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Can a spot cause loss of Cameo grade?

Started by snizzenfixit,

21 posts in this topic

snizzenfixit

snizzenfixit

Posted
Posted

I have a 1962 Franklin half, graded by NGC as PF67. There is a small milky spot (smaller than a bb) near the rim. This half has very strong cameo contrast. Does a small spot automatically cause a coin to NOT be given a Cameo designation? I am attaching a scan so you can see the spot.

 

Phil

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snizzenfixit

snizzenfixit

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Uhh, I don't know what the old holder is. The number on it is 138186-010 and the hologram on the back is the one that says ANA Official grading service. Is that the old one? confused.gif

 

Phil

 

 

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BOILER78

BOILER78

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Posted

Thats the newest holder. You may want to pm John Maben with NGC and ask him about the designation. He'll probably tell you to send the coin in for designation review. I think it cost about $6.

Good Luck

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Weidel Legacy Collection

Weidel Legacy Collection

Posted
Posted

I agree with Hoot's assessment of John Maben - he's been responsive on the board and seems to be a fair-minded person.

 

You're correct about the reverse looking solid enough for the Cameo rating. Have you looked at both sides with a loupe to check for any breaks in the cameo effect - including all lettering? Normally, for a coin that looks like yours, that is what it would take to not be designated Cameo. If so, and it still looks good, then I'd definitely send it in for appearance review.

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snizzenfixit

snizzenfixit

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OK I looked all this up and Appearance review is for downgrade only.

Pasted from NGC website

 

Appearance Review/Downgrade

No Charge

12 Working Days

A service for review of an NGC coin you believe is over-graded or unattractively toned in a way that makes it unmarketable.

 

Regrade on the other hand is tier price.

Also pasted from NGC

 

ReGrade Tier Price According to tier chosen.

Ex: ReGrade Economy

is 21 Working Days If you disagree with a grade assigned by NGC you may submit the coin for review for a higher grade. Coin must be intact in its holder. Also, choose a grading tier according to coin value and desired turnaround.

 

NGC appears to have quite a deal going here. You undergrade a few coins, and then hope for resubmission, thus getting double the grading fee. Job security?

 

Phil

 

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Hoot

Hoot

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snizzenfixit - Appearance review is not just for undergraded coins as you could believe from what you read. It is for any coin that has a questionable appearance per the grade and designation in an NGC holder. It is a no cost service - I have used it. NGC is quite courteous about it. In my case, they believed that the coin I had deserved the grade without conservation or downgrading. So, they sent me a kind hand-written note explaining their reasoning. It put my mind at ease somewhat, even if the coin had less eye appeal than I liked.

 

Hoot

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snizzenfixit

snizzenfixit

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>Appearance review is not just for undergraded coins as you could believe from what you read. It is for any coin that has a questionable appearance per the >grade and designation in an NGC holder.

 

 

Mmmm, No I am not saying it is for UNDERGRADED coins, I am saying it is a service for OVERGRADED coins. NGC states that it is "A service for review of an NGC coin you believe is over-graded or unattractively toned in a way that makes it unmarketable."

 

Regrade however is "If you disagree with a grade assigned by NGC you may submit the coin for review for a higher grade."

 

Don't get me wrong here I am not trying to get, nor will I accept a free regrade. I will probably cross it to PCGS. The point I am trying to make here is that this could be percieved as a nice little scam, take say maybe 10% of the coins you grade and undergrade them. Maybe 25% of those get submitted for regrade. This adds 2.5% more business than you would have had otherwise. (These numbers are totally made up. I have no idea what the actual numbers could be, but you see what I mean)

 

 

Phil

 

 

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snizzenfixit

snizzenfixit

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Oh Boy,

That just about makes me sick. You are saying this is really going on? I was actually hoping maybe this half was graded the day after the company Christmas party or something crazy.gif What a shame if this is actually common practice.

 

Phil

 

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michael

michael

Posted
Posted

my first submission and only submission to ngc was about 1.5 months ago i did an appearance rewview and a designation review i talked to ngc many times with many questions i also

 

did a submission thruogh ebay and the appearance review was free i talked to one of the prinv ciples of the company and he really treated me well

 

they did waht they said they would at ngc i was very pleased evetruone was great now i think that they are great if you ask questions AND THEY at least from my experience they give 100% customer serives and THEY LISTEN

 

i do not want any favors or want something for nothing and i expect that at a professional grading service from my experience they treated me fairly and kept all the promises they made to me after reviewing all their services i think they have a very fair policy overall

 

sincerely michael

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Hoot

Hoot

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Michael - My experience is very much like your own. I was treated quite fairly.

 

snizzenfixit - sorry I misunderstood. But my basic point remains that the appearance review is a true service at NGC and that they are amply helpful It is part of the guarantee service that protects many of us out here.

 

As for undergrading for the sake of resubmissions, we have gone around and around about it. Many feel that NGC is far more consistent than PCGS (me for one) and that far less under- or overgrading goes on. The measurably greater consistency from the personal experience of many leads me to believe that NGC is playing no games and that they are simply prone to errors, albeit at a narrower margin than other services.

 

Just opinions and perceptions. Hoot.

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snizzenfixit

snizzenfixit

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OK Hoot,

But I just find it difficult to understand how this could be a simple error in judgement. Like I have said, this thing has such strong cameo that I think Slingblade Carl could figure out that it is a cameo.

 

I have not yet been able to find anyone in my area, that can compare this half with others in my collection that have the cameo designation, and have them be able to explain how this happened. Maybe I am beating a dead horse, but I would be curious as to what the graders thoughts were when they did the grading. confused.gif

 

Phil

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