My stolen coin on eBay

[SecretSquirrel-migration]

 

So a few years ago I had my place broken into and things taken. Now I see one of my coins is on eBay. Obviously I called the police and they are investigating. It's now migrated across state lines as well. The cool thing is the fools left it in the holder with the serial number visible in the auction!!! This info was in the old police report and very lucky for me!

 

Has anyone else been in this or similar position?

 

What are my chances of getting my item back? Obviously if they decide to charge someone it could remain as evidence for some time. But if the current owner wants to be PITA, then what?

 

Should I do anything at all such as outbid everyone so the item can't change hands yet again or just let the police do everything?

 

Thoughts...maybe from some police officers on here...

 

[Revenant]

Well, congrats on finding the coin again. This is partially why I participate in the registry, so there's a record of all my certified coins and their serial numbers that can't be taken (like if they stole/destroyed my computer).

 

I WOULD go ahead and outbid the others so the coin can't be sold to someone else personally. I would also consider (possibly using an alternate ID) contacting the seller, tell them the situation and see how they react. Since it's been several years the coin could have changed hands many times since they were initially stolen and the seller might not know they're stolen property.

[EZ_E]

I once had an expensive camera stolen but I had the serial numbers and it was returned to me by the police when someone tried to hock it.

 

Since your serial numbers are documented then you should get the coin back. Make sure that you call the detective every day on the point of being a nuisance to encourage him to fully pursue the case, o/w he may let it get buried.

 

Personally, I hope you nail the thief! Great detective work, Tracy!

 

(thumbs u (thumbs u

[BULLY]

 

Should I do anything at all such as outbid everyone so the item can't change hands yet again or just let the police do everything?

 

 

1. I suspect eBay may have a policy about knowingly trafficking in stolen merchandise, and that COULD mean bidding on your own merchandise is a no-no, even though it is yours, and was reported stolen. (Actually, I checked and they do).

 

Read more here:

 

http://pages.ebay.com/help/policies/stolen.html

 

There is even a contact form specifically for LAW ENFORCEMENT to contact eBay.

 

An excerpt from eBay's policy above:

"eBay will ask that members inform the police officer handling the case that eBay will be pleased to cooperate in the investigation, and ask the officer to contact eBay using eBay’s law enforcement-specific webform. The officer should include all relevant information, including the case number and any item numbers or User IDs."

 

2. Considering you have reported it to the police, and it's crossed state lines, I might call the police and ask what more you can or should do. I do agree that you should be persistent(politely), especially since it appears that eBay has a clear method of handling inquiries from Law Enforcement and attorneys dedicated to dealing with this.

 

3. Heck, since it's crossed state lines, if your local police are unresponsive, or you feel it is warranted, another option is to call the local police where the seller is and refer them to YOUR local police, or fax them a copy or your police report, and give them the same info for contacting eBay, a two-pronged approach, with a local cop who may be able to "nab" the seller.

 

However, I must disagree about bidding on your own item. As much as you want your item back, and as much as I can understand that desire, I think you'd be interfering with law enforcement, especially since eBay has such a clear policy on the matter that the police shouldn't have a hard time with it (as one might expect from eBay). And since you can present police with the clear policy and contact form, you have done their "leg work" for them, so they don't have to worry about "red-tape" if they just tried to contact eBay some other way.

 

[EZ_E]

Bully, excellent post and advice! It didn't strike me as proper to bid on one's own item, either. Hopefully, law enforcement will take this seriously but who can tell?

[Just Bob]

Welcome to the forum, S.S. Good luck getting back your coin!

[CHABSENTIA]

I would not bid on the Item. You will now have a track record of what happens tp the coin from this point.It is a good idea to also call the Police in te Locality where the coin is now at rest.I would tell them that I had contacted the Police in my Locality but I would not be pushy. Just say that you thought it would be a good idea.

 

 

Another possibilty here that since it has crossed State lines it might be a Federal rap. I have read a few artcles in Coin world where people have been arrested at Coin Shows when Coins have been Stolen. I would imagine that there would have to be a certain amount in Value etc.

[brasseye]

I would bid on the item, simply to stall the seller, and give the aurthorities more time to act.

For stolen merchandise they are not going to leap into action. But slowly get around to it, and if the item has been sold to an unwitting hird party, it'll just add another unecessary element to unwinding the whole situation.

 

The current seller may be bona fide seller, and not the theif who stole your coin, but in either case, the police need to contact this person and locate them, which potentially go outside the auction duration.

 

Will ebay pull the listing if you notify them?

Will that put the potential theif on notice?

Are ebay rules there simply to cover their azz, and contribute nothing towards you ownership rights, or finding remedy for you?

