Of the 333 million presumably alive and well and residing in the United States today, how many are "coin collectors?" 1 1

[samclemen3991]

@zadok.  To the best of my knowledge the last coin club in my hometown ended when it's founder, a man named Glenn died in 1982. There could be some private affair but if so I am not in their loop.  A fellow named Brian is one of the sons of Glenn.  He has been a vest pocket dealer for as long as I have known him.  We speak at least monthly so I would be surprised if he wouldn't have mentioned a coin club to me.

Sadly, due to a health crisis in December I have been  forced to isolate from the public for the last 4 months.  Otherwise I would have liked to attend one of their meetings.  They meet at a Perkin's the last Friday of each month and I have an open invitation.  If nothing else, I am hoping to find people there who would be interested in some of my many Numismatic books.  Neither the Library or the Hospital Aux. group will take them.  However at this time most of their members focus on buying junk silver.  James

[GoldFinger1969]

On 4/30/2024 at 6:51 PM, samclemen3991 said:

@zadok.  To the best of my knowledge the last coin club in my hometown ended when it's founder, a man named Glenn died in 1982.

Wow, that's a long time pre-internet to be without a local coin club.  And on the heels of a decade of phenemonal gains for bullion and coins. 

[zadok]

On 4/30/2024 at 6:51 PM, samclemen3991 said:

@zadok.  To the best of my knowledge the last coin club in my hometown ended when it's founder, a man named Glenn died in 1982. There could be some private affair but if so I am not in their loop.  A fellow named Brian is one of the sons of Glenn.  He has been a vest pocket dealer for as long as I have known him.  We speak at least monthly so I would be surprised if he wouldn't have mentioned a coin club to me.

Sadly, due to a health crisis in December I have been  forced to isolate from the public for the last 4 months.  Otherwise I would have liked to attend one of their meetings.  They meet at a Perkin's the last Friday of each month and I have an open invitation.  If nothing else, I am hoping to find people there who would be interested in some of my many Numismatic books.  Neither the Library or the Hospital Aux. group will take them.  However at this time most of their members focus on buying junk silver.  James

...thats unfortunate...u mite try going to a local coin show when u can travel n ask sponsors if they r aware of any clubs?...as for ur books, some schools have student coin clubs n mite desire a donation?...

[Henri Charriere]

On 4/19/2024 at 3:34 PM, VKurtB said:

The TPGS have to know how many members they have. It’s a simple database record count. 

The Rules regarding membership and the privileges accorded each, are evolving.  My understanding, with respect to NGC only (which I learned the hard way, is:

a).  Whether you be a Lurker (or the more socially-acceptable, Guest) you must be a paid member if you wish to leave a comment. ("Visiting dignitaries" may participate with a referral made as a polite inquiry made to management.)

b).  As regarding the Set Registry, not all details are accessible to all viewers. It takes but a single coin to start one of your own and membership, apparently, is not a prerequisite.

Both the  numbers of members and set registrants are known, but as was made clearly recently, death does not result in disenrollment. Those disinclined from participating in the Chat Board are not listed and cannot be contacted. Many members have disengaged from active participation in the coin collecting community. Many set registrants do not wish to be contacted and [on PCGS' Set Registry, many members block anyone from viewing their sets!  Their sets are not public.]  Obviously, this prevents nosy members like me from getting an accurate measure of my standing with respect to the competition I face.

I believe I am the most transparent of members as regarding my collection, and accessibility but can appreciate the concerns others may have for their holdings. To each his own.  

Note:  if I am mistaken in any assumption I've made, feel free to correct me.

(Posted at the discretion of Moderation.)

 

[samclemen3991]

Sometimes life is so odd.  Back in January I pitched an idea to my friend Paul (director of our local county museum) that we build some sort of display using my coin books and some low level coins from the 1865-1895 era.

This morning he sent me a reply and told me to give him a material list.  The vast majority of my books revolve around Seated Coins.

I have Bowers book on Seated silver, but wonder if the first three volumes of Bugert's books on Seated halves would be too esoteric?

I have the Brigg's book on Seated Quarters and the Flynn book on Seated Quarters.  One book might be enough but not sure which.

I also wonder if we could not make it a hands on grading opportunity.  I have Brown & Dunn, Making the Grade Picture guide, 3 copies Photograde, 3 copies ANA grading guide.

