4.7 gram 1949 Jefferson nickel 0

[Disc Golfer]

If I understand correctly; it should weigh 5 grams with a tolerance of 1% over or under.  Is this a common occurence for this to weigh 4.7grams. Mint error? Any knowledgeable and helpful info on this is greatly appreciated.  Thank you.

Edited August 28, 2019 by Disc Golfer

[VKurtB]

Think of it this way. As a coin wears, that "moved metal" can only go two places. 1) It can be scraped off the high points and become 'crud' in the low points, or 2) It can be removed from the coin entirely. Look closely at the INSIDE of the pants pockets of your oldest pair of trousers. I bet there is evidence of copper and nickel rubbings. Yes, I'm an old guy and it takes a long time, and I have some VERY old pants. 

[Disc Golfer]

18 minutes ago, VKurtB said:

Think of it this way. As a coin wears, that "moved metal" can only go two places. 1) It can be scraped off the high points and become 'crud' in the low points, or 2) It can be removed from the coin entirely. Look closely at the INSIDE of the pants pockets of your oldest pair of trousers. I bet there is evidence of copper and nickel rubbings. Yes, I'm an old guy and it takes a long time, and I have some VERY old pants. 

Thank you. That was one of my thoughts s well; however, I weigh almost every coin that I come across. I have seen ones with much more wear that do not have such a difference. Keeping what you said in mind. Is there a way to prove or disprove that theory as my other thought is a wrong planchet. Which I also would like  way to prove or disprove.  I know at this time date the US mint was basically known as the world's mint as it minted coins for many countries and wrong planchet errors did occur.

[VKurtB]

17 minutes ago, Disc Golfer said:

Thank you. That was one of my thoughts s well; however, I weigh almost every coin that I come across. I have seen ones with much more wear that do not have such a difference. Keeping what you said in mind. Is there a way to prove or disprove that theory as my other thought is a wrong planchet. Which I also would like  way to prove or disprove.  I know at this time date the US mint was basically known as the world's mint as it minted coins for many countries and wrong planchet errors did occur.

A couple of thoughts:

You MAY be understating the normal weight tolerance, in 1949. I don't believe it was as tight as 1%. I could be wrong.

1949 was an era when even more "world" work was being done at Philly than now. Some was also being done at San Francisco, but almost none then at Denver. What is the mintmark?

Trying to get anyone in a position of authority (like a grading firm) to "buy" that a 0.3g light well worn nickel is a candidate for a "wrong planchet" strike is a pretty tall order.

[Greenstang]

The Mint tolerance for a Nickel is .19g which means it could be as light as 4.81g.  As your scale only goes to 1 decimal place, it could weigh more than 4.7g.

Although this is slightly under tolerance, it could be caused by some wear and/or a slightly underweight planchet. As planchets are made outside of the Mint, it would not be considered as a Mint error even if it was slightly underweight but a Planchet error.

[VKurtB]

I am fairly certain that Philadelphia still makes 5-cent planchets in-house. I know they do all clad denominations. All 1-cent blanks arrive from Tennessee pre-punched.

But as you said, there is this:

31 U.S. Code § 5113. Tolerances and testing of coins

"The weight of the 5-cent coin may vary not more than 0.194 gram."

 

And that's NOW. What was the tolerance in 1949?

Edited August 28, 2019 by VKurtB

[Greenstang]

All Nickels produced from 1866 to present have a tolerance of .19g

Edited August 28, 2019 by Greenstang

[Disc Golfer]

1 hour ago, VKurtB said:

A couple of thoughts:

You MAY be understating the normal weight tolerance, in 1949. I don't believe it was as tight as 1%. I could be wrong.

1949 was an era when even more "world" work was being done at Philly than now. Some was also being done at San Francisco, but almost none then at Denver. What is the mintmark?

Trying to get anyone in a position of authority (like a grading firm) to "buy" that a 0.3g light well worn nickel is a candidate for a "wrong planchet" strike is a pretty tall order.

No mint mark

[Greenstang]

In this case I don't think the MM changes anything. It is still a slightly underweight Nickel but not enough to really add any premium.

[VKurtB]

6 minutes ago, Greenstang said:

In this case I don't think the MM changes anything. It is still a slightly underweight Nickel but not enough to really add any premium.

Agreed on both points. My research reveals no "almost nickel sized but not quite, while looking like 75/25 cupronickel" projects for other countries at that time in Philly.

[Disc Golfer]

I agree a better scale and a closer examination is need. 

I am not attempting to get anyone to "buy" anything. I am simply not ruling out any possibility that may exist.  I would expect any person of authority and/or grading firm to hold true to the allowable variance of the coin at the time it was made. If it falls out of the allowable range it should not matter how much.  I did just weigh a number of nickels with huge gouges of coin missing and a few very worn ones and the lowest weight was 4.9. Not to compare or think it is the same, I just read an article about finding of 1949 nickel of 4.9 gram which was minted on a quarter . So I am keeping an open mind until ruled out totally. 

In the past I was taught ad had a knack for recognizing coins that were over other coins or had errors over looked by others for my uncle. Not all came to be actual, but he sent a number of them off and came back good and graded. Some of which payed for my college education with no money out of our pockets. Since his passing I have no one to show to or to help identify what I am seeing while I go through 10  one gallon milk jugs of change accrued since his pasing. So i turn to you guys for answers or any info as long as open to possibilities as I have seen first hand how self proclaimed experts (not saying any of you are) over look or dismiss a coin as absolute normal  but then being g recognize by another and being sold for around 10,000 to pay for my first year of college. Who k owns maybe we will get to see something pretty cool in the near future together.

[VKurtB]

I'd suggest a few minutes spent reading about the "scientific method" and the concept of the "null hypothesis". In extreme short, it boils down to the fact that "there's nothing special to see here" is the outcome that is to be assumed, absent compelling evidence otherwise. Yes, I do know that runs counter to the very real emotional investments we quickly make in many things as human beings. We want to turn scientific inquiry on its head and dream about "What if ...?" to the detriment of cold dispassionate analysis.

But ... there are valid reasons why so many scientists are nerdy automaton-like robots. It serves them well in using approved methods of analysis. Think Sheldon Cooper.

I know that many interpret that as "urinating in someone's corn flakes" or "harshing their mellow" or something equally "flaky", but it REALLY is the correct way to proceed, if you want to be seen as serious. In short, you need to be examining why your hoped for outcome is probably not true, rather than dreaming of some discovery. Buzzkill? Yeah, kinda. But that's the way the world works.

Edited August 28, 2019 by VKurtB

[Coinrookie32]

On 8/28/2019 at 10:31 AM, Disc Golfer said:

If I understand correctly; it should weigh 5 grams with a tolerance of 1% over or under.  Is this a common occurence for this to weigh 4.7grams. Mint error? Any knowledgeable and helpful info on this is greatly appreciated.  Thank you.

I just found a 1942 no mint mark nickel that weighs 4.70 and I was wondering the same thing I did find one video on couch collectibles on YouTube that said they found one silver nickel in that year that weighed 4.7 .. but everybody is always money to tolerance and I don't think tolerance goes that low for a nickel that's not that wore out

[Conder101]

Tolerance is .19 grams which is almost 4% not 1%,  Minimum weight new would be 4.8 grams.  Yours is .1 grams below weight and is somewhat worn.  It was probably struck on a very slightly thin planchet and I would not consider it to be far enough off to be worth any appreciable premium.  You find one that weighs 4.4 maybe 4.5 then it might have some value.  I normally think a coin needs to be about .4 grams out of the tolerance range before a collector would have serious interest.