Henri Charriere

Who let the dogs out?

Whatever happened to "Welcome to the Forum?" 

This collector is a newly-minted "mayfly" with mere hours on the site!

Thank God for Just Bob, a gracious gentleman who knows how to keep things on an even, civil keel.

To the OP:  my apologies for the rude, unwarranted reception you received here which was not at all representative of the caliber of collectors frequenting this site. 

4 hours ago, kbbpll said:

 

The other causative problems, speaking strictly for myself being, short- and intermittent-attention span and an imperceptible loss of memory. [I was misquoted as having "dropped out" of coin collecting when I merely "stopped out." Big difference.]

I don't know if I am reading this right or not but the hand-delivered submission of a "raw" coin in an open casket, sorry, gasket, suggests a purposeful attempt to skew or influence the grading proces.  I wonder if I would have been big enough to recuse myself from this blatant display of impropiety. 

Well, there you have it. The OP; the party who made a suggestion; various parties (with a herd mentality) who, quick on the collective trigger, shot the perfectly good proposal down in cold blood; the referral itself; and notably one party who spat out, I don't want to hear anything more about "that dime." Then the good part: the party to whom the matter was referred -- amid a chorus of those who cried out, Don't waste his time like you wasted ours, graciously accepts, and the OP -- whom countless parties railed against and vilified as a troll who had already made up his own mind and would never accept a finding contrary to his own, surprises all other parties by humbly accepting news of the exchange which MF was not obligated to share. And through it all an intriguing aspect emerges: a "diagnostic marker," which one party, ME!, was quick to dismiss as nothing more than pigeon poop. This is merely an introduction; much work remains to be done. I do hope the OP follows through on the promising lead discovered. My best to all those who made this production possible. (I have to go now before someone realizes I broke my promise to remain off this thread.) 😉

(I am guilty of the same but have no plausible alibi.)

5 hours ago, Conder101 said:

Did you tell him before or after he called it a 64?  And it still has nothing to do with ethics.  Have you never changed your mind on something upon re examination or reconsideration?

(Same questions I was asking myself...)

5 hours ago, Just Bob said:

It does.

And so does yours.

You can even underline  or strikethrough...   or change the size.

Bold, italics, or bold italics

Different font

Sorry, it's late. I will stop now.

You see?  I bring out the best in people!  

6 hours ago, Conder101 said:

Uh Oh, memories going. 

 

Imagine that! I am 68. I remember becoming 67; I don't remember becoming 68, i.e., ...the past 11 months. Incredible. "Mother of mercy. Is this the end of Rico?" (Edward G. Robinson, Little Caesar - 1932)

An interesting related reference...

Carrier's Case (Anonymous vs. The Sheriff of London, The Case of Carrier Who Broke Bulk) (1473)  landmark English court case in the history of the definition of larceny.

1 hour ago, VKurtB said:

Think authentication, not grade.

Never mind all that. How come YOUR toolbar doesn't have highlighting in phosphorescent neon colors???

Duplication 

For the record, there were three French 20-franc gold roosters offered for sale in 2019, all of which deserve mention in this thread, as follows:

1899 Piefort Essai (minted on a thick planchet) that was PCGS-graded SP-63 (Splendide MS-60-64)  which was offered for sale for $13,440+ (Luxembourg);

1899 PCGS SP-65  Geoffrey Winstein, Win Numis (I failed to note the price).

1900 NGC PF-67 Matte which was offered for sale by Liberty Coin, CA. for $24,400 (and was either sold or withdrawn from sale).

2 hours ago, Quintus Arrius said:

3 hours ago, VKurtB said:

Umm, hate to break it to you, but THIS is social media.

 

Fake News! I was hacked. All right, all right...  "I coulda been a contender!  I coulda had class!  I coulda been somebody!  Now I am a nobody!  I am nothing but a social media bum, thanks to V  Kurt  B."

25 minutes ago, VKurtB said:

Umm, hate to break it to you, but THIS is social media.

 

6 hours ago, VKurtB said:

Yes, Q, it’s 55 years since you became so disenchanted.  You’ve missed a lot.

Has it been that long? My wife informs me I will be 69 next month. (I remember being 67, but have no memory of 68.) I have been telling people for the past two years I am 70 -- and they say, "You look pretty good for 70." A Mint State 70 sounds pretty good, too. What's all this gotta do with 1970-S proof quarters? Nothing.

7 hours ago, VKurtB said:

The latter. It is 50 years ago now, after all. By the way, the current seller of the 1970-S quarter has been trying to sell it off and on for over four years now. No takers. His expertise is getting “free media” coverage every time he relists the thing.

Yes, Q, it’s 55 years since you became so disenchanted.  You’ve missed a lot.

47 minutes ago, VKurtB said:

Underdogs are underdogs for a reason. In numismatics, their knowledge is “under” that of their peers, and, well, they’re dogs. Rooting for the underdog is hoping that the undeserving win.

I bask in the undeserving love and respect you shower me with VKurtB.

I guess there is a part of me that just wants to see the average Joe get a fair shake.

I have no enemies. I don't crave a following. You won't find me on social media.

As I have stated on a

56 minutes ago, VKurtB said:

 

prior occasion, I may not agree with everything everyone says, but I am constrained to defend, with my life, if necessary, everybody's right to express an opinion.

That, of course, includes you for whom I have a begrudging respect for as the very first person to try to cut me down to size on this Forum. On balance, Coinbuf's, simple "No," was far more devastating. I was forced to give up my job refereeing the RichieRich2020 super heavyweight world championship, from which there is no coming back.😉

[Aside:  I'd be willing to bet Mr. RWB, the scholarly author of the OP -- (which, being unfamiliar with the 1937 D. B. commemorative, was a revelation to me) -- never in his wildest dreams would have thought a straight-forward critique of a COIN WEEK article would provoke such a tangential fury in the hornet's nest this thread has become.]

