim

[coinman_23885]

No they are not more lenient. The coin will be graded like the others, except perhaps, a slightly weaker strike may be allowed at gem grades (and I am not referring to weakness in the steps here but in the bust and the rest of Monticello - some examples including the 53-s and 54-s are notorious for weak strikes and I think this in accounted for when considering the numerical grade). This last part is based on observation, and is unscientific; your observations may differ.

[coinman_23885]

By rule of thumb NGC Jeffersons are usually a grade below PCGS.... Same goes for some other series such as Kennedys and Roosies..... not always...... but most the time...

 

Although I don't buy into PCGS is better than NGC or vice versa, there are some major differences in the way that they grade and attribute some series. PCGS is stricter in some series and NGC in others. I would be inclined to agree with you on the Kennedy Half Dollars, Jefferson Nickels, and Roosevelt Dimes; and I would add Lincoln Cents, Washington Quarters, and most moderns to this list as well.

 

With this said, it is important to remember that NGC is also stricter on some of its strike designations. Before April of 2003 (I believe), NGC would only attribute coins as "FS" if they had 6 full steps and not 5. They changed this and now recognize Jefferson nickels as either "5FS" or "6FS." PCGS only requires 5 full steps for the "FS" designation. The same applies for Roosevelt Dimes (PCGS requires only horizontal bands separate for "FB" status whereas NGC requires full vertical and horizontal band separation for "FT" designation) and Franklin Half Dollars (where NGC requires full bell lines at both the upper and lower set of bands whereas PCGS only requires them at the bottom for a "FBL" designation).

 

[lehigh96]

There is no chance that they are being more lenient with respect to surface marks because of the date of the coin. However, NGC has a habit of declaring obvious surface marks to be planchet flaws. Are any of the marks on your 1964-D in the jawline area? Do you have a photo of the coin Jim?

 

I agree that the TPG's will be more lenient with respect to strike on issues that are typically not very well struck. And while the 53-S & 54-S are the worst struck, pretty much anything after 1949 will have an obviously inferior strike to the early Jefferson Nickels.

 

Regarding the TPG differences with this series, it is my experience that NGC is more liberal with the numerical grade of premium gem Jeffersons to the tune of almost an entire point. PCGS is very strict in their application of the MS67 grade and are very reluctant to assign that grade even on coins that are clearly MS67 in at least 3 of the 4 elements of grading. In contrast, PCGS is much more liberal in their application of the full step designation. Pretty much, if you can see a bridge under 5X magnification, NGC will not award the 5FS designation.

[James G. Berline]

 

Hello coinman an Paul' ,, thanks for the infor' guys, the more I study this, I

think, I've been over reacting a lil' . I had a pretty high loupe, so anything and

everything picks up on that,,,lol'

 

I will be putting this in my collection later' for all to see.

 

Thanks again, for all your help. Jim