Fractional ownership... of baseball cards... ? This can't be good. 0

[World Colonial]

On 10/28/2022 at 11:40 AM, GoldFinger1969 said:

Jeff Garrett has written several pieces in 2021 and 2022 saying that our hobby has definitely seen an influx of participants and/or $$$ chasing the same number of coins (hence higher prices):

https://rarecoingallery.com/articles-by-jeff-garrett/the-rare-coin-market-is-hot-heres-how-you-can-make-it-work-for-you/

Garrett is a financial promoter first and a collector distant second.  This is how he writes his articles for Coin Week, which I presume are the same ones on his site.  In every article of his I have ever read he's always measuring the "health of the hobby" by the price level.

If Garrett gets his wish, the traditional collector is going to get priced out of many coins they previously could afford. Yet just like forum members, I also already know he's going to claim how the "leftovers" will still supposedly be so interesting.

[GoldFinger1969]

On 12/25/2022 at 8:34 AM, World Colonial said:

I think ESPN airing his games when the NBA wasn't playing had something or a lot to do with it.

They mentioned "The Last Dance" on ESPN and that probably helped with all the people who grew up with Kobe and LeBron.

[GoldFinger1969]

On 12/25/2022 at 8:42 AM, World Colonial said:

Garrett is a financial promoter first and a collector distant second.  This is how he writes his articles for Coin Week, which I presume are the same ones on his site.  In every article of his I have ever read he's always measuring the "health of the hobby" by the price level.  If Garrett gets his wish, the traditional collector is going to get priced out of many coins they previously could afford. Yet just like forum members, I also already know he's going to claim how the "leftovers" will still supposedly be so interesting.

I get where you are coming from, but isn't a (slowly) rising price level better than a FALLING one or a flat one for decades ?

Look, I don't really care if my coins go up or down in value and I guess you can say it's in my best interest if gold and coin prices are flat for the next 10-15 years while I accumulate them and then they miraculously triple in price during my Final Year.  

But I don't think that will happen. 

[zadok]

On 12/25/2022 at 12:25 PM, GoldFinger1969 said:

I get where you are coming from, but isn't a (slowly) rising price level better than a FALLING one or a flat one for decades ?

Look, I don't really care if my coins go up or down in value and I guess you can say it's in my best interest if gold and coin prices are flat for the next 10-15 years while I accumulate them and then they miraculously triple in price during my Final Year.  

But I don't think that will happen. 

...i see nothing adverse with flat prices on virtually anything...its called stability....

[World Colonial]

On 12/25/2022 at 12:25 PM, GoldFinger1969 said:

I get where you are coming from, but isn't a (slowly) rising price level better than a FALLING one or a flat one for decades ?

Slowly rising is probably better from the standpoint of most collectors.  That's my guess.

Garrett isn't anywhere near the worst.  Still, those who agree with him are more interested in maximizing prices and profits because it's a business to them first, not a hobby.

Would I like it if the value of coin collection fell in half?  I'm not selling my primary series (by choice) and it probably would mean fewer coins are available versus more.

I'd actually consider other coins as side collections (not my primary interest), if the prices were more "reasonable".  There are too many coins and series which are not "reasonably" priced anymore (not just US) because too much of the price is based upon the holder label.  I'm not just referring to 30, 40, or 50 years either.  I'm referring to 20 years or less.

I'm not spending thousands, $10K, $20K or more on a series or a bunch of "one offs" which collectively used to sell for (a lot) less because the coins aren't remotely interesting enough.

On 12/25/2022 at 12:25 PM, GoldFinger1969 said:

Look, I don't really care if my coins go up or down in value and I guess you can say it's in my best interest if gold and coin prices are flat for the next 10-15 years while I accumulate them and then they miraculously triple in price during my Final Year.  

But I don't think that will happen. 

Yes, I agree with you, accumulate until you sell.  But a small though noticeable proportion are interested in maximum appreciation all the time.

[GoldFinger1969]

On 12/25/2022 at 12:46 PM, zadok said:

...i see nothing adverse with flat prices on virtually anything...its called stability....

But nothing with monetary value stays unchanged for long periods of time...except currencies in a fixed-exchange rate regime. 

