Not a trivia question about Bust Half terminology

[EVillageProwler]

I am contemplating starting on Bust Halves again, and was reading some literature on them when I came across a variety noted as "Overton 110 prime". What does "prime" mean? Is that the earliest die state possible for that marriage?

 

TIA,

 

EVP

 

[Klectorkid]

I have heard of Overton 110 but never Overton 110 prime. Could it just be a way of saying it is one of the prime overton numbers? Just an idea. Lets just see what the bust half gurus say.

[EVillageProwler]

prime overton numbers

 

This ain't a math class!

 

EVP

 

[cardinal-migration]

The Overton numbers for Bust Halves include letters to represent die states -- such as 110a, 110b, 110c, etc. with each letter representing a later die state.

 

For some varieties, the basic variety, such as 110, already displays some die cracks or other evidence of die aging; however, it was the earliest die state known at the time the Overton reference was written. When an even earlier die state was subsequently discovered, it needed to be labeled in a way that identified it as a die state preceding the basic state -- hence the term "prime." In this case, it doesn't necessarily mean the earliest die state conceivable, but it means a die state earlier than what was originally viewed as the earliest die state.

 

So, the varietal description 110-prime would mean an Overton 110 variety specimen not yet displaying the die cracks already evident on the basic specimen typically encountered.

 

--Cardinal

[Klectorkid]

Geez your smart!

[EVillageProwler]

Let me see if I get this straight...

 

If O-110 is the 3rd die state in the sequence of states for that marriage, would the earlier states be "O-110 prime-prime" and "O-110 prime"? (With "prime-prime" be earlier than "prime"...)

 

EVP

 

[cardinal-migration]

If O-110 is the 3rd die state in the sequence of states for that marriage, would the earlier states be "O-110 prime-prime" and "O-110 prime"? (With "prime-prime" be earlier than "prime"...)

 

I've never seen a report of such. The Overton reference was supposed to have been based on many years of research, with the basic Overton variety being the earliest die state seen after all of that research. So, for most varieties, the basic variety is to represent a so-called "perfect" die state -- meaning that no earlier die states could exist. By extension, this would mean that very few die states would be found earlier than those in Overton, and it would be quite unusual to find an earlier one that was later pre-dated by an even earlier state.

 

However, if such a coin were to be found, I think they would follow the basic algebraic conventions (okay, I was a math major!), and label it as O-110 double prime.

 

--Cardinal

[EVillageProwler]

I was a math major too, and I forgot that it's "double-prime" instead of the awkward "prime-prime"...

 

EVP

 

[coinman1794]

"Prime" is just the term adopted by specialists to describe the earliest known die state of any particular paring.

 

A lot of times, you will see this word used when the first die state listed in overton is one with die cracks, and an earlier die state has since been discovered.

[greghansen-migration]

And I came to work thinking I wasn't going to learn anything new today. Thanks guys.

[Nysoto]

EVP,

 

As an example, 1806 O-123 prime without die cracks can also carry the annotation O-123'. Many prime die states have been identified after the release of Overton 3rd edition.

 

Bill

[Hoot]

This is fantastic info! Thanks all!

 

Hoot