 

Simply put, bid, pursue the authorities, and as stated previously get the local police involves where the seller is, and forward as much rlevelant case information as you can.

 

Hope it all works out.

[ant]

i wouldnt trust the badges to get my stuff back. why if it is your item wouldnt you bid on it. i would and if i need to help i will by bidding on it! if you win it they cant sell it to any1 else. if you dont do anything the law could be too late!

 

my car was broken into and the thief took $800 amp, $500 subs,cut wires.the car stereo place was also hit that night.and my neigbor. every1 got there stuff back (neigbors ipod and cds, and dealers stuff,) but not mine! remember when the person is found (which if they talk to the current seller they will "talk" cause they dont want the felony.) the person will have to pay back every bit of money spent to get item back.

 

i have put a reward on my items so i can get it back (hopefully) which in my mind is the same as puting a bid on your own item!

[relicsncoins]

Post a link to the auction, so we can all participate in the suspense.

 

 

JJ

[BULLY]

i wouldnt trust the badges to get my stuff back. why if it is your item wouldnt you bid on it. i would and if i need to help i will by bidding on it! if you win it they cant sell it to any1 else. if you dont do anything the law could be too late!

 

I hate to sound repetitive, but I'd really follow eBay's rules about this, especially since they have such a clear, outlined policy for assisting law enforcement with stolen merchandise.

 

 

The quote above, without trying to sound offensive, sounds VERY familiar from a HIGH PROFILE news story recently, that crossed state lines from Florida to Las Vegas: the name you may all recognize:

 

O.J. Simpson

 

He said he couldn't trust the police.

He said he had to do it himself.

 

Look what's happened to him since?

 

I won't even try to characterize public opinion on O.J. Simpson about this act, but I will simply ask you to answer (to yourself), what is YOUR opinion of what O.J. Simpson is accused of doing in Las Vegas?

[ant]

point taken bully

[BULLY]

So a few years ago I had my place broken into and things taken. Now I see one of my coins is on eBay. Obviously I called the police and they are investigating. It's now migrated across state lines as well. The cool thing is the fools left it in the holder with the serial number visible in the auction!!! This info was in the old police report and very lucky for me!

 

 

One more angle to pursue, and it begins with a question:

 

Secret Squirrel, are you a member of the ANA?

 

If so, the ANA has a Reward Program, where it offers rewards to those who help successfully catch and prosecute those who steal from its members.

 

If you're an ANA member, read about it here:

 

http://www.money.org/Content/NavigationMenu/Communications/ConsumerProtection2/Loss_Alert_Program.htm

 

In case the link doesn't work for some reason, here is an excerpt from their site:

 

ANA Reward Program:

ANA Fund Rewards Crime Stoppers

A number of years ago, the American Numismatic Association established a reward fund in an effort to step up the apprehension and prosecution of thieves who steal numismatic property from ANA members. Anyone providing information that leads to the arrest and conviction of such criminals is eligible for a cash reward of up to $5,000, depending on the value of the property stolen and the severity of the crime.

 

If the retail value of the numismatic goods stolen is less than $5,000, the reward is $250; if $5,000 to $20,000, the reward is $500; and if greater than $20,000, the reward is $1,000. Individuals can receive $5,000 for information leading to the arrest and conviction of any person or persons involved in the violent death of a member in connection with the theft of his or her collection.

 

For complete details about the Reward Fund, contact the ANA Consumer Protection Coordinator at consumerawareness@money.org or 1-800-367-9723 extension 150.

[jackson64]

I would win the auction--find out a mailing address to "mail a check" and go retrieve my coin personally...with all that entails...no joke..the guy stole from me, it's time for the hammer to fall..

[BULLY]

I would win the auction--find out a mailing address to "mail a check" and go retrieve my coin personally...with all that entails...no joke..the guy stole from me, it's time for the hammer to fall..

 

I must again respectfully disagree.

 

Not relying on police.

 

Taking the law into your own hands.

 

Who does it sound like? O.J. Simpson meets Las Vegas!

 

Based on the judge's reaction to the case there, do we think that is the best course of action?

 

While I agree wholeheartedly that it is time the hammer should fall, I think the hammer, in this case, should be the gavel of a judge.

 

(thumbs u

 

If the ANA reward can offer any assistance, so be it. In this case perhaps not, since the owner himself found it. Maybe it can be an incentive to the cop, though I doubt it, they are probably prohibited. For anyone else this may happen to, more of an FYI that the service is out there, in case it happens to them.

 

 

[gmarguli]

I would win the auction--find out a mailing address to "mail a check" and go retrieve my coin personally...with all that entails...no joke..the guy stole from me, it's time for the hammer to fall..

