Pricing: 1864 Bronze Indian 1c NGC PF66 BN

[gmarguli]

I just purchased the following coin from a Legend Auction:

 

 

Auction

 

I was surprised at how cheap it went. At least it seemed cheap to me. I paid $1275 for it. The last Greysheet I have (6 months old) shows this coin in PF65 at $1000/$1100. The last Heritage sale of a PF66BN was $2761, but it was a PCGS rattler slab.

 

Have the prices for these dropped significantly recently or did it just sell cheap or did it actually sell for a fair price?

[MunkyMan95]

Looks kinda ugly to me... Not what I would think of as a proof. Maybe that's why it went lower than you expected?

[gmarguli]

I agree it's kind of ugly. Hopefully with a little curation the true beauty of this coin will shine thru.

 

However, the picture may be off as here is the description: "Surprisingly strong mirrors are flashy and show off crisp and clean surfaces. A mellow layer of golden brown toning evenly blankets both sides. There are NO spots or stains. Miss Liberty and the details are exceptionally struck. This is a wonderful example of an extremely low mintage coin-there are just 150 pieces minted."

[zrlevin]

I think it is purdy...

 

All it needs is to lose that slab.

[EZ_E]

"Surprisingly strong mirrors are flashy and show off crisp and clean surfaces. A mellow layer of golden brown toning evenly blankets both sides. There are NO spots or stains. Miss Liberty and the details are exceptionally struck. This is a wonderful example of an extremely low mintage coin-there are just 150 pieces minted."

 

Damn, Greg, you scored! Sweet!

 

I have no idea of the pricing structure but I very seriously doubt that there has been a dip in price. I think that this coin was sabotaged because of the poor photo, especially if the description is anywhere near true.

[MAULEMALL]

"Surprisingly strong mirrors are flashy and show off crisp and clean surfaces. A mellow layer of golden brown toning evenly blankets both sides. There are NO spots or stains. Miss Liberty and the details are exceptionally struck. This is a wonderful example of an extremely low mintage coin-there are just 150 pieces minted."

 

Damn, Greg, you scored! Sweet!

 

I have no idea of the pricing structure but I very seriously doubt that there has been a dip in price. I think that this coin was sabotaged because of the poor photo, especially if the description is anywhere near true.

Wow,,I agree with EZ...150 minted??All I am going to say is Congratulations!

 

 

 

And please post pics when you get the coin..

[physics-fan3.14]

I'm guessing it is probably alot better in hand. I agree, the poor pictures probably helped you out.

[JamminJ]

Hopefully with a little curation the true beauty of this coin will shine thru.

 

Here's hoping for some good results.

[IGWT]

Hopefully with a little doctoring the true beauty of this coin will shine thru.

 

[WinstonWare]

Hopefully with a little doctoring the true beauty of this coin will shine thru.

 

 

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[gmarguli]

Hopefully with a little doctoring the true beauty of this coin will shine thru.

 

 

I'm 100% OK with that statement too!

[IGWT]

Hopefully with a lot of doctoring the true beauty of this coin will shine thru.

 

[gmarguli]

Hopefully with a lot of doctoring the true beauty of this coin will shine thru.

 

 

I'm 100% OK with that statement too!

[IGWT]

Hopefully with a lot of doctoring the blue beauty of this coin will shine thru.

 

[gmarguli]

Hopefully with a lot of doctoring the blue beauty of this coin will shine thru.

 

 

I'm 100% OK with that statement too!

[WinstonWare]

I’m actually interested to see what this coin ends up looking like…

[zrlevin]

I’m actually interested to see what this coin ends up looking like…

 

Take a good before picture, though.

[IGWT]

Hopefully with a lot of doctoring the coin will become a blue beauty.

 

[gmarguli]

Hopefully with a lot of doctoring the coin will become a blue beauty.

 

 

Let me save you some trouble about ing all the possibilities.

 

My goal is to make the most money possible. I will likely do this by:

 

1) Cracking the coin out of the current NGC PF66 slab.

 

2) Use chemicals on it to make the coin the nicest looking possible. Basically stripping the dirt and grime off the surfaces and bringing out the mirrors. All these chemicals will be industry accepted and available at most coin shops.

 

3) Submit the coin to a grading service. Which TPG is unknown at this time and won't be decided until I see the results and factor in other things, like other coins I need to submit at the same time.

 

4) Get the grade bump (hopefully). Going to PF67 is hard, but not impossible. I've done it 3 times in the last year or so.

