The Washington Ship Half Penny

[MikeKing]

For those of you interested in Washingtonia or just Colonial coins in general, you might like this really neat Washington Ship penny I just got from Harry Laibstain.

 

I find it really hard to photograph copper and the first set of images I took were just so lousy, I tried it again, and got something fairly decent.

 

 

It used the obverse of the Small Eagle Cent (John G. Hancock's design)

The edge supposedly uses the legend: PAYABLE IN ANGLESEY LONDON OR LIVERPOOL · X ·

But I can't see it because the darn thing is encased in plastic!

 

The date was changed from 1792 to 1793 before they were used, and clashing of the dies caused buckling that is easy to see on the coin in hand. Best seen between 9 and 12 o'clock on the reverse (ship).

 

The color is a very nice dark brown, with some lighter areas of copper around the Bust and the lettering of the obverse. The surfaces are really clean with nice even wear on the devices.

 

Weight: 161.8 g (10.49 grams) Diameter: 30.4 mm

[dooly]

Very nice love the early coppers

[Zoins]

Wow, that is a beautiful coin!

 

Given that it was meant to be used in Anglesey, London and Liverpool, is this considered a Conder coin?

 

Were these ever exported to and used in the US?

[WinstonWare]

This looks pretty cool Mike

[123cents]

That's one beautiful coin Mike. Thanks for sharing it with us.

[rbrown4]

Mike,

 

That is a very nice looking coin. Interesting as well.

 

Thanks,

[MikeInFL]

Mike, what a fabulous coin. One I've wanted to own for quite some time. Congrats on the NEWP...(an envious)Mike

 

p.s. Old copper is very difficult to photograph. It seems like the color changes depending on the placement of the lights. Try experimenting with a different angle of incidence and I think you'll find the "sweet spot" in photographing this one.

[bsshog40]

Very nice old copper there Mike.

[CarolinaCollector]

Luv it!

[SkyMan]

That's a very attractive coin Mike! Good going on the Newp.

[Hoot]

But I can't see it because the darn thing is encased in plastic!

 

Crack it!!! Then get your butt down to this EAC convention with all of your newly acquired pieces!

 

Very beautiful Mike!

 

Hoot

[D.D.]

Very nice!

[michael]

For those of you interested in Washingtonia or just Colonial coins in general, you might like this really neat Washington Ship penny I just got from Harry Laibstain.

 

 

SUPERB

[MBA101]

You have to love that design. Nice pick-up!

[MikeKing]

Wow, that is a beautiful coin!

 

Given that it was meant to be used in Anglesey, London and Liverpool, is this considered a Conder coin?

 

Were these ever exported to and used in the US?

 

Zoins, thanks, and my answer to both your questions is 'I don't know'.

 

I must have a mental block when it comes to Conder tokens because I've been through this before and can't remember for the life of me what they are all about. Maybe Conder101 will see this and clear things up.

 

I haven't looked at Breen yet, about this coin, so maybe he says something about whether they've ever come to the US or not.

[Conder101]

Yes it is a Conder token, Middlesex 1051 or 1051a. 1051a has a plain edge and is extremely rare, 1051 has the inscription listed above and is, for Conder tokens, considered to be common.

 

The obverse is thought to have been engraved by Gregory Hancock. I haven't traced the engraver of the reverse yet. I'm fairly sure it was used for other tokens but I have been unable to locate them with a quick scan. I recognize the edge inscription is a common one from a merchant from another county, but unfortunately there is no index of edge inscriptions that would let me link it quickly to the issuer. (That index is a future project of mine.) Wait a minute, got it,it was the Paris Mine in Anglesey (at least at first). But they were not coining in 1793. Their last issue was struck by Boulton in Warwickshire in 1791. It may have been used by someone else, I'll have to check. Although the washington small eagle cent is thought by some to have circulated in the US (Not likely) with the halfpenny that is not likely. These are more likely an anonymous issue intended to be sold to collectors.

[MikeKing]

Conder101, can you explain it so it gets through my thick head; what IS a conder token?

 

And if the edge (supposedly) reads: PAYABLE IN ANGLESEY LONDON OR LIVERPOOL · X ·

 

were they used as money an Anglesey London or Liverpool?

[Conder101]

Conder token is the general term used to refer to tokens issued by the private citizens/general public/merchants in England, Wales, Scotland, and Ireland between 1787 and 1804. (Very few were issued after 1797 though since at that time they were outlawed and the official cartwheel coinage of Pence and two pence pieces by Matthew Boulton in 1797 satisfied the needs of commerce.) They are called Conder tokens because James Conder, a draper from Ipswich in Sussex (and an issuer of tokens himself), wrote in 1795 a catalog of the varieties of tokens in circulation that became the standard reference work for the series until the book by Atkins on the tokens was published in 1890. The term Conder token is normally only commonly used in the United States though. In England they are refered to as "18th century provincial token coinage" which reflects the actual title of the work by Dalton and Hamer. Conder token is easier to say.

 

The early tokens were full weight coins, either at the legal Tower Mint standard or even higher, and the quality of the engraving and striking was far higher than that of the light weight counterfeit halfpence and evasion tokens currently in circulation, or even the regal half pence or farthings last struck from 1770 - 1775. (The counterfeits and evasion pieces made up 90% of the coins in circulation at the time.) These tokens were issued by merchants and they had several purposes. To facilitate the making of change, to advertise the merchants business, and to provide a profit to the business from the seniorage of the issuing of the coins. After a while the merchants began to realize that they could make more profit from the tokens if they stopped listing who issued the token because then they would not have to redeem them on the demand and the anonymous issues began. At this point some private citizens probably also got into the act. Often these anonymous pieces were also lighter in weight resulting in even more profit. Then lightweight contemporary counterfeits began appearing of the issues of the most popular and largest issuers of the genuine tokens.

 

With so many different high quality tokens in wide circulation, it became a major fad to assemble cabinets of as many different varieties as possible. This opened up a new market for the manufacturers, the production of new varieties but either creating new ides and design, or by muling unrelated dies to create tokens specificly for sale to collectors. And then finally the collectors themselves got into the act having private tokens struck for themselves that they could use as tradebait to acquire other rare tokens that they needed for their collections. Sometimes it can be tough to tell which catagory a given token falls into.

 

And if the edge (supposedly) reads: PAYABLE IN ANGLESEY LONDON OR LIVERPOOL · X ·

 

were they used as money an Anglesey London or Liverpool?

The Parys Mine (got the spelling wrong in the first post) was located in Angelsey and the tokens struck for them did circulate there. The reference to "Payable in" indicates the location where the tokens could be taken for redemption in legal coinage or government paper currency. The Parys mine had corporate offices located in Angelsey, London, and Liverpool and the tokens could be redeemed at any of the corporate offices. The genuine Parys mine coinage back in 1787 through the 1791 issues were well received and did circulate widely as they were well made, full weight, and redeemable. As such they were acceptable most everywhere. The use of the edge on the Washington ship token though does not mean that it was a Parys mine issue. Often the manufacturers of the tokens would make up large quantities of planchets ahead of time, especially if they had large orders and more than one order for the same issuer, in anticipation of future coinage. If further orders didn't come, they would often either use the planchets at random for the anonymous issues, issuers to market to collectors, or sell them to other manufacturers as ready made planchets.