The Hierarchy of Mintmarks

[RockMyAmadeus]

I'm not sure where this concept first started in my head....likely back when I first began collecting as a kid...but I've always had a "hierarchy" of mints and their mintmarks. Irrespective of the value of the specific date/mint, if I could get one mintmark over the other, I usually did.

 

I imagine it has something to do with overall value of the outputs of the various mints, plus mystique, intrigue, and perhaps even regionalism, along with just plain ol' "this has got a letter that the others don't."

 

So, without further ado...my mintmark hierarchy:

 

#1. San Francisco - S

#2. Carson City - CC

#3. Charlotte - C

#4. Dahlonega - D

#5. New Orleans - O

#6. Denver - D

#7. West Point - W

#8. Philadelphia - P or none

 

#1. San Francisco - The "S" has always been near and dear to me, and with an astonishing plethora of ultra key coins (1894-S Dime, 1870-S $3, 1870-S h10, 1870-S $1, 1854-S $2.5 and $5, 1855-S $3 Proof, 1920-S $10, 1920-S $20, 1896-S, 1901-S, 1913-S 25c, 1893-S $1, 1909-S VDB, 1931-S 1c, etc etc etc), in my mind, it is, and always will be, the premier mintmark in all of US coins. Given a choice, and equal value, I will always pick an "S" mint coin, even if the other mintmarks have lower mintages. And, because the mint struck circulation coins all the way up until 1974, it's still very easy to find an "S" mint coin in circulation...but by the same token, since there have been no circulation "S" mint coins struck in 37 years, it's not going to be common, and in any event, not likely above 5c. Growing up in the Bay Area, that might have something to do with it, but no one can deny the premier place that "S" holds amongst mintmarks. Outside of Philly, which if course, had no mintmark until 1942 (see below), is there a mint that can boast such a glorious and storied output? I don't think so.

 

#2. Carson City - I recently obtained a copy of "The Mint on Carson Street", and it is phenomenal. With an output considerably greater than the single "C" or the first "D", Carson City coins aren't nearly as inaccessible, even to average collectors, than the other two, especially as it coined millions of silver coins. Because of that, and its oh so-short run (with its near four year hiatus considered, it was the shortest lived mint of all, at a mere 21 years, 3 years less than both Charlotte and Dahlonega; otherwise tied in overall years as a mint), it has developed and maintained a 19th century mystique unrivaled by any other mint. With a handful of major rarities in its own right (1876-CC 20c, 1870-CC $20, 1873-CC no arrows 10c, the Proof $1s), there is no shortage of famous coins from even this short time frame. As well, since every coin was made between 1870-1893, and they were all made in and during the genuine "Wild, Wild West", this mintmark, while elusive costwise for the young collector, is still available enough that owning a specimen from this legendary mint isn't difficult at all.

 

#3. Charlotte - Even moreso than the confusing-to-pronounce Dahlonega, this mint says "Antebellum South" more than any other. Charlotte, North Carolina is classic Southern history. The sites of the FIRST US gold rushes was not California, but rather North Carolina and Georgia, and those two facilities were opened to take advantage of that fact. The only drawback, of course, is that it produced only gold coins, and gold coins in such small numbers that none but advanced collectors own more than a handful of examples, if even that. As well, the mint produced few legendary coins, unlike SF, CC, NO, or even Denver. Perhaps the most legendary would be the 1849-C Open Wreath, but with a closed wreath variety of the same date being much more common, it suffers in comparison. Nevertheless, the mintmark is today the most sought after in terms of pure supply vs. demand, and it is precisely because there are very few examples under the $1,000 mark that this mintmark is near-mythic.

 

#4. Dahlonega - Because of the aforementioned confusion in pronunciation, as well as the fact that the "D" mintmark has been co-opted by another, far less glamorous mint, the gold coins of Georgia aren't quite as glamorous as their Charlotte cousins, especially with no legendary rarities to its name (even the 1854-D $3 isn't in the same league as some of the coins mentioned above.) Nonetheless, as the only other "tantum aurum" mint, and only in operation in the South prior to the Civil War, the original "D" bears a hefty premium, and an even heftier weight among mintmarks.

 

#5. New Orleans - The last of the Southern mints, the powerhouse branch of the 19th century, an "O" marked coin is usually the first one a novice collector encounters after the three "still in circulation" mintmarkss of Philadelphia, Denver, and San Francisco. With a large assortment of legendary rarities (1838-O 50c, 1853-O 50c no arrows or rays, 1854-O, 1856-O, 1879-O $20, the "Confederate Half Dollar", and even the suspicious 1851-O $1), classic keys (1909-O $5, 1892-O "Micro O" 50c, the rest of the "O" $20s), and even once-mighty coins like the 1903-O $1, once thought to be the rarest Morgan of all, the mint outshines all except Philadelphia and San Francisco in terms of key dates and rarities. But, the mint also produced nearly $300 million worth of coins from 1838-1909, far more vast than the outputs of Charlotte and Dahlonega combined. Finding an "O" mintmarked coin in circulation may be next to impossible, but one only need go to a local coin store to see an endless variety of "O"s for sale, at every price point from melt on up. Thankfully, the mint had 30 more years AFTER the Civil War, unlike its other Southern cousins, to mint coins, and it did so with gusto. Even still, had the mint not reopened in 1879, its pre-Civil War output would be enough for even very young collectors to cheaply obtain an example, as mintages of silver coins in the 1840s and 50s were in the several million for many dates and denominations, with a vast mintage of 7 million+ half dollars minted in 1858 alone. Still, as doors closed over a century ago, that little "O" carries with it more character and history than its more modern cousins.

