1917

considering you aren't looking to preserve them for numismatic purpose, I'd check out some you tube videos or something. Most people on here will probably shrink at cleaning coins... actually, some people into ancients might know...

56 minutes ago, Zebo said:

Let's get back to the subject - who produced better designs. How do these artists compare to designs on modern coinage? 

Much better 

better

equal

not as good

no where near as good?

easy, much better. Those artists were in the true golden era of U.S. coin design (granted, who knows how much a future numismatist will mock me for this? recall to mind the hatred of the Morgan dollar in it's heyday)

50 minutes ago, RWB said:

They might go well with that 20 year old McD burger in Australia, or the one in Utah?

Oh, you invested in MusHavd, Inc,  which makes synthetic imitational mustard from the genetics of a toad and water lilly. You see, I went with MmmStard Co, which, allegedly, produces a combination mustard which contains 89.97% real mustard (while the stocks aren't at their high with the postponement of the WFM, I fortunately haven't entirely lost on them, as I bought in at their all-time low when it was discovered the other 10.03% of the mustard wasn't all-natural ingredients, but in fact it was mostly corn syrup, with a little horse radish and vodka). Anyhow, the stocks have halved since May, simply on fears that space aliens will be angry about the mustard thrown out, or something. However, MusHavd, Inc, is slightly up. Thus I would reccomend increasing portfolio diversity by selling some, and utilize the profit to buy low in MmmStard Co. Whatever you do, avoid Yumustard, Inc, because I hear that in a few months their gonna wind up with a scandal bigger than Enrelish.

the things that come of the postponement of the WFM, such as this strange discussion...

Clever bit of marketing  by S&B... 

Probably should wait on those condiment stocks; there could be more demand for this event after a year without... Then again, they might go stale after a whole year 😂

2 hours ago, olympicsos said:

Saint Gaudens designed an aesthetically pleasing double eagle, but it is important to note that Saint Gaudens is not without controversy. The Shaw monument he designed in Boston is criticized for having racial undertones and is frequently vandalized, and there are books and articles which mention that Saint Gaudens might have had racist views himself. Although at the same time, he was the first sculptor to portray the African Americans as actual human beings in the Shaw memorial rather than caricatures which were common portrayals of African Americans during Saint Gaudens time. But Saint Gaudens also attracted controversy for not using the actual soldiers from the 54th regiment as subjects for the monument. Also to his credit, he also used Hettie Anderson, a biracial woman, as a subject for his sculptures.

It is also worth noting that the Saint Gaudens $10 Indian Head design can be seen as a cultural misappropriation of Native American culture by having a biracial lady liberty with Caucasian features wear an Indian war bonnet which is only worn by Natives who have earned the privilege to wear one. Although that instance of cultural misappropriation was TR's fault as he insisted on the war bonnet, and although TR did take some progressive strides during his presidency, TR saw Native Americans as inferior and as peoples that must be defeated as much as he respected them as warriors. This brings me to my next point, that James Fraser, the Buffalo Nickel and Oregon Trail Half designer may not have been a racist himself, but also was not without controversy as Fraser's monument of TR at the Museum of Natural History in NYC has also been interpreted as racist and portraying Native Americans and African Americans as beneath TR and whites, and also has been vandalized. 

Longacre's portrayal of lady liberty on the Indian Head Cent can also be seen as a cultural misappropriation of Native American culture for the same reasons Saint Gaudens $10 Indian Head eagle is one. 

Weinman would seem like the lesser controversial choice when viewing things from a 21st century prospective and in light of the national discussion on racism and cultural misappropriation we have been having recently; and even though this name never came up so far in this thread, Charles Barber can be seen as even less controversial than Saint Gaudens or Weinman despite having a bad rap by some in the hobby. I am not saying one shouldn't purchase a $10 Indian Head Eagle or a Buffalo Nickel or an Indian Head Cent, but in the 21st Century there must be more context given around these designs, the artists, and the prevalent attitudes at the time that these coins were designed and in use. This discussion should be had about Saint Gaudens, Fraser, Longacre, if we want to bring more collectors into the hobby other than older white men. 

Interesting points, but I think it's important to have distinction between the work of art and the artist. I understand this doesn't always apply, but in this case we can separate them into two subjects. At the moment we were discussing the coin, but we can certainly transition to the artist, so long as we make a point of it. 

Anyhow, upon the subject of the artist, it is an important discussion for the modern times, and any time, regardless of circumstances. I think we have to be careful to judge by work, as interpretation could be different than how the artist saw it. 

2 hours ago, RWB said:

MacNeil was the only coin designer who based his eagle on a photo of a real eagle in flight.

probably why it looks more realistic than say, a Morgan... it looks good on the quarter, but again with proportions, on a big surface? ehh.....

On 6/19/2020 at 11:50 AM, JKK said:

Granted tastes vary, but have you ever seen a proof Barber coin? When you see all the detail the designer intended, it does provide a different perspective on his work.

like you said,tastes vary...I prefer worn Barbers.... not like a g/vg, but more like a f/vf ish...

12 hours ago, Zebo said:

A bit off topic, but which flying eagle do you like the best and least:

St. Guadens

Christen Gobrecht

or Longacre? 

depends on the coin. the really large coins, dollar/half-dollar area size on up, I'd take a detailed St. Gaudens , but for smaller ones I'd take the still wonderful, but not quite as detailed Gobrecht. It is my personal belief that most designs only look good in certain sizes. Imagine that crazy St. Gaudens squished onto a dime, or a Gobrecht onto a double-eagle. (PS, I do think the Gobrecht looks great on the dollar, I just think in GOAT considerations, St. Gaudens has a slight edge). Longacre's I'm actually not that impressed with in comparison to the other two. In general it's a great little penny, and is very significant for starting the small cent, but, again, in GOAT terms, it's not that far along. but as far as one-cent designs, pretty good.

20 hours ago, Just Bob said:

Interesting to theorize about how it might have gotten that damaged without grinding the rims, too.

very true.... I think that damaged coins can often have a ton of character that higher grades don't. Albeit, they don't look as nice, but it does give a person a reason to buy any C. Barber designed coin (I mean, why else buy one if not for character? #notafanCBarberdesign), plus giving a purpose to any low-grade coin

yeah, just some pmd... Interesting item to look at though

20 hours ago, kbbpll said:

His bas reliefs of the Ames brothers are on the Ames Monument out in the middle of nowhere in Wyoming at the high point of the original transcontinental railroad. I get a kick out of pointing that out to visitors when we take them around out there. There's a picture of a double eagle on the informative display.

I'll be a pariah on here for saying so, but I never thought the "most beautiful coin" was all that great. Her top looks like she's carrying a bag of rocks, her face looks like a Roman helmet bashed in, her legs are both inside her dress and outside it (pick one!), and the sun rays emanate from god knows where. There, I said it. The eagle on the reverse is amazing though.

imagine if Weinman and St. Guadens collaborated on a coin and we got Weinman's stunning walking liberty obverse with St.Guadens fantastic flying eagle reverse on the same coin!

The winning choice is "Tie"

Poll on early 20th century designers