okie; coin guru's what is the only coin photographed in red book that is holed??

[michael]

What is your take on this?

 

personally myself i think this these items, patterns, whatever you call them are just unofficial fantasies made in the 19th century by some *****unknown prankster****and of course they have been romantizied and well written about with ABSOLUTELY NOTHING KNOWN ABOUT THEM and well it just stuck in the red book and is now part of history

 

unknown prankster-------sort of like an "unknown mr. betts"

 

betts famous for his many fantasy pieces of early american coins he made in the middle 19th century and are so avidadly collected today and some go for big $$

[WoodenJefferson]

I guess the Genie is out of the bag, so this the critter in question?

 

 

Add’l info…Prior to it being in the Massachusetts Historical Society collection, someone from New Haven was holding this non-existing piece.

 

 

 

 

I take it the aobve article was written and published in 1885 as per the mintues of the:

 

RHODE ISLAND HISTORICAL SOCIETY.

 

The sixty-third annual meeting was held January 13, 1885, the President, Professor Williani Ganunell in the chair.

 

At a meeting held December 30, Dr. Charles H. Fisher read a paper on Numismatics, setting forth and illustrating the value of Numismatics as a source of historical knowledge. Mr. Charles Gorton also read a paper on the early colonial coins and coinage, after which Mr. Francis W, Furman exhibited an extensive collection of coins, belonging to different periods and countries. It was a meeting numerously attended, and the Society passed a vote of thanks to these gentlemen for the instruction and entertainment which they had afforded.

 

 

 

[Bugmann1974]

quote""""It is not the Janus copper that is holed its the "indian" or "Province" Massachusetts copper""""

 

the indian or province copper is another name for the janus copper all are one in the same

 

but it is a strange item that is historical but just no one knows the how, why or where it comes from but it is a holed intreging piece nonetheless

 

great research by the way (thumbs u

 

On the contrary, The indian/province copper is has an indian with bow and arrow on the obverse, Liberty (facing left) sitting on a globe on reverse. It has a Breen number of 702. This is the one that is holed. I have an incomplete collection of Red books and I find it Interesting to note, This token was not listed in the Red Book until somewhere between 1975 and 1981.

 

The Janus copper has 3 heads on the obverse, one facing left one facing forward and one facing right. On the reverse, Liberty is sitting on a globe facing right. It has a Breen number of 703

 

I actually share the same belief as you on these coppers. One of the main reasons is this... The Janus copper is supposed to be a pattern piece, supposedly it was found with some proof impressions of the continental currency notes. This had led to the belief this coin/token had been engraved and pressed by Paul Revere.

 

If that were the case then it would make sense for the coin to be in AU/MS condition, yet the coin is listed as being in F-12. If this was a pattern piece then why does it have so much wear?

[Bugmann1974]

An interesting tidbit on the NE 3 shilling, There are actually 2 of these known, however the second one was stolen from Yale University at some point and never seen again. (The book does not say when this happened.)

[michael]

lots of great information here

 

yes might have been two but since the stolen one has no photo and is unconfirmed there is currently only one and maybe there is only one as the stolen one is a fabrication and/or never existed in the first place

and stolen is just a cover story as there is no proof positive concrete proof that a 3 pence piece was stolen just rumor

we might never know

[Conder101]

It's not a coin but my copy of the Redbook also has a holed hard times token L56 HT175