1866 Washington Five Cent Dies Trial in Lead

[WoodenJefferson]

This is from Heritage Auction’s Signature Floor Session at the Long Beach Expo June 14th through 17th from the William Rau collection.

Here’s more information from Auction listing: 1866 Washington Five Cent Dies Trial in Lead

PCGS AU58 1866 5C Washington Five Cent Lead Dies Trial. 'Judd-520a,' Pollock-547. The obverse shows a portrait of Washington facing right with UNITED STATES OF AMERICA around and date below. The reverse is from the Without Rays dies adopted for regular-issue coinage in 1867. Struck in lead on a broad planchet with a plain edge. These Washington five cent patterns were privately made from official government dies. Neil Musante suggests 19th century dealer John W. Haseltine or someone in his employ was able to procure the dies and sold these mulings to collectors. Examples are known in silver, nickel, copper, brass, and lead. Five lead examples are known, three of which have a cracked reverse and two that are uncracked, suggesting two striking periods. This dies trial, apparently unique and unlisted in the Judd or Musante references, is one of three with the crack that extends from the second S in STATES down through the 5, the star below, and the E in CENT to the lower rim. Pollock writes, "struck on a crude oversize planchet." The unstruck area of the planchet exhibits nicks and flakes on each side but is generally smooth. Washington's portrait, the stars, and denomination are well-detailed, if slightly uneven. This is an important pattern and a curious piece of Washingtonia that requires additional research.
 

[Just Bob]

These were struck by an individual using official government dies. How are they not considered counterfeit?

[WoodenJefferson]

These Washington five cent patterns were privately made from official government dies.

Probably because the design was never adopted as US currency...just a guess.

[MAULEMALL]

That's a very cool piece that I had never heard of... Thanks

[Conder101]

Depends on what the laws were on counterfeiting at the time.  Under today's laws they would probably be considered counterfeits, or at least unmarked imitation numismatic items.  But back then it may have been different.  Look at the 1804 or 1823 cent restrikes.  Struck with what were originally government dies by private parties but they aren't considered to be counterfeits and are eagerly on openly collected.  Of course at the time they were made the cent was not legal tender., that may have made a difference as well.

[Just Bob]

1 hour ago, Conder101 said:

Depends on what the laws were on counterfeiting at the time.  Under today's laws they would probably be considered counterfeits, or at least unmarked imitation numismatic items.  But back then it may have been different.  Look at the 1804 or 1823 cent restrikes.  Struck with what were originally government dies by private parties but they aren't considered to be counterfeits and are eagerly on openly collected.  Of course at the time they were made the cent was not legal tender., that may have made a difference as well.

What would stop an overzealous government official from applying todays' laws and confiscating them? And the coins that you mentioned as well? Do you think that (or know if)  these would be "grandfathered in?"

Lest anyone misunderstand, I would love to own one of these pieces. I just wonder about the details sometimes.

[RWB]

RE: " Neil Musante suggests 19th century dealer John W. Haseltine or someone in his employ was able to procure the dies and sold these mulings to collectors."

What is he evidence? The presence of multiple metals certainly implies private manufacture, but is there anything else?

[Conder101]

23 hours ago, Just Bob said:

What would stop an overzealous government official from applying todays' laws and confiscating them? And the coins that you mentioned as well? Do you think that (or know if)  these would be "grandfathered in?"

Nothing could stop them from confiscating them, but the constitutional protection from ex-post facto laws should prevent them from being kept. (but it may cost a bundle in legal bills)  They legal when made, they can't be made illegal now.  That's why the Hobby protection act does not apply to unmarked copies made before 1973.