[zadok]

On 12/26/2022 at 11:31 AM, GoldFinger1969 said:

But nothing with monetary value stays unchanged for long periods of time...except currencies in a fixed-exchange rate regime. 

...true but i liked it better when i was buying rolls of DE for $72 a pop....

[GoldFinger1969]

On 12/26/2022 at 11:40 AM, zadok said:

...true but i liked it better when i was buying rolls of DE for $72 a pop....

I was too busy watching the original Scooby-Doo on Saturday mornings back then !! 

[World Colonial]

Saudi Arabia's love for soccer could cause ripple effects (cnbc.com)

No, there is no conceivably comparable model which will ever apply to coins or other mass-produced collectibles, no matter how creative anyone tries to be.

Direct quote from the article:

“Sports investment is attractive. You won’t necessarily get a substantial return on your investment financially, given the high prices they are likely to have to go and pay for a club of that stature, but the non-financial return on investment as we’ve seen is a positive one.”

[zadok]

On 1/6/2023 at 9:54 AM, World Colonial said:

Saudi Arabia's love for soccer could cause ripple effects (cnbc.com)

No, there is no conceivably comparable model which will ever apply to coins or other mass-produced collectibles, no matter how creative anyone tries to be.

Direct quote from the article:

“Sports investment is attractive. You won’t necessarily get a substantial return on your investment financially, given the high prices they are likely to have to go and pay for a club of that stature, but the non-financial return on investment as we’ve seen is a positive one.”

...dont forget the t-shirt u get with the club logo....

[GoldFinger1969]

Interesting how NFTs and Sports Cards (aside from the Mickey Mantle Rookie Card) took a shellacking in the last 2+ years. 

WC, you mentioned Scott Travers a while back....apparantly he paid $34,000 for a Barber Quarter that is down to $6,000. 

Is there a special Barber coin worth that much, unique condition/mintmark/year or something ?  I'm not familiar with the series.

Edited May 17 by GoldFinger1969

[World Colonial]

On 5/17/2024 at 5:19 PM, GoldFinger1969 said:

Interesting how NFTs and Sports Cards (aside from the Mickey Mantle Rookie Card) took a shellacking in the last 2+ years. 

WC, you mentioned Scott Travers a while back....apparantly he paid $34,000 for a Barber Quarter that is down to $6,000. 

Is there a special Barber coin worth that much, unique condition/mintmark/year or something ?  I'm not familiar with the series.

I did say that, but I think I got the coin wrong or might have.  I'm not sure the article identified which one.  It might have been a Liberty Seated quarter.

Quite a few Barber quarters still worth $34K but I wouldn't call a single one "special" by my standards.  Aside from any that quality as "top pop", the 1901-S also does several grades lower. 1913-S (?) and one other "key" date which slips my mind (1895-S?) possibly also.  I've never failed to see these three "key" dates at or near "gem" every time I looked.  It's not that often but not that infrequent either.

How has that Jordan rookie card done?  Anyone know?

My recollection is that it sold for $600K in 2020 with a count of 316 in "70", and I'm guessing many more exist.

Edited May 18 by World Colonial

[GoldFinger1969]

On 5/17/2024 at 9:34 PM, World Colonial said:

I did say that, but I think I got the coin wrong or might have.  I'm not sure the article identified which one.  It might have been a Liberty Seated quarter.

"....One panelist, coin dealer and longtime consumer advocate Scott Travers, lamented the fact that a classic high-population quarter that he owned had lost significant value (from $34,000 to $6,000 USD) in recent years."

Definitely a quarter, but not sure what type.

Jordan cards come back to Earth:

https://www.altaninsights.com/blog-posts/unpacking-the-rise-and-fall-of-the-1986-fleer-michael-jordan-rookie-card

Edited May 18 by GoldFinger1969

[Henri Charriere]

On 12/25/2022 at 8:42 AM, World Colonial said:

.....If Garrett gets his wish, the traditional collector is going to get priced out of many coins they previously could afford....,....

🐓 :  IF YOU DECEND INTO MADNESS (... uncle z has long ago said you've exceeded the point of return long ago) AND DABBLE INTO FRACTIONAL OWNERSHIP OF COINS, WHICH PART OF ME WILL YOU CHOOSE TO OWN?

