Help with why NGC doesn't slab counterfeits.

[RockMyAmadeus]

Hey there! I started a thread last night over in the comics section when I discovered a counterfeit comic that had been slabbed by CGC...clearly labeled counterfeit, but slabbed nonetheless...

 

http://boards.collectors-society.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=3460463#Post3460463

 

...and I'm not really coming up with the best reasoning for WHY NGC and PCGS don't slab counterfeits, other than "it gives them a legitimacy they don't deserve."

 

A few folks are saying "well, it's better that CGC slab this and let people know", but this would be akin to saying the same thing about NGC.

 

Can anyone help me with a better argument as to why this practice isn't wise? Or, heck, maybe you agree that these should be slabbed and labeled as such. Either way, your collective input is greatly appreciated. This is a very new thing to comics, and a bit of a minefield.

 

Thanks!

[WoodenJefferson]

The primary concept of the grading services was above all else, to provide authenticity, even sight unseen. The hard core numerical grading evolved as a steadfast concept with the introduction of bullion and authenticity all of a sudden became secondary in nature.

 

If the services encapsulate a counterfeit coin knowing it is counterfeit, does that not defeat the primary directive.

[TomB]

Some historical counterfeit coinage is certified by both PCGS and NGC with no or little notation as to the origin or US Mint authenticity.

[physics-fan3.14]

I really do think that they should slab contemporary counterfeits, restrikes, or important numismatic forgeries. The problem is, where do you draw the line? Obviously, these should be well marked as non-genuine, but there has to be a point where you don't certify them anymore. Many early counterfeits are worth a good deal of money - James collects/buys them somewhat frequently I know.

[gmarguli]

Counterfeit comics are violation against the owner of that property.

 

Counterfeit coins are an extremely serious federal law violation and the federal government likes to go after counterfeiters.

 

Also, it could be argued that NGC has an obligation to turn counterfeits into the government. I believe this is the reason why the TPG use "Questionable Authenticity".

[skippy]

How would the TPGs decide which counterfeits to slab? This could create a lot of confusion for their submitters ( "I sent this Chinese counterfeit Trade Dollar to xxGS and they wouldn't slab it!")

 

[Coindude]

Counterfeit coins are an extremely serious federal law violation and the federal government likes to go after counterfeiters.

Exactly, the Secret Service could confiscate any coin that is known to be counterfeit.

[James_OldeTowne]

Counterfeit comics are violation against the owner of that property.

 

Counterfeit coins are an extremely serious federal law violation and the federal government likes to go after counterfeiters.

Greg is exactly right. Counterfeit coins leave the owner open to far more legal liability than counterfeit comic books, or counterfeit play-doh figurines, for example.

[coinman1794]

Hey there! I started a thread last night over in the comics section when I discovered a counterfeit comic that had been slabbed by CGC...clearly labeled counterfeit, but slabbed nonetheless...

 

http://boards.collectors-society.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=3460463#Post3460463

 

...and I'm not really coming up with the best reasoning for WHY NGC and PCGS don't slab counterfeits, other than "it gives them a legitimacy they don't deserve."

 

A few folks are saying "well, it's better that CGC slab this and let people know", but this would be akin to saying the same thing about NGC.

 

Can anyone help me with a better argument as to why this practice isn't wise? Or, heck, maybe you agree that these should be slabbed and labeled as such. Either way, your collective input is greatly appreciated. This is a very new thing to comics, and a bit of a minefield.

 

Thanks!

 

It makes great sense to slab them and make them known, but it dilutes the brand appeal of NGC when you have to stop and think about whether or not it's a real coin, every time you see an NGC holder. It's a subliminal thing. The same logic persisted for 22 years about slabbing problem coins. The purity of brand recognition is also the reason NGC won't use the clear insert that so many of us want; they think the white core is their trademark. Peronaly, I think it's all nonsense that appeals to our basic instincts instead of our intelects, but if there is a risk that someone might get confused and buy a counterfiet coin thinking that the NGC holder insures authenticity (regardless of what the label reads), NGC would be in trouble.

[Conder101]

NGC DOES slab some counterfeits even though they say that they won't slab any counterfeits including historically significant ones and contemporarycounterfeits that are widely collected.