 

5) Sell the coin to Mark Feld so he can list it on his web site. A forum member will then buy it and post how original it looks.

[Wihlborg]

 

John

[MAULEMALL]

Hopefully with a lot of doctoring the coin will become a blue beauty.

 

 

Let me save you some trouble about ing all the possibilities.

 

My goal is to make the most money possible. I will likely do this by:

 

1) Cracking the coin out of the current NGC PF66 slab.

 

2) Use chemicals on it to make the coin the nicest looking possible. Basically stripping the dirt and grime off the surfaces and bringing out the mirrors. All these chemicals will be industry accepted and available at most coin shops.

 

3) Submit the coin to a grading service. Which TPG is unknown at this time and won't be decided until I see the results and factor in other things, like other coins I need to submit at the same time.

 

4) Get the grade bump (hopefully). Going to PF67 is hard, but not impossible. I've done it 3 times in the last year or so.

 

5) Sell the coin to Mark Feld so he can list it on his web site. A forum member will then buy it and post how original it looks.

[MarkFeld]

Hopefully with a lot of doctoring the coin will become a blue beauty.

 

 

Let me save you some trouble about ing all the possibilities.

 

My goal is to make the most money possible. I will likely do this by:

 

1) Cracking the coin out of the current NGC PF66 slab.

 

2) Use chemicals on it to make the coin the nicest looking possible. Basically stripping the dirt and grime off the surfaces and bringing out the mirrors. All these chemicals will be industry accepted and available at most coin shops.

 

3) Submit the coin to a grading service. Which TPG is unknown at this time and won't be decided until I see the results and factor in other things, like other coins I need to submit at the same time.

 

4) Get the grade bump (hopefully). Going to PF67 is hard, but not impossible. I've done it 3 times in the last year or so.

 

5) Sell the coin to Mark Feld so he can list it on his web site. A forum member will then buy it and post how original it looks.

Greg, don't be modest and sell yourself short - if the past is any indication, you hope to accomplish more than merely "stripping the dirt and grime off the surfaces and bringing out the mirrors". You left out the part about the color of the coin (likely) changing, due to a reaction with whatever chemical(s) you use.

 

You call it "curating", while I call it "doctoring", and if the grading companies continue to grade, rather than body-bag such coins, they are in effect, condoning it.

[gmarguli]

Greg, don't be modest and sell yourself short - if the past is any indication, you hope to accomplish more than merely "stripping the dirt and grime off the surfaces and bringing out the mirrors". You left out the part about the color of the coin (likely) changing, due to a reaction with whatever chemical(s) you use.

 

You call it "curating", while I call it "doctoring", and if the grading companies continue to grade, rather than body-bag such coins, they are in effect, condoning it.

 

Color may change. It may not. Odds are greatly against it changing. I don't care either way. I really don't. I'll likely make money if nothing happens to the coin at all, if it cleans up brown, if it turns flaming blue, or something in the middle. If it turns pink, I'll lose. I'll roll the dice.

 

BTW, as far as I know, not all the grading companies will grade it if the color does change. Some of the grading companies may have been swayed by your posts. Not PCGS, NGC, ANACS, or ICG, but perhaps some of the other ones. I haven't contacted ACG or WCG to find out their stance, but they may have been swayed! Perhaps if you call and leave more messages that aren't being returned, it'll make a difference to the other services?

 

However, none of the above matters. Let's stay on topic. Do you think I paid a good price for it?

[MarkFeld]

Greg, don't be modest and sell yourself short - if the past is any indication, you hope to accomplish more than merely "stripping the dirt and grime off the surfaces and bringing out the mirrors". You left out the part about the color of the coin (likely) changing, due to a reaction with whatever chemical(s) you use.

 

You call it "curating", while I call it "doctoring", and if the grading companies continue to grade, rather than body-bag such coins, they are in effect, condoning it.

 

Color may change. It may not. Odds are greatly against it changing. I don't care either way. I really don't. I'll likely make money if nothing happens to the coin at all, if it cleans up brown, if it turns flaming blue, or something in the middle. If it turns pink, I'll lose. I'll roll the dice.

 

BTW, as far as I know, not all the grading companies will grade it if the color does change. Some of the grading companies may have been swayed by your posts. Not PCGS, NGC, ANACS, or ICG, but perhaps some of the other ones. I haven't contacted ACG or WCG to find out their stance, but they may have been swayed! Perhaps if you call and leave more messages that aren't being returned, it'll make a difference to the other services?