Q.A. :  THAT'S EASY... NOT THE GOOD OR BETTER PART, BUT THE BEST PART.  I HAVE TO MINIMIZE MY LIABILITY.  Then again, my disposition changes without notice.  🤣

[GoldFinger1969]

On 12/25/2022 at 8:42 AM, World Colonial said:

If Garrett gets his wish, the traditional collector is going to get priced out of many coins they previously could afford. 

Maybe, but it can't be worse than those in the early-1970's who saw gold quadruple before they were legally allowed to buy it....then saw it quadruple again in 5+ years.

Folks who for decades knew it was worth $35/oz. suddenly had to pay $150 - $750 an ounce, with the metal pretty much averaging about $350 for the next 20 years.

Edited May 18 by GoldFinger1969

[zadok]

On 5/18/2024 at 9:45 AM, GoldFinger1969 said:

Maybe, but it can't be worse than those in the early-1970's who saw gold quadruple before they were legally allowed to buy it....then saw it quadruple again in 5+ years.

Folks who for decades knew it was worth $35/oz. suddenly had to pay $150 - $750 an ounce, with the metal pretty much averaging about $350 for the next 20 years.

...if all else fails, u still mite be able to be a fractional owner of Seize the Grey....

[VKurtB]

On 5/19/2024 at 2:55 PM, zadok said:

...if all else fails, u still mite be able to be a fractional owner of Seize the Grey....

Do you get to specify a type of meat you own of that horse?

[zadok]

On 5/19/2024 at 4:10 PM, VKurtB said:

Do you get to specify a type of meat you own of that horse?

...no just a pc of the purse....

[VKurtB]

On 5/19/2024 at 3:14 PM, zadok said:

...no just a pc of the purse....

So each winner gets $467. The shares were $130ish? That’s a lot of performance (the number 2 Triple Crown race) to basically get a 2.5x return. The massive majority on that horse site get hosed. 

Edited May 19 by VKurtB

[Henri Charriere]

On 12/25/2022 at 12:25 PM, GoldFinger1969 said:

I get where you are coming from, but isn't a (slowly) rising price level better than a FALLING one or a flat one for decades ?

Look, I don't really care if my coins go up or down in value and I guess you can say it's in my best interest if gold and coin prices are flat for the next 10-15 years while I accumulate them and then they miraculously triple in price during my Final Year.  

But I don't think that will happen. 

(Looks like hanukkah is coming early this year!)  🤣

[zadok]

On 5/19/2024 at 6:02 PM, VKurtB said:

So each winner gets $467. The shares were $130ish? That’s a lot of performance (the number 2 Triple Crown race) to basically get a 2.5x return. The massive majority on that horse site get hosed. 

...yea but they got to wear big hats....

[GoldFinger1969]

On 5/19/2024 at 3:55 PM, zadok said:

...if all else fails, u still mite be able to be a fractional owner of Seize the Grey....

Secretariat fan myself.  Since his owner went to bat for him on the 1973 Preakness, he has the record for all 3 Triple Crown times.  There was a glitch with the time at the '73 Preakness (hard to believe) and tapes of the run didn't match up with the time.  

https://www.americasbestracing.net/the-sport/2023-secretariat-the-preakness-and-39-year-controversy

 

Edited May 20 by GoldFinger1969

[VKurtB]

On 5/20/2024 at 7:28 AM, zadok said:

...yea but they got to wear big hats....

And slurp down Black Eyed Susans. 

[zadok]

On 5/20/2024 at 11:09 AM, GoldFinger1969 said:

Secretariat fan myself.  Since his owner went to bat for him on the 1973 Preakness, he has the record for all 3 Triple Crown times.  There was a glitch with the time at the '73 Preakness (hard to believe) and tapes of the run didn't match up with the time.  

https://www.americasbestracing.net/the-sport/2023-secretariat-the-preakness-and-39-year-controversy

 

...fully aware of "big red"'s legacy, watched all 3 races...the real question is which "big red" would have won a head-to-head stakes race???...never know, but i can sell u a fractional share in both for a single saint....