I spent approximately €700 on MA-Shop and received a counterfeit coin 2 2

[EagleRJO]

On 8/1/2023 at 9:21 PM, 寂静音无 said:

I returned it and the seller refunded it, but I lost about 80 euros

You probably just got a refund for your original purchase price, which is what was expected and better than how some make out.  You can caulk up the rest of what was lost to a lesson learned about the pitfalls of buying precious metals over the internet or raw coins without enough knowledge.

[寂静音无]

On 8/3/2023 at 8:59 AM, EagleRJO said:

You probably just got a refund for your original purchase price, which is what was expected and better than how some make out.  You can caulk up the rest of what was lost to a lesson learned about the pitfalls of buying precious metals over the internet or raw coins without enough knowledge.

Yes, it's a lesson, hopefully others don't go through my process

[寂静音无]

On 8/3/2023 at 3:52 AM, USAuPzlBxBob said:

You got 88% of your money back.

I have overpaid for coins in the past where they are genuine.  An immediate loss, easily on a par with a 12% loss.

Then amortize the fact that one of them is still slightly underwater and I've owned it for 10 years, and if I were to try and sell it, a dealer would have to make money for him to sell it, so I would only get… 70% of what I paid for it.  So, technically, it's got a -30% ROI.

Inflation has halved the value of things in the last 10 years, too, and at the rate things are going, well, it sort of reminds me of Marisa Tomei's biological clock.

I do enjoy my coin collection, however, so there is satisfaction in that.  And most of the coins have kept up a little with inflation.

It's a hobby.  Not really an investment.  That's the way it goes.

It is because I like it that I pay a lot of money for it，I didn't get the real coin, only the loss, if the coin is real, I can pay a little more

[USAuPzlBxBob]

On 8/2/2023 at 10:54 PM, 寂静音无 said:

It is because I like it that I pay a lot of money for it，I didn't get the real coin, only the loss, if the coin is real, I can pay a little more

Then take the certified coin route, pay up, and live a life of coin collecting pleasure.

[Henri Charriere]

On 7/13/2023 at 10:10 AM, GoldFinger1969 said:

I never heard of ma-shop.

This is, hands down, the most incredible disclosure I have heard coming from anyone on any Forum, so much so that it's taken me all these weeks to process it.  The analogy may be off but, while neither a buyer or seller of coins -- or even an auction house, the closest equivalent would be saying you never heard of Heritage or Great Collections, et al. It seems like every time I am permitted to Sign In here, there is a MA-SHOPS ad either immediately preceding or following a topic.  I prefer to regard MA-SHOPS as one would a trusted intermediary or coordinator. A kind of one stop shop for everything numismatic, worldwide. And by the way, amongst the consortium of businesses affiliated with MA-SHOPS are many concerns that routinely sell Double Eagles, raw and encapsulated.

I am terribly sorry the OP had a negative encounter involving a MA-SHOPS dealer but he should take comfort in the fact that any such allegations affecting an entire association's business enterprise shall be dealt with dispatch.

[Conder101]

On 8/2/2023 at 10:50 PM, 寂静音无 said:

Yes, it's a lesson, hopefully others don't go through my process

 They will, we have all made mistakes and had to take losses occasionally.  And it will happen to others again in the future.

.

On 8/1/2023 at 9:21 PM, 寂静音无 said:

but I lost about 80 euros

Your tuition  to the school of hard knocks.

[寂静音无]

On 8/9/2023 at 1:23 PM, Conder101 said:

 They will, we have all made mistakes and had to take losses occasionally.  And it will happen to others again in the future.

.

Your tuition  to the school of hard knocks.

I won't be buying naked coins anyway , Only ngc and pcgs encapsulated coins are now purchased

[VKurtB]

On 8/13/2023 at 9:23 PM, 寂静音无 said:

I won't be buying naked coins anyway , Only ngc and pcgs encapsulated coins are now purchased

Good luck. When considering world coins, you have just greatly shrunk the pool of available coins. Encapsulated coins are not very popular in Europe generally. European collectors are EXPECTED to have expertise in authentication and grading, unlike in the U.S., where a big fat budget makes you an automatic numismatist.  I just returned from the misnamed World's Fair of Money where the TINY MINORITY of material in the competitive exhibits was encapsulated.

[寂静音无]

On 8/15/2023 at 3:48 AM, VKurtB said:

Good luck. When considering world coins, you have just greatly shrunk the pool of available coins. Encapsulated coins are not very popular in Europe generally. European collectors are EXPECTED to have expertise in authentication and grading, unlike in the U.S., where a big fat budget makes you an automatic numismatist.  I just returned from the misnamed World's Fair of Money where the TINY MINORITY of material in the competitive exhibits was encapsulated.

Thank you very much for your advice，ngc and pcgs encapsulated coins are very popular with us in china,I like world coin and Ancient coin very much ,Because they have history and beautiful patterns，It's very fascinating。

[VKurtB]

On 8/14/2023 at 10:09 PM, 寂静音无 said:

Thank you very much for your advice，ngc and pcgs encapsulated coins are very popular with us in china,I like world coin and Ancient coin very much ,Because they have history and beautiful patterns，It's very fascinating。

Yes, China is, by far, the country other than the U.S.A. that is the most fervent fans of encapsulated coins. After that, rates of acceptance fall considerably. I believe it is because the U.S.A. and China have the most con artists.

[寂静音无]

On 8/15/2023 at 9:52 PM, VKurtB said:

Yes, China is, by far, the country other than the U.S.A. that is the most fervent fans of encapsulated coins. After that, rates of acceptance fall considerably. I believe it is because the U.S.A. and China have the most con artists.

Yes, there are a lot of fake coins produced in China, and China's packaging and rating companies will even package a large number of fake coins into them, some of which are difficult to distinguish between real and fake, of course, there are also real coins, so I can only buy world coins, after all, ngc and pcgs are still relatively authoritative。By the way, a lot of world coins and Morgan, peace, etc. are much cheaper in China now than in USA and Europe, which makes it easier for me to collect coins，Of course, these coins have been encapsulated by pcgs and ngc, and I even saw the ebay300 euro coin that can be bought for 50 euros, but I didn't buy that coin because I didn't like it。

[VKurtB]

On 8/15/2023 at 10:31 PM, 寂静音无 said:

Yes, there are a lot of fake coins produced in China, and China's packaging and rating companies will even package a large number of fake coins into them, some of which are difficult to distinguish between real and fake, of course, there are also real coins, so I can only buy world coins, after all, ngc and pcgs are still relatively authoritative。By the way, a lot of world coins and Morgan, peace, etc. are much cheaper in China now than in USA and Europe, which makes it easier for me to collect coins，Of course, these coins have been encapsulated by pcgs and ngc, and I even saw the ebay300 euro coin that can be bought for 50 euros, but I didn't buy that coin because I didn't like it。

Just wait for the new CACG slab. What it REPRESENTS will likely be a premium product. But the quality of the physical enclosure itself, the slab, is really abysmally poor. It may be the worst one out there. 

[Conder101]

On 8/15/2023 at 11:31 PM, 寂静音无 said:

By the way, a lot of world coins and Morgan, peace, etc. are much cheaper in China now than in USA and Europe, which makes it easier for me to collect coins

But there are also a LOT of fake world coins, Morgan and Peace dollars (as well as other coins) made in China and a LOT of fake PCGS and NGC slabs as well.  The US market is receiving a LOT af fake US coins in fake PCGS and fake NGC slabs coming from China.  I would not be surprised if a lot of them are sold into the Chinese market as well.  Just because it is slabbed doesn't mean it's real.