Is this an Ebay scam?

[Guest]

Take a look at the prices that were just paid for the state quarters, pcgs ms68.

 

Many of the bidders have bid on every auction.

 

What is going on here?

 

3303461359 2002-D LOUISIANA STATE QUARTER PCGS MS68 $500.00 14 Ended --

 

3303462271 1999-P PENNSYLVANIA STATE QUARTER PCGS MS68 $1,200.00 12 Ended --

 

3303463459 2001-D R.I STATE QUARTER PCGS MS68 $635.00 17 Ended --

 

3303464236 2001-D VIRGINIA STATE QUARTER PCGS MS68 $1,200.00 13 Ended --

 

3303465559 2000-D NEW HAMPSHIRE STATE QUARTER PCGS MS68 $676.00 23 Ended --

 

3303467159 2001-D NORTHCAROLINA STATE QUARTER PCGS MS68 $800.00 16 Ended --

 

3303468057 2002-D INDIANA STATE QUARTER PCGS MS68 $500.00 13 Ended --

3303468671 2002-D MISSISSIPPI STATE QUARTER PCGS MS68 $630.00 17 Ended

 

[trozau]

It's madness I tell you, madness!

[jtryka]

It could very well be a scam, but I don't know enough about these auctions of the market for moderns to make an educated judgement. I will say this, in my personal eBay activity, I often bid on a number of coins at once if I need them for my collection, or if they seem to be a bargain. I mainly do this since I am not one to sit anxiously for the auction to end and often bid on several similar coins so I have a chance at winning at least one. Though my collecting interests are a little different (I rarely pay more than $1,000 for a Saint on eBay!).

[Guest]

A month ago, I picked up 4-2002-p Ohio quarters, pcgs ms68 for 45.00 each.

 

Thinking it was a pretty good deal.

 

Now the high bids on the same quarters are around 110.00 each, with 5 to 7 days to go on the auctions.

 

True, it's pure, unadulterated madness!!

 

I know the U.S. mint trashed the quarters as far as quality goes. Will ms68 be top dog, and rare?

 

What's goin' on?

[Chippewa]

Even if only a minute percentage of state quarters warrant an MS68 grade they will still never be anywhere close to "rare". In coins like these, absent the modern registry war, would anyone really care whether their coins were MS67 or MS68. How many of us could even tell the difference?

 

It is either fraud or madness or a bit of both.

[Coinosaurus]

I totally agree. It is not too hard to learn the difference between, say, 63, 65, and 67. Anything over that it gets very fuzzy & it is hard to understand how the marketplace can sustain a distinction at the "opinion" level. The bubble WILL burst, the only question is when and how hard.

[Guest]

There is a possibility that this is what Ebay calls, shill bidding.

 

This is where a seller gets his friends to bid up the price to extremely high prices, causing other ligite bidders to think that this coin is worth the high price.

 

I would think that the friends of the seller never pay for the coin, thus causing a false value of the coin, in the future. Then the seller can reauction the coins and get higher prices.

 

Ebay doesn't put up with this scheme.

 

On the bid history of these auctions, almost all the same bidders are there on the list.

 

Something smells fishy!!!

[GDJMSP]

I agree completely - it's crazy. As for whether it is a scam or if shilling is taking place - maybe - maybe not. What I do know is - is that it happens almost every day. And not just with State Quarters. It is also not limited to modern coins alone.

 

Why ? I think there are a couple reasons. First and foremost I think it is because of the extremely fierce competition between the Registry Set members - everybody wants to be number one. And they are willing to pay almost any price to do so.

 

Another and admittedly less likely reason is that with the availability of information on the survival rate for high grade examples of coins - both past & present - some folks are gambling on the future. And I stress the gambling aspect ! It may well turn out that they are right - only time will tell.

[Oldtrader3]

I bought a PR69DCAM State Quarter for Type and I paid less than $50.00 for it. This sounds kind of fishy. PR68DCAM coins do not draw that type of pricimg.

[GDJMSP]

The coins posted about are MS examples - not proof examples.

[jtryka]

I'd like to avoid the modern debate as I am sure Cladking's pager just went off as there are new posts questioning/disparaging the valuation of moderns, and he is likely to swoop down and defend his business/investment to the death! But on a serious note, where extremely high grades are concerned, the differentiator (other than the number on the plastic) can often not be seen with the naked eye. So ask yourself as a collector, how do you best enjoy looking at your collection? Is it with your naked eye, taking in all the luster, toning (if any) and design features of the whole coin? Of do you get the greatest pleasure looking at them under 15x for the slightest sign that they have been touched or breathed on? If you enjoy the former, as I do, then it really makes little difference if your coin is a 65, 66, 67 or 68. They all look pretty similar to me without a loupe. If you prefer the latter, then bid on the highest grade stuff. If you prefer neither, then you may want to ask yourself if you've been drawn into the whirlwind of competitive registry hype. Just my opinion.

[coinman1794]

That's what those coins sell for in PCGS slabs. Most of those particular D issues are very, very hard to get in MS68. Even in MS67, they sell for around $100. The reason for this is that most MS68's came form mint sets. The 2002-D mint set coins were absolutely terible all year. They were heavily abraided and struck through grease and lint. The consequence is that the 2002-D quarters are actually rare in MS68. It's no scam. That's what the market dictates for these coins.

[Chippewa]

Unless I am missing something, Tulving sells 10 coin PCGS sets of MS67 state quarters (P&D x5) for $275. That sounds a lot more reasonable.

[BillJones]

There is one thing I really don't like about these coins at all. If they were not in PCGS MS-68 holders, they would not bring anywhere near this kind of money. If these coins sold for prices that were close this as RAW COINS, this modern market would have some "legs." Otherwise to me it's just scam.

 

And yes, this could be a scam to establish a public selling price. I saw this done before by a major auction firm that is now out of business. They held a sale on a Saturday morning when almost now one there. The bidding started at a few hundred dollars for a lot and then out of the blue a guy in the back pipes up $5,0000!!!! The first time it might have sense, but the SAME GUY kept doing it, time after time for lot after lot.

 

A few weeks later I saw ads from the same firm for the same type of coins (or same coins?) with comments like "Coins like this recently sold at public auction for higher prices." Was it a scam? Yes I think it was.

[Guest]

Here are some more Ebay auction prices for State quarters:

 

3304114543 2002-P Flag 5pc State Quarter SET PCGS MS68 $255.55 10 Ended --

3303722980 2000-P VA. STATE QUARTER PCGS MS68 NO RESV. $204.50 16 Ended --

 

3303723436 2001-P N.Y. STATE QUARTER PCGS MS68 NO RESV. $106.49 15 Ended --

 

3303725159 2001-P R.I. STATE QUARTER PCGS MS68 NO RESV. $430.04 20 Ended --

 

3303726102 2001-D VT. STATE QUARTER PCGS MS68 NO RESV. $473.00 27 Ended --

 

3303753900 2002-P OHIO STATE QUARTER PCGS MS68 NO RESV. $130.00 19 Ended --

 

3303754860 2002-D OHIO STATE QUARTER PCGS MS68 NO RESV. $305.02 20 Ended --

 

 

Way too rich for my blood.