1798 Draped Bust -- legit value ?

[GoldFinger1969]

Not as up-to-speed on early coinage compared to the last century coins like Saints and Liberty's, but I was really intrigued by this Draped Bust Dollar. Unfortunately, it's from a collector book and not a slab. Graded VF 25-35.

 

I'm REALLY afraid of counterfeits out of my limited area of expertise so any feedback greatly appreciated. Even if it is legit the question is what price I should pay for it -- prices I have seen at auctions/Ebay/shows are all over the map. Yikes !!!

 

[GoldFinger1969]

I'm concerned with the 'mushiness' of the stars on the reverse. Also, parts of the letters in UNITED and AMERICA are strangely flattish.

[MarkFeld]

Here are a few things you might want to consider, in case you haven't already done so:

 

Why would you be buying it? Because you like it a lot or because you think you'd be getting a really good deal? If the former, pass - you can do a lot better if you're patient. If the latter, that might not be a good reason to buy a coin.

 

I can't tell from the images whether the dark areas on the obverse are stains (and/or areas where the coin wasn't cleaned in some way) or signs of environmental damage.

 

If you're not sure what the coin would grade and what a fair price would be, why not have it graded and then you and the seller can work out a price? That way, neither of you would get the wrong end of a bad deal.

[GoldFinger1969]

Here are a few things you might want to consider, in case you haven't already done so: Why would you be buying it? Because you like it a lot or because you think you'd be getting a really good deal? If the former, pass - you can do a lot better if you're patient. If the latter, that might not be a good reason to buy a coin. I can't tell from the images whether the dark areas on the obverse are stains (and/or areas where the coin wasn't cleaned in some way) or signs of environmental damage. If you're not sure what the coin would grade and what a fair price would be, why not have it graded and then you and the seller can work out a price? That way, neither of you would get the wrong end of a bad deal.

 

Can't argue with that logic, Mark....I saw a bunch of Draped Bust Dollars at some recent shows and they kinda grew on me. I wouldn't say I was rushing into the purchase but I definitely was at greater risk than with other coin purchases.

 

To be honest, I was hoping I was buying a good coin at an OK price. Or a very good coin at a good price. I figured if I was wrong, and I bought pretty much what I paid for, nothing much lost.

 

My great fear was buying a counterfeit or missing something big that knocks this down to Fine or Very Good.

 

Think I'll do more DD (due dilligence) and research before venturing into this area.

 

Thanks ! (thumbs u

[MarkFeld]

Here are a few things you might want to consider, in case you haven't already done so: Why would you be buying it? Because you like it a lot or because you think you'd be getting a really good deal? If the former, pass - you can do a lot better if you're patient. If the latter, that might not be a good reason to buy a coin. I can't tell from the images whether the dark areas on the obverse are stains (and/or areas where the coin wasn't cleaned in some way) or signs of environmental damage. If you're not sure what the coin would grade and what a fair price would be, why not have it graded and then you and the seller can work out a price? That way, neither of you would get the wrong end of a bad deal.

 

Can't argue with that logic, Mark....I saw a bunch of Draped Bust Dollars at some recent shows and they kinda grew on me. I wouldn't say I was rushing into the purchase but I definitely was at greater risk than with other coin purchases.

 

To be honest, I was hoping I was buying a good coin at an OK price. Or a very good coin at a good price. I figured if I was wrong, and I bought pretty much what I paid for, nothing much lost.

 

My great fear was buying a counterfeit or missing something big that knocks this down to Fine or Very Good.

 

Think I'll do more DD (due dilligence) and research before venturing into this area.

 

Thanks ! (thumbs u

 

If you really meant what you wrote (copied below), pass on the coin. It doesn't look like a good coin or a very good coin. It might be an OK coin, but that would be a best case scenario, based on the images. Of course, I am just offering one opinion.

 

"To be honest, I was hoping I was buying a good coin at an OK price. Or a very good coin at a good price. I figured if I was wrong, and I bought pretty much what I paid for, nothing much lost."

 

[BillJones]

It has VF-25 to 30 sharpness, but the spots on the obverse limit its eye appeal, which is important on these coins. "Fixing" the spots is risky because they may not come out, and you will then be dealing with the collectors who don't like coins that have been "conserved." These collectors tend to be more interested in coins from this era, so a "conserved" piece will turn a lot of them off. If the spots turn out to be "environmental damage," you up the creek if you pay more than much over $1,100 or $1,200.

 

I'd say the coin is probably worth low end VF to Fine money, which comes out in the low $2,000s, retail, for a GRADED coin. Since this one is not graded it is worth less because of the grading risk factor.

 

You can go from there. From my perspective it's not the worst Bust dollar in the world, but you can do better and be more sure of yourself with a graded piece. Raw coins are a risk, unless you know absolutely what you are doing. Even then you are playing "estimate the grade" with the certification services, which is not an exact science.

 

[No+4Me]

You've just heard from 2 respected members with years of experience in the biz. If I understand you correctly, you are concerned with authenticity and possibly that the coin has hidden problems. Those concerns would be mostly alleviated by having it graded by a first tier TPG prior to sale as Mark suggests. Also, eventually you or your heirs will sell it and it will be far more liquid in "good" plastic.

 

My personal opinion: I don't care for the obverse blotches; it looks to me like it has been messed with in some way.

[GoldFinger1969]

Thanks No....and Bill and Mark ! (thumbs u

[James_OldeTowne]

It looks genuine to me from those photos, but has some weird staining on it that detracts from the value a bit.

[michael]

my grade if in hand has no more hidden damage/ugliness and i can comfirm it is a genuine coin which i am pretty sure it is

 

my grade

 

$1750.00-2k depending on how much i like it after careful sight seen in hand examination and if i feel it can be re-colored to a market acceptable appearance

[GoldFinger1969]

my grade if in hand has no more hidden damage/ugliness and i can comfirm it is a genuine coin which i am pretty sure it is my grade$1750.00-2k depending no how much i like it after careful sight seen in hand examination and if i feel it can be re-colored to a market acceptable appearance

 

I believe the seller wanted $2,000 but was 'flexible' -- $100 off ? -- but I decided to buy the MS-65 1927 Saint.

 

You guys refer to the staining -- are you talking about the darker look to this coin ?

 

E Pluribus Unum is clearer than most coins I see except those rated 50 or higher.

 

Michael, why would you re-color this ? And how ? Wouldn't that ruin the coin (obviously not, I'm confused on this whole dipping/toning/coloring thing) ?

[michael]

my opinion you did well to buy the ms65 saint more upside, beauty and saleability with great potential/ a fundemential reason to increase in demand in the next 2-3 years

 

once you see a problem coin like this it is just better off to pass and leave the rest to the so called "experts" who have somewhere to go with this coin and know what can be done to make it more market acceptable

 

again you did the smart thing to pass

 

 

 

[GoldFinger1969]

again you did the smart thing to pass

 

Given I am between FT jobs and since I know alot more about Saints (albeit even that is beginner level), I went with what I know and am more comfortable. Alot less screw-up potential buyin a 1 oz. gold coin for under $2,000 than a coin with silver basically for the same price.

 

FYI, pics of the 1927 Saint are in my "1st Saint" thread.

[michael]

oh yes i saw it that 1927

 

a super nice all there ms65 saint (thumbs u

[Treashunt]

punt.

 

personally, it is ugly