"Chicago Fire Effect"?

[shirohniichan]

If these coins could be found and the provenence established, would they be collectible as "Chicago Fire Effect" coins?

 

Melted Coin from Chicago at the Philadelphia Mint.

 

On the 18th instant the counting of the melted coin from the Assistant United States Treasurer, at Chicago, was begun at the Mint, in Philadelphia. The Inquirer says :

 

The coin was taken from the large iron chests in which it had arrived, and spread upon tables where it was examined. By instructions received from Secretary Boutwell, an accurate account of this money must be made. To perform this duty Messrs. Jas. C. Eyster, O. B, Jones, William M. Bunkel, William S. Steel and Levi C. Cowperthwait were detailed, and at a little after nine o'clock in the morning the work commenced. The coin had evidently been shoveled up from the ruins of the vaults, and as it was poured forth from the bags was found to be mixed with particles of stone, mortar and burned rags. In many caaes the silver and nickel coins, which melt much easir than gold, were found to have been run down by the heat, and in their melted condition had so fused with the gold as to render hundreds of dollars into one solid mass, which could not be separated except by the action of chemicals.

 

Considerable of the gold and all of the silver will have to be remelted and recoined before it can be again used by the Government. Most of the gold has been badly oxidized by the action of heat and water, but from a test made Wednesday by the assayers it in thought that a greater part or the whole mass can be cleared and reissued without going through the process of melting and recoining. This will be accomplished by the action of chemicals and washing, and will be more economical for the Government than the process of melting would be. The coin, as far as has been examined, consists of $20s, $10s, $5s, $2 1/2 and $1s in gold, and all denominations of silver pieces, from the half dollar down to three cents. A few nickles and copper pieces have also been found. The duty of separating these coins from each other, classifying and counting them, was performed by the gentlemen above named on Wednesday, and from the time at which the chests were opened until 9 o'clock on Wednesday night about $258,000 were handled and put away to the credit of the Chicago Treasurer."

 

 

Daily Alta California, Volume 28, Number 7891, 1 November 1871

[RWB]

William S. Steel would eventually become coiner.

Levi C. Cowperthwait was the cousin of artist Thomas Eakins.

[michael]

If these coins could be found and the provenence established, would they be collectible as "Chicago Fire Effect" coins?

 

 

NOT..................... to me

 

but if slabbed as such with a special label and promoted with much fanfair, a book written by a well known coin demigod with a special box and certificate of authenticity i have no doubt they would sell for a RATHER good profit to the promoters

 

i'm a baaaaaaaaaaaaaad whittle boy

[$ilverHawk]

If these coins could be found and the provenence established, would they be collectible as "Chicago Fire Effect" coins?

 

Melted Coin from Chicago at the Philadelphia Mint.

 

On the 18th instant the counting of the melted coin from the Assistant United States Treasurer, at Chicago, was begun at the Mint, in Philadelphia. The Inquirer says :

 

The coin was taken from the large iron chests in which it had arrived, and spread upon tables where it was examined. By instructions received from Secretary Boutwell, an accurate account of this money must be made. To perform this duty Messrs. Jas. C. Eyster, O. B, Jones, William M. Bunkel, William S. Steel and Levi C. Cowperthwait were detailed, and at a little after nine o'clock in the morning the work commenced. The coin had evidently been shoveled up from the ruins of the vaults, and as it was poured forth from the bags was found to be mixed with particles of stone, mortar and burned rags. In many caaes the silver and nickel coins, which melt much easir than gold, were found to have been run down by the heat, and in their melted condition had so fused with the gold as to render hundreds of dollars into one solid mass, which could not be separated except by the action of chemicals.

 

Considerable of the gold and all of the silver will have to be remelted and recoined before it can be again used by the Government. Most of the gold has been badly oxidized by the action of heat and water, but from a test made Wednesday by the assayers it in thought that a greater part or the whole mass can be cleared and reissued without going through the process of melting and recoining. This will be accomplished by the action of chemicals and washing, and will be more economical for the Government than the process of melting would be. The coin, as far as has been examined, consists of $20s, $10s, $5s, $2 1/2 and $1s in gold, and all denominations of silver pieces, from the half dollar down to three cents. A few nickles and copper pieces have also been found. The duty of separating these coins from each other, classifying and counting them, was performed by the gentlemen above named on Wednesday, and from the time at which the chests were opened until 9 o'clock on Wednesday night about $258,000 were handled and put away to the credit of the Chicago Treasurer."

 

 

Daily Alta California, Volume 28, Number 7891, 1 November 1871

 

Not likely. The description is of a melted mass of coin metals. Further, the description states that the recovery and separation process was well underway in 1871.There would not be any possible claim to "Chicago Fire effect" unless the entire mass was presented as such. Since the entire mass was separated per the description. No "Chicago Fire effect".

 

Carl

[BillJones]

These burned up coins would not be worth anything to me. In addition if they did somehow get a premium value, you can bet the coin doctors would look for ways to duplicate the look.

 

If you like to collect something from the 1871 Chicago fire here is an item. "Robber baron" Jim Fisk organized a relief train that he sent to the city soon after the disaster. He issued this little medalet to publicize it. The piece is supposed to be common, but I have not seen that many of them.

 

[DWLange]

These coins would not have been returned or reissued. The authorities would have determined the collective bullion value of the recovered metal, and the submitter would have been paid that amount in undamaged coins.

[Conder101]

But it says in the article

 

but from a test made Wednesday by the assayers it in thought that a greater part or the whole mass can be cleared and reissued without going through the process of melting and recoining. This will be accomplished by the action of chemicals and washing, and will be more economical for the Government than the process of melting would be.

Which would indicate that most of the coins were going to be reissued after cleaning.

 

I suspect the mass of coins were mostly in a clump cemented together for ash from the fire with just some melting of some of the coins on the outside of the clump.

 

I also not the say the nickel coins would melt more easily than the gold, that isn't true. The silver alloy melts at a lower temperature than gold but copper and copper nickel alloys melt at higher temperatures, Coppernickel at almost 300 degrees higher.

[RWB]

These were coins from the subtreasury and were government account, not private. The had to determine how much was usable vs what could not be reissued. The assistant treasurer in Chicago would be charged with any loss on mutilated coins.