I also have Breen's Encyclopedia, more than a dozen Bowers Redbook series on specific coins, many of Bowers books like Type collecting, Silver dollars etc.  Would a lending library idea be something to pitch?

Just my first thoughts but if anyone has suggestions let me know.  James

 

[Henri Charriere]

I cannot remember the last time I actually used a coin.  Hot dog carts (food carts generally) you local hardware store, rent collecting, banks, museums. cable companies, commuter rail systems, grocery stores, with the advent of SNAP and loss of food stamps, Social Security (for the most part) theaters, parking meters (which have switched to cards or receipts) laundromats which have switched to cards, toll collections which have been abolished in favor of swipe cards and EZ- passes, it won't be long before coins, tokens and currency fall into disuse. About the only business that accepts cash on the money side of the equation is PCGS -- and yes, I used that option. (I am sorry to report a concern that fabricated copper bars and Prison Life magazine are the only two concerns that went on the lam with my cash money. I dodged a bullet with Northwest Territorial Mint, but who can blame them?  At the time spot silver was in a free-fall.) With respect to PCGS, I figured if you can't trust a TPGS that handles priceless coin relics daily, whom can you trust? 

[GoldFinger1969]

On 5/1/2024 at 2:27 PM, zadok said:

...thats unfortunate...u mite try going to a local coin show when u can travel n ask sponsors if they r aware of any clubs?...as for ur books, some schools have student coin clubs n mite desire a donation?...

I think today's forums like these here at NGC have supplemented the old coin clubs.  Sill nice to meet in person, but you can post anytime on any topic and get people from all over the country to provide information.

[VKurtB]

On 5/2/2024 at 7:43 AM, Henri Charriere said:

The Rules regarding membership and the privileges accorded each, are evolving.  My understanding, with respect to NGC only (which I learned the hard way, is:

a).  Whether you be a Lurker (or the more socially-acceptable, Guest) you must be a paid member if you wish to leave a comment. ("Visiting dignitaries" may participate with a referral made as a polite inquiry made to management.)

b).  As regarding the Set Registry, not all details are accessible to all viewers. It takes but a single coin to start one of your own and membership, apparently, is not a prerequisite.

Both the  numbers of members and set registrants are known, but as was made clearly recently, death does not result in disenrollment. Those disinclined from participating in the Chat Board are not listed and cannot be contacted. Many members have disengaged from active participation in the coin collecting community. Many set registrants do not wish to be contacted and [on PCGS' Set Registry, many members block anyone from viewing their sets!  Their sets are not public.]  Obviously, this prevents nosy members like me from getting an accurate measure of my standing with respect to the competition I face.

I believe I am the most transparent of members as regarding my collection, and accessibility but can appreciate the concerns others may have for their holdings. To each his own.  

Note:  if I am mistaken in any assumption I've made, feel free to correct me.

(Posted at the discretion of Moderation.)

 

I believe we are talking about different kinds of NGC memberships. Being on the discussion board is free, and NOT the type of membership to which I refer. Neither is having a Registry Set. The type of membership to which I refer is the ability to submit coins directly for grading, without an intermediary. The one for which I pay $149 a year. For those who do the math, I was a serious collector for 31 years before I even THOUGHT of sending ANY coin to a TPGS (old small soap bar ANACS), and I switched EXCLUSIVELY to NGC another 16 years later. And here we are another 14 years later. Still using NGC exclusively. AND I have NEVER “coin roll hunted” nor ever searched change for errors or varieties. I DO search and keep extraordinarily excellent coins, but not “different”, which is a foole’s errand. 
 

I DID have a Nebraska ATB “what’s that garbage in that window pane” variety fall into my lap, and a 1943/42 nickel from my 1963 blue Whitman folder magically appear. I had it for over 50 years before detecting the variety 

Edited May 2 by VKurtB

[zadok]

On 5/2/2024 at 11:23 AM, GoldFinger1969 said:

I think today's forums like these here at NGC have supplemented the old coin clubs.  Sill nice to meet in person, but you can post anytime on any topic and get people from all over the country to provide information.

...its like going to that backyard bar-b-que in person or watching it on zoom, the pulled pork is so much sweeter if u r there, plus at the bar-b-que u can avoid the demented outlier here not so much....

