Quality vs Quantity collecting question.

[Proudtoown]

Question for gold coin collectors.

 

I have about $5,000 right now to put toward a coin(s). After that, I will have about $2,600 per month to sock away. I want to get started into pre 1933 gold coins, prefer the $20 double Eagles, the smaller stuff hurts my eyes looking at them, aging affects. The draw back to the $20s is that I know that this budget will limit my ability to complete a serious set.

 

Scott Travers suggest MS-61/62 Gaudens in the latest Coinage Magazine, but a few months ago I read to buy the keys first. If I go with his advice, I can get about 4 double Eagles.

 

So my question is, what to buy, or better yet suggestions as to what to buy? I love the more quality coins of course the better the coin the more the cost, yet love the sight of tons of gold.

 

[MarkFeld]

Based on your stated budget, you wont be able to buy the keys in the Saint Gaudens series, unless you limit yourself to a coin every year or two (or more). So, you can forget about them. There, you just saved a lot of money!

 

As for the advice you received about buying MS61-62 pieces - I think in a number of cases you will be able to find MS63's, instead, which look noticeably better, yet don't cost a lot more.

 

You will have to decide for yourself which you would rather have - fewer, higher quality coins or more, lower quality ones. But my guess is that you will quickly become bored with and unappreciative of the extremely common/plentiful lower grade examples.

[BillJones]

You could buy a number of common date and semi-common date St. Gaudens double eagles on your budget. There is no way that you could complete a set, but you could have a number of attractive coins if you are happy with the same design repeated over and over. I like diversity.

 

I don't understand Mr. Travers' advice. Those coins in MS-61/62 are usually not very attractive and don't generate much collector interest. They are little more than almost one ounce hunks of bullion, and sell for prices that reflect that. I would rather buy the modern gold eagle coins, than low grade double eagles. They are prettier.

 

I've been collecting gold type coins for years. I have also dropped down and worked on some other sets, like the Indian $2.50 gold pieces, which is the only "old gold" set that is doable. I've also collected Charlotte and Dahlonega coins by type, and have collected gold dollars in a bit of detail, but I know those are way too small for your interests.

 

The double coins can make for an impressive partial set. I would stick with quality, however, and go slowly looking for the best coins in the MS-64 grade with some Choice 63s and 65s thrown in.

[RWB]

MS61/62 Saint-Gaudens $20 are usually dogs -- mutts. Nearly all sell close to bullion because they are common. Most of the "MS60-MS62" coins are actually circulated -- (my opinion not shared by others) -- so treat the label as a humorous interlude.

 

Look for at least MS63-MS64, and even then be very picky...there are nice MS63s and there are many more MS63s with ugly marks or even wear from being handled by European bankers during the interwar period.

 

Also, buy from dealers. Skip the auctions because the buyer premium is usually too high to get a good deal.

 

Why not take your $2,600 and match it against the DE coins of that current value - regardless of grade. Reject all the low grade offerings and focus on the better coins in your price range. After you look at a few hundred, and have bought a couple, consider combining the funds from 2 or 3 months to buy a similarly nice but scarcer date.

 

In the Saint-Gaudens series, the key coins are so scarce and so expensive that you have to be wealthy to think about buying one.

[Zebo]

Take a look at Bill's gold type set and then make up your mind if you want to concentrate on just double eagles. I agree with Bill, Mark and Roger - buy quality. I bought 60/61 when I first started out long ago and was not satisfied with them at all.

 

In addition to auctions and dealers - look on the NGC market board for possibilities.

 

Good luck in your hunt.

[Mr.Mcknowitall]

Question for gold coin collectors.

 

I have about $5,000 right now to put toward a coin(s). After that, I will have about $2,600 per month to sock away. I want to get started into pre 1933 gold coins, prefer the $20 double Eagles, the smaller stuff hurts my eyes looking at them, aging affects. The draw back to the $20s is that I know that this budget will limit my ability to complete a serious set.

 

Scott Travers suggest MS-61/62 Gaudens in the latest Coinage Magazine, but a few months ago I read to buy the keys first. If I go with his advice, I can get about 4 double Eagles.

 

So my question is, what to buy, or better yet suggestions as to what to buy? I love the more quality coins of course the better the coin the more the cost, yet love the sight of tons of gold.

 

A suggestion....consider another type of coin, not necessarily gold.

There are other type coins that won't tax your eyes, and may bring a lot more pleasure, and reward, and accomplishment.

[Hard Times]

Eagles can be nice too - you can get some nice AU Liberties that are fairly uncommon in the $3K-$10K range, and they are likely large enough for visual enjoyment. Here are two examples.

 

Best, HT

 

 

[DaveG]

It sounds like you want to accumulate a lot of double eagles rather than, say, build a nice set.

 

Frankly, if I were considering doing this, I'd buy 1 oz. AGE's instead - you'd have lots of liquidity and lots of big shiny gold coins. If I really wanted double eagles, then I'd go for Type I and Type II Coronet Eagles, which have more collector and historical interest. I'd go for attractive XF or AU slabbed examples, which don't usually carry much premium over gold.