 

#6. Denver - in my opinion, the weakest circulation mintmark of all. It's difficult to find pocket change without a "D" on it these days, as this mint churns out billions and billions of coins, often surpassing even the parent mint of Philadelphia. While it does have its own classics (1916-D 10c, 1911-D $2.50, 1914-D 1c) and even some genuine legendaries (1927-D $20, plus the Mythical 1964-D Peace $1), it has managed to produce endless coins, in endless denominations, since opening in 1906 as a mint. The sheer numbers of this mint's coins in circulation is a genuine drag on desirability. It's just not hard to find a Denver coin.

 

#7. West Point - Because this mint does not produce coins for circulation, and has only operated since 1988 as an official mint, it suffers from a lack of notoriety. Because of US Gov't policy, it is unlikely that the mint will ever produce a major rarity, or even a classic key (though the 1995-W Silver Eagle probably comes close.)

 

#8. Philadelphia - Finally, we get to the granddaddy mint, which suffers the very most because of one simple reason: for the vast majority of its history, it bore no mintmark at all. The Founders simply saw no need for one, despite precedent in other places for mintmarks at all facilities. So, from 1793 until 1942, coins from this mint saw no mark to distinguish them. Despite the fact that the most legendary rarities of all (1804 $1, 1913 Liberty 5c) were produced here, and despite the fact that it has more legendary rarities and classic keys than all the rest of the mints combined, it still lacked a mark, and then only from 1942-1945 on the nickel, until finally being placed on circulation coins beginning as late as 1979 and 1980. And since then, no "P" marked coin is either legendary OR classic. So, as far as the "P" goes, it just doesn't hold up to the rest.

 

So, that's my opinion on the hierarchy of mintmarks...anybody else have one of their own?

[James_OldeTowne]

I don't have a specific hierarchy, but for some reason, ever since I was a kid, Denver has been my favorite mint. Perhaps it's because that mint has the closest proximity to Missouri? At any rate, I prefer my type coins have the "D" on them, all other things being equal.

[BillJones]

I’d rate Dahlonega as #1. It was a small U.S. mint with an “unpronounceable” name that was located in the sticks in an area that is still somewhat remote. Charlotte coins are scarcer, but Charlotte (my #2) is big enough to have an NBA basketball team. When I was kid collector getting a coin form either of those mints seemed like an impossibility. Gold coins were rare and exotic. A gold coin from a mint that made only gold coins was even more exotic.

 

The first San Francisco mint was interesting place and from I’ve read it was hell to work there with the toxic fumes from acids and the like. Still there are no big demarcation lines between that first small facility and the “Gray Lady” which was truly symbolic mint for that location.

 

Carson City is also interesting, but given the fact that some of the silver dollars are not hard to find, I’d rate it below the Charlotte and Dahlonega mints.

 

[Mr.Mcknowitall]

Rock,

I really enjoyed reading your Post, and the reasons for your choices.

Very good and very well stated.

 

In this case, written communication appears to be relatively effective.

 

With Respect,

John Curlis

[messydesk]

I guess when I was first starting out, filling folders from a paper bag of wheat cents, the S mint was most exciting, because there were fewer of those than P or D in the midwest, and vast stretches of dates with none being available at all. P was higher than D for historic reasons, even if only 4 coins ever bore the P mint mark (this was the 70s).

 

Once I started buying coins -- usually whatever was cheap -- I took notice of O and CC as being long lost mints of yore. O became more special than S, and CC more special than O, it being the coolest looking mint mark, a short-lived mint with "wild west" charm, and having very few coins that could be purchased on an allowance budget -- just a couple low grade seated dimes and maybe a couple quarters.

 

W seems more of a Philadelphia annex than anything else, since they started producing coins with no mint mark, and never released anything into circulation with a mint mark. Also, there was never a time when a special "W" punch was lined up among the other mint mark punches, as the concept of hand punching a mint mark into a die was gone before the first W showed up on a coin. Finally, the fact that I don't really collect moderns doesn't help make it very relevant in my eyes.

 

Charlotte and Dahlonega always seemed like "extra credit" mints to me, as they only made gold coins, and I didn't collect these. I will probably put together a Charlotte or Dahlonega type set and/or a $5 Liberty "all mints" set sometime.

[RWB]

Older mint documents list them by seniority:

 

Philadelphia

New Orleans

Charlotte

Dalonega

San Francisco

 

After the Civil war, the pattern was:

Philadelphia

San Francisco

Carson

New Orleans

 

Later, Denver replaced Carson, and New Orleans vanished in FY 1910.