 

However, none of the above matters. Let's stay on topic. Do you think I paid a good price for it?

In answer to your question, it appears that you paid a "good price" for it.

 

Since you brought up the topic, if you don't care if the color changes or not, why not use a different substance or chemical for "stripping the dirt and grime off the surfaces and bringing out the mirrors" without (possibly) changing the color?

[gmarguli]

Since you brought up the topic, if you don't care if the color changes or not, why not use a different substance or chemical for "stripping the dirt and grime off the surfaces and bringing out the mirrors" without (possibly) changing the color?

 

In 100% honesty, I will... as soon as you or someone else lets me know what chemical will work as well as MS70 in striping surfaces without killing the luster. In my experience, nothing else comes close. MS70 is wonderful. I use it on not just copper, but silver and gold. It works great to remove dark toning without killing the surfaces.

 

However, until I see the coin in hand, I cannot tell what, if anything, that I will do to it. It may be OK as is and I'll just sell it as is. I may not use MS70 and go for other chemicals. I may use a combination. We'll see.

[michael]

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

Greg, don't be modest and sell yourself short - if the past is any indication, you hope to accomplish more than merely "stripping the dirt and grime off the surfaces and bringing out the mirrors". You left out the part about the color of the coin (likely) changing, due to a reaction with whatever chemical(s) you use.

 

You call it "curating", while I call it "doctoring", and if the grading companies continue to grade, rather than body-bag such coins, they are in effect, condoning it.

 

 

 

[JamminJ]

Hopefully with a lot of doctoring the coin will become a blue beauty.

 

 

Let me save you some trouble about ing all the possibilities.

 

My goal is to make the most money possible. I will likely do this by:

 

1) Cracking the coin out of the current NGC PF66 slab.

 

2) Use chemicals on it to make the coin the nicest looking possible. Basically stripping the dirt and grime off the surfaces and bringing out the mirrors. All these chemicals will be industry accepted and available at most coin shops.

 

3) Submit the coin to a grading service. Which TPG is unknown at this time and won't be decided until I see the results and factor in other things, like other coins I need to submit at the same time.

 

4) Get the grade bump (hopefully). Going to PF67 is hard, but not impossible. I've done it 3 times in the last year or so.

 

5) Sell the coin to Mark Feld so he can list it on his web site. A forum member will then buy it and post how original it looks.

 

But you are just the caretaker for the next generation of coin collectors!

[gmarguli]

Hopefully with a lot of doctoring the coin will become a blue beauty.

 

 

Let me save you some trouble about ing all the possibilities.

 

My goal is to make the most money possible. I will likely do this by:

 

1) Cracking the coin out of the current NGC PF66 slab.

 

2) Use chemicals on it to make the coin the nicest looking possible. Basically stripping the dirt and grime off the surfaces and bringing out the mirrors. All these chemicals will be industry accepted and available at most coin shops.

 

3) Submit the coin to a grading service. Which TPG is unknown at this time and won't be decided until I see the results and factor in other things, like other coins I need to submit at the same time.

 

4) Get the grade bump (hopefully). Going to PF67 is hard, but not impossible. I've done it 3 times in the last year or so.

 

5) Sell the coin to Mark Feld so he can list it on his web site. A forum member will then buy it and post how original it looks.

 

But you are just the caretaker for the next generation of coin collectors!

 

I absolutely believe that load of *spoon*! However, this caretaker wants to get paid.

 

Edited: Hey, looks like "pure unbridled enthusiasm" is a banned word here.

[IGWT]

Let me save you some trouble about ing all the possibilities.

 

Bummer; I was having fun.

 

To what extent do "industry standards" and "market acceptability" determine what you will and will not do to a coin? For example, if the TPGs started slabbing professionally whizzed or tooled coins, would you make a coin "better" using these methods if you could sell it for more money?

[chinook]

I agree it's kind of ugly. Hopefully with a little curation the true beauty of this coin will shine thru.

 

However, the picture may be off as here is the description: "Surprisingly strong mirrors are flashy and show off crisp and clean surfaces. A mellow layer of golden brown toning evenly blankets both sides. There are NO spots or stains. Miss Liberty and the details are exceptionally struck. This is a wonderful example of an extremely low mintage coin-there are just 150 pieces minted."

 

It appears to have the perfect amount of "dirt" that chemicals just love.