 

However, If I were trying to accumulate a lot of double eagles, then I'd buy PCGS- or NGC-slabbed coins at close to melt prices. I'd probably be looking for attractive XF or AU Type III Coronet coins and I'd look for them at the larger shows, where there are a number of bullion-type dealers to choose among.

 

As others have said, MS-61 and 62 Saints are generally not attractive and, I think, are primarily sold to "investors" in bulk lots. I would think that the market for such coins is best when demand for gold is at it highest, whereas attractive XF and AU coins should have a larger audience, even when the demand for gold is not at its highest. I also think that Saint collectors and accumulators prefer nicer coins, such as MS-63s.

 

Before I bought a single double eagle, though, I'd read a copy of Bowers' A Guide Book of Double Eagle Gold Coins. It's inexpensive and has a lot of good information: about the coins, their availability and solid collecting advice.

[Walkerfan]

I'd work on a date set in MS 63/64. You can easily afford common and/or 'better date pieces' in the $1500-7500 range on your budget. As I've been told----it's a marathon and not a sprint.

[Matt_dac]

I too recommend going with quality but find a balance. I know what you mean about the small stuff - there is nothing like holding a nice double eagle in your hand. It's easy to see with the naked eye and has some real mass. At the same time, there are several designs that I really love. I collected the complete Indian quarter eagle set because I love the design. Only one coin in that set (11-D) will cost you around $5000 for AU58. The rest can be had for under $400 in AU58-MS61. I am happy with the eye appeal of the coins in this grade (though as with any you need to hunt).

 

Last month at a show a dealer had an MS64 1924 Saint Gaudens for $1250 with nice eye appeal. If I did not already have that coin (in MS63) I would have bought it in a heartbeat. Larger gold is harder to find (from my experience) with nice eye appeal almost regardless of the grade. I recently posted about my experience hunting for a nice Indian eagle. The vast majority up to and including some CAC MS64's are complete junk in my experience and I think they are generally over graded.

 

Enjoy the hunt - what a fun challenge ahead of you!

[orifdoc]

Another idea, if you enjoy hunting, is to focus on AU58 coins. Some of these will have the visual appeal of much nicer MS63/64 coins, but can often be had for very reasonable prices.

[Nutmeg Coin]

Scott Travers was also saying that MS $20s would explode in value back in the late 90s if gold doubled, that they would actually magnify the gold increase because the numbers of investors clamoring to buy these coins would cause large price spikes. Of course he was dead wrong, as he has been more often than not though providing useful advice against the real charlatans.

 

For the best prices I would go to the larger and better shows looking for quality MS63 or better $20s at the start of the shows when sometimes the freshest and best deals are available as you are competing with wholesale dealers. Go with cash with the current Rarcoa or HA price sheets and CDN in your back pocket. If you think like a dealer you may get the best deals. No one ever took a beating by walking away from a deal where there were questions either.

[RWB]

If you're doing gold, look for coins that do not follow the bullion value trend.

[Nutmeg Coin]

I have never seen the premiums on common type certified gold as low as it is today. Not a good investment unless gold spikes back up and there is a supply squeeze with lots of demand. Unlikely.

[jpcienkus]

I would buy quality.

[RWB]

There are millions of DE floating about...no chance of a "price squeeze" unless it's a deep-throat plan.

[CSdot]

I have never seen the premiums on common type certified gold as low as it is today. Not a good investment unless gold spikes back up and there is a supply squeeze with lots of demand. Unlikely.

 

However, this could mean that common type certified gold are a good investment since premiums are at a historic low.

 

To the OP, I would suggest buying MS64 and MS65 examples of the common Saints, and then the best grade (and best looking coin) you can afford of the uncommons. There is clear price jump that you will quickly identify when looking at Saints. For the commons, the coin in MS64/65 may only be a few hundred dollars more than the same date in MS61, but jump a thousand or more in the next grade. I tend to buy the best looking coin in the highest grade I can get before the large price jump.

[CSdot]

Ray- I see you have been a member since 2006. What other sets have you worked on? Do you have any registry sets?

 

As to your question about Saints, are you interested in the gold value, the numismatic value, or both? Buy and hold, or quick flip? Are you considering a date and mint mark set, or just a date set? Do you prefer raw, PCGS or NGC, or a combination?

[messydesk]

So you're dollar cost averaging your way into either bullion or collectible coins. Bullion will be an easy and nearly automatic way of buying shiny round things. Collectible coins will take effort. If your goal is a complete set of Saints, forget it. Too many 5+ figure coins for your budget (which, by the way, is far more than mine in case I came off as looking down my nose). If you want Saints as bullion, then that's what the MS61 and MS62 coins are for. If you are even thinking about quality, though, I'm guessing you'd get bored with accumulating ugly Saints.