 

Now the priority list seems to be:

Philadelphia

Denver

West Point

San Francisco

[DirtyGoldMan]

Fun thread. Messydesk's explanation probably would represent my viewpoint for the first 30 or so years of my collecting life.

 

My current ranking would be:

 

1. Dahlonega

2. New Orleans

3. Carson City

4. Charlotte

5. San Francisco

6. Philadelphia

7. Denver

15. West Point

 

I also have coins in my collection from three private mints (and plan to obtain some others):

1. Moffat

2. Clark Gruber

3. Bechtler

 

[RockMyAmadeus]

Great responses!

 

(15. )

[Kamillion]

Charlotte doesnt have a basketball team anymore, unfortunately

[DWLange]

Everyone forgot the M mintmark of Manila (1920-41).

[DirtyGoldMan]

It would be fun to do a list of the five greatest coins from each mint.

[RockMyAmadeus]

Everyone forgot the M mintmark of Manila (1920-41).

 

I considered it, but since it wasn't a traditional "US" mint, I decided against including it.

 

Did any of these coins circulate in the US?

[noow]

NIce article. I typically look for sleepers (coins with low mintages but average values)

[shirohniichan]

Everyone forgot the M mintmark of Manila (1920-41).

 

I considered it, but since it wasn't a traditional "US" mint, I decided against including it.

 

Did any of these coins circulate in the US?

 

Its coins didn't circulate in the US, but Manila was the only US Mint that wasn't on US soil. You could use that factoid to win a bar bet, but only if it was a bar near a convention center hosting a coin show.

[shirohniichan]

My list is as follows:

 

#1. San Francisco - S

#2. Carson City - CC

#3. New Orleans - O

#4. Philadelphia - P or none

#5. Manila - M

#6. Charlotte - C

#7. Dahlonega - D

#8. Denver - D

#9. West Point - W

 

Even in California, San Francisco coins were harder to find in change than those from Denver as I grew up. The 1970 to '72-S cents seemed to be struck better than others, also. My primary interests amoung US coins are 20 cent pieces and trade dollars. San Francisco churned out more of them than any other mint, and the 1859-S dollar was the first one struck especially for export to China (making it the first US made trade dollar).

 

The Carson Mint came about as a result of the Comstock silver discovery (a favorite event of mine in US history), so it is near and dear to my heart.

 

An 1879-O dollar was the first coin from an extinct mint to catch my attention when I began collecting coins. For only $3.00 I could have a New Orleans silver dollar of my own! At the time I'd only heard about the mints at Philly, Denver, and San Francisco, so it was quite a surprise to learn about New Orleans (and thereafter Carson City, Charlotte, and Dahlonega). I didn't even know Manila was a US mint until years after that, and West Point wasn't even striking coins back then.

 

Philadelphia is the original US Mint. It deserves respect, even if it isn't as exciting as the mints of the Old West.

 

Coins from Manila were the last ones I actively collected (starting only about 6 or 7 years ago). What a story! Now I know why so many "sea salvaged" coins show up.

 

Charlotte and Dahlonega struck coins I'll probably never own an example of, but they're cool because they're old and hard to find.

 

Denver means run-of-the-mill coins for pocket change to me. It was the first mint I remember touring.

 

I only collect business strikes, so West Point is akin to the Franklin Mint in my mind.

[mtnstyne]

Everyone forgot the M mintmark of Manila (1920-41).

 

I'm going to continue to ask questions until I'm retired from my real job and have more time to do my own research, but what did they mint in Manila and can you post a picture of something?

[RockMyAmadeus]

Everyone forgot the M mintmark of Manila (1920-41).

 

I'm going to continue to ask questions until I'm retired from my real job and have more time to do my own research, but what did they mint in Manila and can you post a picture of something?

 

They struck standard Phillipine coins of the day, including this:

 

 

Note the "M" mintmark next to the date, to the left.

[PerryHall]

First tier---C, D, CC where D is for Dahlonega

Second tier---O

Third tier---P, D, S, W

[Hard Times]

#1. New Orleans - O

#2. Dahlonega - D

#3. Charlotte - C

#4. Carson City - CC

#5. San Francisco - S

#6. Philadelphia - P or none

 

 

 

[BillJones]

I think that the Philadelphia mint, at least the first Philadelphia mint, is getting the short end of the stick here. This facility started it all, and it produced some of the most interesting U.S. coins under the most difficult of conditions. The hours were long; the pay of meager; the working conditions were terrible; and Congress was often debating about closing the facility completely. In addition there were periodic epidemics of yellow fever that were almost sure to kill you if you were unlucky enough to contract the disease.

 

As for the first Philadelphia mint products, I’ll submit to you a sample in each of the three coinage metals.

 

Copper

 

 

Silver

 

 

Gold

 

[RockMyAmadeus]

But this isn't a thread about which mint is "the best"...it's about which mintmark one likes the most. Since Philly had none for 150 years, how can it qualify...?

[Coindude]

Bill, no matter how many times you post that 1793, I still love it.