Am I a coin doctor?

[Hoot]

About a year ago, I bought a 1797 gripped edge cent. It was scudzy. All kinds of scratches and vedigris, bent from someone having tried to use it as a screwdriver at one time, and badly coated with grease to give it some "color." So, this July, I stripped the coin of its grease and stuck it in my pocket. Also in my pocket was lots of change (imagine that), and a grounding screw from an outlet. Somewhere along the line, I took the coin out of my pocket and un-bent it with a sledge hammer between two pieces of wood.

 

Months passed and the scratches went away. The coin wore like a coin should in one's pocket, lost a bit of detail and was freed from the verdigris that plagued it. The surfaces still have some porosity, but not bad, and I didn't want to wear it down to the point that all the porosity was gone, since that would make it no better than a "Good-something."

 

I took the coin out of my pocket, rubbed it down with Deller's Darkener, brushed it, cooked it in a brown paper grocery bag for 5 or 6 hours at 300 degrees, then brushed it again.

 

I now have a nice gripped edge 1797 S-120b cent. A little less "detail" (which is good in this case) and vastly better surfaces. Here's the before and after pics:

 

 

Hoot

[EZ_E]

Thanks for sharing your technique, Mark.

 

I liken this to conservation vs. doctoring.

 

Besides, odds are that it will not grade anyway due to environmental damage, i.e. porosity.

 

I think that the appearance of the coin was improved many times fold!

[WinstonWare]

I think the cooking with "Deller's Darkener" puts it over the top. Yes...

[MunkyMan95]

Sorry Hoot, you're a doctor. The coin does look a lot better, though.

[gmarguli]

Yes, you are a coin doctor. Well, perhaps. Not sure what a coin doctor is or if it is good or bad, but you're probably one.

 

Looks much better than it did before. Looks like someone tried to scrape off the gunk before. Now whiz away the porosity and black gunk and bake for a few more hours and you'll have a really nice coin. Mind of A Rabbit, Hands of A Bee!

[Hoot]

Yes, you are a coin doctor. Well, perhaps. Not sure what a coin doctor is or if it is good or bad, but you're probably one.

 

Looks much better than it did before. Looks like someone tried to scrape off the gunk before. Now whiz away the porosity and black gunk and bake for a few more hours and you'll have a really nice coin.

 

Is the coins posse after me now? Wanted dead or alive, or just dead (as TomB would have me)?

 

I think you're right about someone having tried to scrape off the gunk before - it was pretty awful.

 

I wish I could take a good photo of the coin, as the "black gunk" is really not black, just dark brown. I'd whiz away the porosity but my Dremel Tool is broken.

 

Mind of A Rabbit, Hands of A Bee!

 

[jom]

I'd whiz away the porosity but my Dremel Tool is broken.

 

Send the coin down here....mine works. I can even bring out the ol' paint sprayer if you like for an added touch of color.

 

jom

[IGWT]

No, not quite a doctor; more like a nurse.

[MikeInFL]

Am I a coin doctor?

 

Judging from the information provided, you are certainly on your way...

 

Now get it holdered at a TPG, use others to pass it off to an unsuspecting collector for financial gain, repeat a few hundred times, and you'll be eleveated to the same level as some (of the scumbags) who frequent this forum -- those who care more about profit than the people they are decieving, the hobby they are hurting, or the original coins they are doctoring.

 

Take care...Mike

[Zoins]

Should we have a poll? Do you like the coin better before or after the doctoring?

[MikeInFL]

Should we have a poll? Do you like the coin better before or after the doctoring?

 

People like drugs...so should we always rely on what people like to give us direction on what's right or wrong?

 

To answer your question directly, I like the after coin, as I'm sure virtually everybody does. However, the problem I have is what will happen to the coin after it leaves Hoot's hands...Mike

 

 

[Hoot]

Am I a coin doctor?

 

Judging from the information provided, you are certainly on your way...

 

Now get it holdered at a TPG, use others to pass it off to an unsuspecting collector for financial gain, repeat a few hundred times, and you'll be eleveated to the same level as some (of the scumbags) who frequent this forum -- those who care more about profit than the people they are decieving, the hobby they are hurting, or the original coins they are doctoring.