 

1) You will likely get a PO Box address with most eBay sellers.

 

2) I don't know how expensive the coin was, but it might not be worth it to fly across the country and then rent a car to go retrieve it.

 

3) If an eBay buyer came to my door in a threating manner, they'd find himself with a bullet right between their eyes and another few in their chest. Dead people can't refute my version of the events. (thumbs u

[Ron G.-migration]

A few thoughts:

1. Have you checked the other items this particular seller has sold to see if any of the other stuff is yours?

 

2. I would ABSOLUTELY not contact this person and let them know anything. If they are dishonest, then they can simply remove the coin from ebay, remove the coin from the holder and say that they sold it to somebody "on the street", thus removing any chance you have of getting it back.

 

3. Do as previous people stated, contact the local authorities where the coin is being sold. Once this person is contacted by local authorities, he/she is then responsible for the coin, regardless if they knew it was stolen before or not. This means that legally they cannot sell the coin. This does not mean the officers will do anything to them, but it does mean you have a very easy civil case if the coin is not returned to you, and you can use the officers as witnesses.

 

4. If you turned this in to your insurance and received a settlement, contact your insurance company and let them know. If you had a deductible, you can recoup that loss from a civil suit, but your insurance company will be interested in recouping their loss as well.

[CHABSENTIA]

I don't know if the best bet would be to just stop the auction. You would have to give a reason for stopping the auction and if the seller is the actual thief then they might do somehting with it. There will be a record of whoever buys it on Ebay and thus a chain of possession that can be traced.

 

The person who had the coin stolen from him never listed the value of the coin.Lets say that the Seller is not the thief and he paid several hundred dollars for it from somebody at a coin show etc and there is no way to trace the former owner/s. How would you feel about being out several hundred dollars?

 

I personally think that a lot of E Bay rules are there to protect against Liabilty based on some of their previous actions.

[CHABSENTIA]

Why wouldn't the thief in your case receive a Felony? There are different degrees of Felonies and they differ by the amount of Money involved etc. Below a certain amount of money it is a misdemeanor.

 

 

If somebody robs a Bank etc then it is a Felony. If a Firearm is used then it makes a difference as to the degree of Felony then if one isn't used.

 

 

If Thief "A" steals a certain amount of Property and is caught and this is their first time then they will be charged with whatever Felony that the amount etc dictates. They may get a lighter sentence if they agree to or ordered to pay restitution.

[CHABSENTIA]

You can't be serious. This was just an excuse for not contacting the Police instead of taking matters into his own hands. This attitude was shown again when he tried to contact people after being warned specifically by the Judge to not contact anybody previously.

[CHABSENTIA]

Good post. I would call that number for the ANA and give them the facts such as the certification number on the Police report etc.

 

 

 

I would hope that he also has a copy of the Police report in case they lost it etc.

[CHABSENTIA]

I would go the ANA route as well as the others. You should be able to find out the mailing address without mailing the actual check. I beleive you have a certain number of days to pay.Find out the address and if we are talking about a lot of Money here then I would go to the address and contact the Police in the Locality and ask them if they wanted me to assist them etc etc.

 

 

 

I have a license to carry a concealed weapon here in Florida and any other State which recognizes it such as Alabama, Mississippi , Lousisiana and Texas to name a few.There are places such as a Bank etc where I can't carry a gun but if I am going to the Store etc I always carry it. Even if nobody knew I had it on me and went to recover it and was arrested then they found it on me then there could be a lot of potential problems.

 

 

Even if there is no problem such as this there could be other potential problems going it alone.

[CHABSENTIA]

Even with just a box number it would be possible for the Police for trace it.

[shirohniichan]

3) If an eBay buyer came to my door in a threating manner, they'd find himself with a bullet right between their eyes and another few in their chest. Dead people can't refute my version of the events.

 

Would that be after you invited the buyer in for a cup of tea and the chance to discuss the issue in a rational manner?

[CHABSENTIA]

Exactly. The Seller even if not the original thief could be charged with Conversion of stolen goods depending on the circumstances.

 

 

I would also contact the ANA as posted by the other Poster.

[Keigwin]

I was hoping this thread would reveal the auction data. Or at least cite the coin. Because...

 

I was bidding on a nice '19-S Lincoln, 64RD, very PQ. I offered a pretty nice price near the end of the auction but was outbid . The auction ended at $2,347. About 20 minutes later I got an email from ebay:

 

"The listing in which you were a bidding participant:

 

190196310686 - 1919S PCGS MS64RD CENT

 

has been ended by eBay. Since the listing was ended by eBay, for the transaction itself is null and void.

 

To protect the privacy of all eBay members, we can't discuss the details of the listing removal. We hope this assures you that your account information will also remain private."