[World Colonial]

On 4/29/2024 at 11:05 AM, samclemen3991 said:

Sorry World Colonial but you come off about as cheerful as a Thomas Hardy novel.  Are the skies a perpetual  November gray in your world?

I don't consider myself a pessimist because the price level doesn't have anything to do with actual coin collecting.  This was the context of my post.

On 4/29/2024 at 11:05 AM, samclemen3991 said:

I have to dispute some of your conclusions.  You put the survival of coin collecting on the backs of old white men.  I don't think that is true.  I live in a small midwestern town.  In January I was surprised to see an ad in the local grocery store flyer for a new coin club.  The contact person's name is Jose Guerrero and yes he is Spanish.  They have 14 founding members.  2 white college kids, 2 females and the rest are of various non white backgrounds but all know each other thru working at the same Turkey processing plant.  This may not be the future YOU see for coin collecting, and for all I know this group might be as rare as a sun beam in your world but I wouldn't write the future off.  

My posts are long sometimes, but that's not what I said.  I'm not questioning the future of coin collecting or even collecting of US coinage.  

I'm writing about the price level.  I could be wrong but the reasoning I use isn't unrealistic.  That's about the only reason anyone actually cares how many collectors are in the US.  

On 4/29/2024 at 11:05 AM, samclemen3991 said:

Also, I have yet to get two people give the same definition of woke but that is a different matter.  

For purposes of this thread, it's sufficient to state that it's any movement toward rejection of "traditional" culture however demonstrated.   In the context of coin collecting, it would be where it becomes "politically incorrect" to prefer the culture represented by the coin and therefore own it.

[VKurtB]

On 5/2/2024 at 5:24 PM, zadok said:

...its like going to that backyard bar-b-que in person or watching it on zoom, the pulled pork is so much sweeter if u r there, plus at the bar-b-que u can avoid the demented outlier here not so much....

BY FAR, the best stuff I EVER learned, including the importance of getting to major shows, in numismatics, was what I learned at live coin club meetings. But then again, it was populated by some of the absolute giants in the field, including two Ferran Zerbe Award winners and a Hall of Fame inductee. Red Rose Coin Club of Lancaster, PA. The Chicago Coin Club is the SECOND most august club to which I belong.

Edited May 4 by VKurtB

[Henri Charriere]

On 5/2/2024 at 6:24 PM, zadok said:

....plus at the bar-b-que u can avoid the demented outlier here not so much....

🐓:  That may very well be a cold carom shot!

Q.A.:  It's okay... at least we get a shout out now and then from our biggest fan. 🤣

[GoldFinger1969]

On 5/3/2024 at 3:45 PM, World Colonial said:

I'm writing about the price level.  I could be wrong but the reasoning I use isn't unrealistic.  That's about the only reason anyone actually cares how many collectors are in the US. 

The PCGS 3000 Index was in a multi-decade bear market ever since the 1989 bubble peak.

[World Colonial]

On 5/4/2024 at 4:08 AM, GoldFinger1969 said:

The PCGS 3000 Index was in a multi-decade bear market ever since the 1989 bubble peak.

Not sure of your point.

If you are implying it's due to recover "eventually" because of this price performance, no it doesn't have to.  No market actually does, especially one that isn't even a market in the sense you imply which coins aren't.

According to the link below, it's still about 60% below the all-time peak, and that's in nominal dollars.  This shouldn't be surprising, since TPG labels and buying coins as "investments" don't have anything to do with actual coin collecting.  The vast majority of coins in this index have no relevance to how the majority collect, with potentially 80% to 90% never buying a single one in these TPG label numbers. 

I've owned two, the 1883-O and 1884-O Morgan dollars in MS-64. Those most likely to be owned by the "average" collector are the 1883 "No cents" nickel, 1938-D Buffalo, later date Mercury dimes, common Morgan and Peace dollars, and circulated 20th century "key" dates like the 1932-D and 1932-S quarters.

That's roughly 2% of the list.

PCGS Price Guide - PCGS3000® Rare Coin Index

Edited May 4 by World Colonial

[GoldFinger1969]

 

Bumping this ahead of the Spam/Malware Threads that have now moved from Currency to Coins.