 

Take care...Mike

 

 

If anything, this coin will lose me money. I cracked it out of an NCS holder. The person who had "worked" on it previously had nearly wrecked the coin. It will never get holdered by me. Unless some fool sends it to NCS, it won't see the inside of a slab again - it surely shouldn't. When I sell it, it will be described for what it is - porous and re-colored. For now, however, it rests happily with me.

 

I rather enjoyed un-wrecking the coin and hope that it will be passed over countless generations as such. Its legacy as a screwdriver, brillo palette, and culture medium for copper acetate and/or copper oxide will hopefully be long forgotten.

 

Hoot

[EZ_E]

I rather enjoyed un-wrecking the coin and hope that it will be passed over countless generations as such. Its legacy as a screwdriver, brillo palette, and culture medium for copper acetate and/or copper oxide will hopefully be long forgotten.

 

I give my resounding "AMEN" to that, Hootster!

[Here]

Thank you for doing that to your coin. That's what should be done with it. What was the other option? Leave it stupid looking?

 

 

 

Jerry

[relicsncoins]

I think I would've just soaked it in olive oil for a few months. You probably wouldn't have lost any detail and the corrosion and verdigree would've been removed. It would've also made the porosity look less evident.

 

JJ

[MAULEMALL]

Am I a coin doctor?

 

Judging from the information provided, you are certainly on your way...

 

Now get it holder-ed at a TPG, use others to pass it off to an unsuspecting collector for financial gain, repeat a few hundred times, and you'll be elevated to the same level as some (of the scumbags) who frequent this forum -- those who care more about profit than the people they are deceiving, the hobby they are hurting, or the original coins they are doctoring.

 

Take care...Mike

 

 

If anything, this coin will lose me money. I cracked it out of an NCS holder. The person who had "worked" on it previously had nearly wrecked the coin. It will never get holdered by me. Unless some fool sends it to NCS, it won't see the inside of a slab again - it surely shouldn't. When I sell it, it will be described for what it is - porous and re-colored. For now, however, it rests happily with me.

 

I rather enjoyed un-wrecking the coin and hope that it will be passed over countless generations as such. Its legacy as a screwdriver, brillo palette, and culture medium for copper acetate and/or copper oxide will hopefully be long forgotten.

 

Hoot

Hoot it looks as though you have an admirer,,,I think it looks a ton better

[michael]

no

 

as on the reverse of the coin it is not improved

 

and on the obverse just so so

 

and you can see what it was and it does look played with

 

so no you are not a doctor

 

a coin doctor improves things to the point where it sells for lots more/multiples over what it would have sold for in the first place

 

and this coin is not an example of this as all its former problems can still be seen

[michael]

and hoot you are not doing this with many coins then re-submitting them and getting them slabbed higher grades and then shilling them through your friends on a regular basis

just for profit

 

so no you are not a coin gregster

[Hoot]

I think I would've just soaked it in olive oil for a few months. You probably wouldn't have lost any detail and the corrosion and verdigree would've been removed. It would've also made the porosity look less evident.

 

My intent was for it to lose detail. The scratches from someone having tried to remove the verdigris were pretty awful. I wore the coin down (just by carrying it as pocket change) past the scratches. The detail "grade" dropped, but the surfaces were improved quite a bit. The porosity was also decreased, but verdigris has a way of leaving its mark ad-infinitum.

 

BTW, when I removed the thick grease originally on the coin, I only took that down to the original surfaces, just like olive oil. I've used olive oil on coins with gunk, and it's no better or worse than anything else, just slow.

 

Please note: I respect everyone's position here. Some will consider me a coin doctor and some won't, but it matters not at all to me. What matters to me is that when a coin leaves my hands, it's in no worse shape than it was when I received it, and perhaps better off, in some way. I reckon it's a matter of perspective, yes? Caring for copper coinage is something I'm rather passionate about.

 

Hoot

[Wihlborg]

Mark,

 

Are you a coin doctor? No, not in my mind.

 

I remember you telling me about this coin a few weeks ago. You described the damage it suffered and that you had ‘un-bent’ it, and had been carrying it around in your pocket in an effort to clean up some of the damage on its surfaces. This is little different than normal circulation wear as far as I’m concerned.

 

You did re-color the coin so it would look more like a coin its age should, but it was not done to deceive another, it was done in an effort to transform a badly abused, ratty looking coin into a more palatable example for your personal enjoyment.

 

I consider what you have done to this coin as conservation. Enjoy owning it my friend.