 

I wrote to the seller who, it appears, runs a legitimate, respectable business and he says he has no idea why ebay ended the auction. He's going to relist it. WTF?

 

It can't really be the one we're talking about here, can it?

[pendragon1998]

Just to point out (as one or two others have also mentioned) you don't know that the current seller is the thief or has any idea the coin is stolen. They could just as easily bought the coin from an unscrupulous pawn show (for example).

 

I'm always frustrated by the vigilante mentality that inevitably shows up in these sorts of threads, though this thread is better than others ATS. Either call the cops or call it off. If they won't help you, you can pursue other legal avenues or even take your story to a local paper (and let them ask the cops why they won't help you). Going over and cracking some skulls personally as some suggest (as satisfying as that sounds) will just cause more problems than it solves; and, as gmarguli pointed out, it can get you dead in some necks of the woods (mine included).

 

 

[BULLY]

You can't be serious. This was just an excuse for not contacting the Police instead of taking matters into his own hands. This attitude was shown again when he tried to contact people after being warned specifically by the Judge to not contact anybody previously.

 

I'm not sure if we're on the same page here or not Chabsentia, or if you're reading this post out of context with my previous posts.

 

I'm talking about NOT taking the law into your own hands, and disagreeing with those who encourage this theft victim to do so.

 

Those who encourage otherwise, IMHO, sound like O.J. Simpson, and about this I am very serious.

 

Like someone here on the message boards said, O.J. also said that he couldn't rely on the police to take care of the matter for him.

 

Like multiple people here suggested, they'd take the law into their own hands, in various ways.

 

BOTH are very reminiscent of the crimes of which O.J. is accused in Las Vegas recently, and both are, again IMHO, ill-advised.

 

The police would likely agree, and eBay policy certainly is clear on the matter.

 

So yes, I am quite serious.

 

If my remark was taken out of context, I regret if it was misunderstood. However, to be crystal clear, I do not approve of vigilante justice of any kind.

 

I believe that since there are previous police reports, with a serial number coin, it should be very easy to handle by authorities and while I don't discourage someone from being persistent with police so a case doesn't get "overlooked," there is a big difference between that and interfering with an investigation in some way, or taking the law into your own hands, in ANY way, especially given eBay's written policy about cooperating with law enforcement about dealing in stolen merchandise.

 

Someone recently mentioned the insurance company and any previous claim, and that was a very good point.

 

If a police department was uncooperative (or even if they weren't), an insurance company might have investigators as well who are "persuasive" about retrieving stolen items for which payouts were involved. Whoever mentioned it, it's an idea worthy of consideration anyway.

 

 

[BULLY]

I was hoping this thread would reveal the auction data. Or at least cite the coin. Because...

 

"The listing in which you were a bidding participant:

has been ended by eBay. Since the listing was ended by eBay, for the transaction itself is null and void.

To protect the privacy of all eBay members, we can't discuss the details of the listing removal. We hope this assures you that your account information will also remain private."

 

I wrote to the seller who, it appears, runs a legitimate, respectable business and he says he has no idea why ebay ended the auction. He's going to relist it. WTF?

 

It can't really be the one we're talking about here, can it?

 

 

It's probably SAFER that the poster does NOT reveal the auction data involved, so that no one here does anything that would jeopardize the police investigation. As curious as we all are, all it takes is ONE to do something.

 

As for the "cryptic" email from eBay, I've gotten those DAYS after the transaction has ended, and I've already paid and received my coin!

 

eBay may remove a listing for ALL sorts of reasons, but the fact that the seller does not want to contact eBay to find out the reason on SUCH a high dollar item concerns me.

 

Back to possible reasons:

 

For coin violations, reasons can be as simple as:

 

1. The coin was listed as being "certified" with a grade but it was not certified by NGC, NCS, PCGS, ICG, or ANACS.

2. The photo may have been a "stock photo" which violates eBay's rules for listing certified coins.

3. If it was a certified coin and did not show the SERIAL NUMBER on the slab, that is a violation which could end the listing.

4. If it was a certified coin and did not show the FRONT AND BACK of the coin, it is a violation.

 

The list is longer, but those are just a few COMMON examples of VERY COMMON violations.

 

eBay developed their policy for selling graded coins after working with the ANA. See their policy here:

 

http://pages.ebay.com/help/policies/selling-coins.html

[Keigwin]

Agreed. I was curious because I want no part of it if it is being relisted and this is the coin in question. Odds are very high it is NOT this coin. I guess I was moved by the timing.

 

FWIW, it was a PCGS slabbed coin displaying the cert# and both sides of the coin. The seller has sent me additional pictures but I think I will sit back and watch things unfold.