8 minutes ago, VKurtB said:

Check your 1904-O examples. Lots of PL in that date and Mint Mark. 

(Can't. All I've pretty much  got left are Roosters, remember?)

11 minutes ago, VKurtB said:

It is obvious how these 1970-S quarters came to be. First, ALL (and all means all) 1970-S quarters are proofs, because only proofs were struck as 1970-S quarters. Clearly, some clown, who is probably an ex-employee of the San Francisco Mint, inserted a few similar sized world coins into the planchet flow in the quarter line at San Francisco in 1970. Then the proof quarter design was struck over it. Sounds a little “Dan Carr”, doesn’t it? There is no mystery here, and no non-proof 1970 quarter is, or ever has been, involved. Sheesh!

Not trying to be flippant here, but how does an ex-employee gain access to a federal facility -- or is he now an ex-employee who committed the dastardly act as an employee?

1 hour ago, Alex in PA. said:

Quintus, I do not believe you are a Troll.  I think you are very knowledgeable about this business and that you have been around it a long time.  Your writing reminds me of someone from the past.  

This is the baseless pejorative on-line term that has been leveled against me by those who I suspect do not appreciate, or perhaps do not understand, my brand of humor and take exception to my thoughts -- and support of underdogs who simply wish to get a second- third- or fourth opinion without being bullied and run out of town.  You know you are onto something when the numismatic experts among us, shoot down a proposal to simply present a thorn in our collective sides (some eight pages long) to another coin expert as a waste of time only to find out, after referral and consultation, that the expert was delighted to investigate the matter.  Troll?  I've been called worse.  And, Alex, thanks for making the Forum a place where we can all express our thoughts and feelings freely and without fear of unwarranted criticism.

P.S.  Regarding the matter of merger of TPGS...  though I don't deign to know the inside story, I suspect some of the same naysayers now said the same thing re Bowers joining with Stack's, i.e., "Never happen! You don't know what you're talking about! The government won't allow it!"   Really! They are businesses and businesses are run subject to bottom lines. Whether by hostile takeover or a simple determination that merger would be in their best interests, it can happen. You cannot rule it out. Law firms routinely reorganize, merge and dissolve because that's the way businesses survive. And with the Covid-19, we are entering uncharted territory. Anything can happen.

15 minutes ago, gmarguli said:

The idea that PCGS & NGC would merge is ridiculous. Not only would it never pass government approval, but there is too much money to be made by both services with the crossing/cross grading of coins. 

Who needs the cross-grade concession when you have artificial constructs like First Strikes, Limited Editions, special proprietary labels for that rare coin guy on tv, monster boxes certified retroactively and the various mints releasing stockpiled coins nobody knew were there, gold coins formerly housed anonymously in Europe to circumvent U.S. law, shipwrecked coins, ad infinitum, ad nauseam. You're talking small potatoes; I am talking Big Picture IMNSHO -- and I've got the rank amateur status to back it all up! 😉

44 minutes ago, MarkFeld said:

That which you foresee, will never happen. And “never” is a word I use extremely sparingly.

Never say never!  Never underestimate the power of the economic juggernauts amongst us that devour at will. These are perilous times. Lord & Taylor, around since forever, gone. Brooks Brothers, gone too.  The Covid-19 virus has changed the landscape. How many people watching right now ever thought they would cancel a coin convention? I have seen a lot of surprises in my lifetime. Someone's loss is another's opportunity. The pending merger, as far as I am concerned, is a done deal. A few years hence you will marvel at the accurate prediction made by that rank amateur, ME! The one they called Troll!

16 minutes ago, kbbpll said:

I love watching the heavy hitters discuss something. It's a privilege on here. 

Dem's fightin' words. I am glad I gave these gentlemen extra-wide berth...

3 hours ago, Insider said:

I'm sure (?) you know what a mirror surface looks like.   I do, and ever since I was a YN, we knew that coins with a mirror surface that were mot manufactured as Proofs were called Proof-like because they had a mirror surface like a Proof.  Coins that were not Prooflike but were arguably close were called Semi-Prooflike.  As you point out, there is some subjectivity involved - less among knowledgeable and experienced numismatists.   

There is a larger problem with PL coins.  Many obvious PL coins of certain dates are not given that designation (even though their depth of mirror is the same for a common PL) because they would be too valuable.  Those coins need to be borderline DMPL to get the PL designation.  It makes me want to pull my hair out as "any non-numismatist on the street" could see the coins have the identical dept of mirror.  

Your explanation of "mirror" triggered both a memory, and a recollection: "Hmm, so that's what that was." . My brother and I began collecting Morgan dollars straight from the bank, as teenagers. I recall checking tail feathers for one date (we found both 7- and 8-tail varieties, 1878?) AND one that was exceptionally bright and shiny. This was very likely a PL specimen whereof you speak. Now I get it. 

19 hours ago, Insider said:

  The dirty little secret is that all four major services grade about the same.  You just pay more and wait longer...

Someone, I forget who, posited in these chat rooms, that accepting cross-grade requests would "dilute" the brand. I say, Nonsense!  I forsee a merger in the future, like NGC/PCGS et al., or a rechristening, like EXXON, and an end to the pretense of "brands" with the adoption of a scale everyone can live with, without exception or compromise, whether that be Sheldon, with a helpful Photograde-type accompaniment, or some other name. ONE brand with East and West portals, and branch brands as the volume dictates. One wonders how we managed with just the Red Book for nearly two score years. Everybody in favor, say Aye!