 

John

[EZ_E]

Mark, would it improve the coin if you carried it as pocket change as it is now and then let it envelope tone for a bit?

[truthteller]

Am I a coin doctor?

 

Judging from the information provided, you are certainly on your way...

 

Now get it holdered at a TPG, use others to pass it off to an unsuspecting collector for financial gain, repeat a few hundred times, and you'll be eleveated to the same level as some (of the scumbags) who frequent this forum -- those who care more about profit than the people they are decieving, the hobby they are hurting, or the original coins they are doctoring.

 

Take care...Mike

 

 

 

 

 

 

TRUTH

[TomB]

Well, you are a doctor...

[GAB]

Sometimes, just like people, coins NEED to go BACK to the "doctor", because the 1st one didn't know what he/she was doing. The choices are: 1) Let the patient die or 2) Try to cure the patient. In this case, I think the patient still has some useful life ahead of it !!

Great job !!

thx, GAB

[RWB]

Interesting discussion and interesting coin (along with the one from your ANA class). Considering the techniques and results, I have to say more of an "intern" than board-certified-to-practice doctor of deception.

 

Now, as a Doctor of Numismatology, that is an unquestioned "Yes!"

[MikeInFL]

Am I a coin doctor?

 

Judging from the information provided, you are certainly on your way...

 

Now get it holdered at a TPG, use others to pass it off to an unsuspecting collector for financial gain, repeat a few hundred times, and you'll be eleveated to the same level as some (of the scumbags) who frequent this forum -- those who care more about profit than the people they are decieving, the hobby they are hurting, or the original coins they are doctoring.

 

Take care...Mike

 

 

If anything, this coin will lose me money. I cracked it out of an NCS holder. The person who had "worked" on it previously had nearly wrecked the coin. It will never get holdered by me. Unless some fool sends it to NCS, it won't see the inside of a slab again - it surely shouldn't. When I sell it, it will be described for what it is - porous and re-colored. For now, however, it rests happily with me.

 

I rather enjoyed un-wrecking the coin and hope that it will be passed over countless generations as such. Its legacy as a screwdriver, brillo palette, and culture medium for copper acetate and/or copper oxide will hopefully be long forgotten.

 

Hoot

 

It is not a surprise to hear that your intent is pure, Hoot.

 

Please understand the my previous post was not directly intended for you, but to point out the subtle difference between the actions -- intent.

 

I can relate to wanting to improve a coin in certain circumstances and for the sake of the coin -- to stop corrosion for example. While I would not have done what you have, neither would it be fair to consider these actions in and of themselves on par with the "doctors" but I think there is a fine line. That's a line that I, personally, will go nowhere near....Mike

[EZ_E]

Let's just come right out and say it, people:

 

Hoot, you're evil! A mad scientist, even!

 

 

Will you be roasting lit'le children for your Thanksgiving feast tomorrow? Probably.

 

[Hoot]

Well, you are a doctor...

 

Dr. of Vacuousity, Mark (DVM).

 

Considering the techniques and results, I have to say more of an "intern" than board-certified-to-practice doctor of deception.

 

Now, as a Doctor of Numismatology, that is an unquestioned "Yes!"

 

 

Please understand the my previous post was not directly intended for you, but to point out the subtle difference between the actions -- intent.

 

Well understood and no offense taken! I believe that all these matters are shades of gray and we each reside in part of the spectrum that makes us comfortable.

 

Let's just come right out and say it, people:

 

Hoot, you're evil! A mad scientist, even!

 

 

Will you be roasting lit'le children for your Thanksgiving feast tomorrow? Probably.

 

 

Kid pie...

[michael]

 

 

Now get it holdered at a TPG, use others to pass it off to an unsuspecting collector for financial gain, repeat a few hundred times, and you'll be eleveated to the same level as some (of the scumbags) G and his gimp M lolwho frequent this forum -- those who care more about profit than the people they are decieving, the hobby they are hurting, or the original coins they are doctoring.

[MAULEMALL]

 

Now get it holdered at a TPG, use others to pass it off to an unsuspecting collector for financial gain, repeat a few hundred times, and you'll be eleveated to the same level as some (of the scumbags) G and his gimp M lolwho frequent this forum -- those who care more about profit than the people they are decieving, the hobby they are hurting, or the original coins they are doctoring.

 

We were so proud of you...You were almost making sentences and using punctuation and capitalization......If Thing were here he would call you a but I prefer handicapable