[Sad Day] NGC/NCS Conservation - Copper Spot on modern Gold Proof Coin. 0

[ivanterror33]

I am feeling a little upset. I have some unslabbed modern gold proof coins hidden away. Today, upon inspection, one of them has a tiny red spot.

If I were to send this for NGC and NCS conservation, will this coin still get PF69 or PF70 due to conservation?

Dear collectors and experts, please advise a sad man

[RWB]

The spot is contamination acquired before the coin was originally packaged. Mr. Lange from NGC can give you better information on their success rate in removing visual traces. In most instances I've examined, there is residual damage that can never be removed.

[VKurtB]

On 7/10/2022 at 12:26 PM, RWB said:

The spot is contamination acquired before the coin was originally packaged. Mr. Lange from NGC can give you better information on their success rate in removing visual traces. In most instances I've examined, there is residual damage that can never be removed.

Correct me if I’m wrong but to my knowledge, “copper” spots are not something that would take a coin below 69, by itself. 

[DWLange]

NCS is very good at removing simple copper spots. It's the black "flyspecks" that may leave a ghost behind.

[ivanterror33]

Thank you @DWLange - Very honoured to have your leaving a reply. I looked carefully, the copper spot that appeared wasn't red, but a spot of deep black. Doesn't look promising.

My other concern is whether the spot will re-appear again, as I understand it is some kind of chemical reaction in non-gold metal in the coin

@RWB @VKurtB - Thank you for your response - It's a consolation to a sad man today.

[RWB]

The spots are caused by minute particles, usually metal, floating in the coining room or packing room air. These can also be particles that were inhaled by workers then expelled into the room via a sneeze or other unprotected discharge. Much of the original research on this was performed in China, Australia, and a European museums.

[Nutmeg Coin]

I know a dealer who submits MS69 eagles with some coppery spot or discoloration and they burn them off in conservation and come back MS70, often worth $1000 more!  A profitable dealer trick, buy the spotted gold at a 69 price and then make a grand in a 70 holder after conservation.

[ivanterror33]

On 7/11/2022 at 6:34 AM, RWB said:

The spots are caused by minute particles, usually metal, floating in the coining room or packing room air. These can also be particles that were inhaled by workers then expelled into the room via a sneeze or other unprotected discharge. Much of the original research on this was performed in China, Australia, and a European museums.

Thank you. I have sent that coin to NGC for conservation and slabbing. 

If the "ghost" is still there, and score lower than PF69, I would sell the gold as bullion. 

Fingers crossed. 

[VKurtB]

On 7/18/2022 at 8:57 AM, ivanterror33 said:

Thank you. I have sent that coin to NGC for conservation and slabbing. 

If the "ghost" is still there, and score lower than PF69, I would sell the gold as bullion. 

Fingers crossed. 

Good luck, but I would be AMAZED if a coin with a black spot could get to 69 or 70. An orange copper spot is another matter. 

[GoldFinger1969]

On 7/10/2022 at 11:02 AM, ivanterror33 said:

I am feeling a little upset. I have some unslabbed modern gold proof coins hidden away. Today, upon inspection, one of them has a tiny red spot.

How long have you had these coins and what year were they minted ?

[ivanterror33]

@VKurtB

I suspect it is only a surface dust that was stuck on surface.   It did not leave an imprint or shadow. It looks great.  Fortunately, the NGC grading result was a 69  

Original unslabbed

 

After conservation, the copper spot is gone  

 

 

Edited October 11, 2022 by ivanterror33

[ivanterror33]

On 7/19/2022 at 2:50 AM, GoldFinger1969 said:

How long have you had these coins and what year were they minted ?

Those were minted in the 1980s. I had those since early 2000s, some were passed down some were bought

[GoldFinger1969]

On 7/10/2022 at 4:55 PM, DWLange said:

NCS is very good at removing simple copper spots. It's the black "flyspecks" that may leave a ghost behind.

Isn't a minute fraction of a gram of gold being removed when spots are corrected, Dave ?

[GoldFinger1969]

On 10/11/2022 at 6:00 AM, ivanterror33 said:

Those were minted in the 1980s. I had those since early 2000s, some were passed down some were bought

It happens.  Don't let it get you upset.  Has happened to all of us with either gold or silver coins.

The only way -- er, best way -- is to buy older gold coins that haven't turned and are thus less likely to turn in the future.  I'm kind of surprised your coins turned, since some of them appear to have been pristine when you bought them 10-15 years earlier or more.

Edited October 11, 2022 by GoldFinger1969

[GoldFinger1969]

On 7/10/2022 at 11:02 AM, ivanterror33 said:

I am feeling a little upset. I have some unslabbed modern gold proof coins hidden away. Today, upon inspection, one of them has a tiny red spot.

Since they were modern proofs, did you pay big premiums for them or just a few hundred bucks over spot (I presume they are 1 ounce) ?

[EagleRJO]

I actually like the modern gold coins more as (at least until recently) they were better struck with more detail, like the 2021 1 oz. gold eagles.

[GoldFinger1969]

On 10/11/2022 at 3:36 PM, EagleRJO said:

I actually like the modern gold coins more as (at least until recently) they were better struck with more detail, like the 2021 1 oz. gold eagles.

I picked up a 2015 AGE proof at FUN 2020.  Beautiful coin, nice NGC holder. 

[ivanterror33]

Some of the sealed capsules have 1 or 2 very short strands of white-hairlike fiber within. It can only be observed if you look into the capsule carefully with a magnifying glass. Probably part of the manufacturing process or the clean room that manufacture those coins had some airborne particles?

On 10/12/2022 at 3:29 AM, GoldFinger1969 said:

It happens.  Don't let it get you upset.  Has happened to all of us with either gold or silver coins.

The only way -- er, best way -- is to buy older gold coins that haven't turned and are thus less likely to turn in the future.  I'm kind of surprised your coins turned, since some of them appear to have been pristine when you bought them 10-15 years earlier or more.

 

 

Edited October 19, 2022 by ivanterror33