US MINT

[Old Pueblo]

Hello

 

Can anyone tell me if the average retail buyer of coins from the US mint stand an equal chance of receiving a MS70 or PF70 coin as anyone else?

 

Thanks for your help

 

Larry

[MarkFeld]

Absolutely yes.

[Schatzy]

Larry....Welcome to the Fourm!!

 

From my research in getting coins graded it is about 1 out of 8 for 2000 present on proof sets and 1 out of 20 for 1999 - 1980's.

 

As for commemoratives and eagles it is about 1 out of 4.

[rrantique]

Welcome to the forum Larry.

[bsshog40]

Welcome Larry!!

[RWB]

...and you can get different "grades" each time you submit the same coin.

[Smilie Puss]

Yes. I agree with Mark et. al.

 

However, I am not sure statistically, but I would guess better coins would come from new die pairs during the earlier part of the production.

 

However, of this I am fairly certain. Early strikes graded by the TPGS's should yield more 70's. Not sure this stands to reason but is a guess.

 

If you are a dealer and order, I believe, 1000 or more coins from the USMint the dealer is given a discount(10%?).

 

Dealer then has coins graded and a certain percentage(?) are 70's. This could be as high as 15% if the Gaussian distribution is a normal bell shaped curve [ assuming the process is under control @ USMint] 15% less than< 69, 15% more than> 69. This should put the majority at 69.

 

Dealer sells or auctions [eBay] 70's at a high return and makes =,<, or > profit on 69's or lower. If shipping is included this could also increase the profit for the dealer by a smaller amount.

 

So then what is the stratagy of the collector or investor?

 

Purchase on eBay or similar auctions graded 69's coins unless you really want a 70's for Registry. The bargan will be a graded coin at much less a price than if you received a coin from the USMint and had it graded your self. Your chances of receiving a 70 are about the same as that for a dealer. Want to try your luck?

 

itsnow24u

[RWB]

You confuse “MS 70” with “better.”

 

“MS 70” is the only non-objective point in the entire numeric scale of grading opinion. It means: “exactly as the coin came from the dies.” Doesn’t matter if dies are old, new or defective.

 

“MS 69” and all the others are just opinions and will change almost every time you send in the same coin. Actually, the chances are good that the “grade” will go down the more you submit the same coin – minor handling, dust, dirt, handling all are cumulative.

 

[fishfinder]

Welcome to the neighborhood Larry!

 

Larry(Fish)

[wtc911coins]

wow that is nice to know have never bought from the mint always from ebay.

[halfpint]

 

 

............WELCOME! LARRY!!

[Old Pueblo]

Mark,

Hey thanks for the input

Sometimes I imagine all the PF70 coins rolling right off the line into insider's hands leaving only the 69 and lesser grades for the rest of us.

 

I have all the Silver Eagles bought from the Mint but not one have I sent to be graded. I have examined the coins at 20X magnification but not sure what I am looking for. Anyway I have an invoice to send my first five coins for grading.

 

I am very excited and a bit worried too.

 

What the heck, I guess I won't know until I get them back

 

L

[Old Pueblo]

Thanks for the reply,

Been collecting a long time, from the mint almost exclusively last 25 years

One day I saw the Anniversary 2006 Silver Eagle set on Home Shopper Network.

Not that I shop there I just happen to be "clicking Through" but the 2006 Anniversary set caught my eye for about $600.00 smackers. WOW, I opened my safe and pulled out my 2006 set. Then I started looking around the web and found the Silver Eagles EVERYWHERE! At prices that made my jaw drop. THen I discovered the HUGH price discrepancy between grades.

Now I want to have my Eagles Graded

So I joined the NCG.

I hope I get lucky on a few

 

Larry

[MorganMan]

Welcome.

 

Just remember, if you have already opened your 2006 ann set, the only one you can have designated by NGC as 20th Ann is the reverse proof.

 

MM

[Schatzy]

Larry...go and check your messages. I sent you a message!!

[Old Pueblo]

MM,

 

Thanks for the info. Oops I opened the box in 2006:( I need to pay more attention.

I was thinking about these Eagles and I have never sold a coin from my collection.

So, it doesn't really matter what grade they are. But the curiosity is killing me!

I want to start a NCG registry set and it appears they have to be graded to do that

 

 

Hey, where would I go to buy certified Eagles that I can trust.

I am not sure I have the courage for EBAY or the stomach

 

L

[Schatzy]

Ebay is not really that bad, I have bought 100's of coins and have never had any problems.

Most sellers ship coins with delivery confirmation.

 

There are lots of places you can buy coins.

Just to Name a few!!

 

Modern Coin Mart

 

Heritage Auction Galleries

 

TeleTrade

 

Before you start buying make sure you do your research and see what the going price is.

Whatever you do don't buy anything off of home shopping networks.

 

The top 5 worst investments

[Old Pueblo]

I have watched those guys on HSN WOW they should be selling Used Cars.

The irony is they were responsible for my new found interest in coins when I saw the 2006 anniversary set on the show. That's when I started to google American Proof Silver Eagles.

 

[RareSov]

Ok I have a formulated opinion here, it has been through purchases, other peoples information and common sense. I've been buying from the US Mint for about 2 years now

 

You have the best chance of 70 if you can get on a subscription program. You will be sent coins ahead of public release in some cases.

 

Big orders placed on the phone at the exact release time probably get a little priority, but otherwise it is luck of the draw and timing. Once production is in full swing, you will never know the order of stock sitting in the fulfillment center, when it was minted and in what order each box was put on top of each other (newer/older, more stock comes along that is newer and goes on top, etc)

 

So the simple answer is YES.

 

The complicated answer is yes and no. The way to give yourself a better chance is to buy;

 

a) Preorder/subscription

 

b) right on release

 

c) timed - a guessing game when you think they might have minted X coins and needed new dies, with order of stock and boxes etc this becomes less likely but could be possible when there are very popular products that go onto backorder.

 

An example of c) - buying the UHR right on release date. You KNOW those dies are damn spankin brand new. I think I'm somewhere in the first 5-10,000 coins myself (40k minted first day and I got in in less than half an hour)

[RareSov]

However, of this I am fairly certain. Early strikes graded by the TPGS's should yield more 70's. Not sure this stands to reason but is a guess.

 

This is the most common misconception. According to the mint's site, they sometimes have tons minted before the release date, sitting in the fulfillment center. So from there you have no idea, they even go so far to confirm that the boxes can be labeled completely out of order, the label is only "the date it was packed" and has no relevance to when it was minted.

 

It does also say how often they change dies for MS/PF on the same page, but I don't remember offhand which page, sorry.. search for First Strike I think !

[RareSov]

NGC can also do a deal and encapsulate in a way that suits dealers, you can send loads and specify min 70, or pay only a very discounted rate for the coins that are only 69 if you don't mind those slabbed. Price based on what the coins grade for bulk submission and not bother with the lower ones, sell them in OGP. So that might explain some situations where dealers seem to have way too many 70's to be just luck or smart ordering..

 

Personally I had a Jackson's Liberty that was PF68UC at best, so I sent it back that will do me.. the next one I got looks perfecto, a real stunner.