Buyer silver coins by face value?

[joes2001]

I know you have seen sellers on ebay or elsewhere selling bags of say 5 or 20 dollars face value of silver coins. The price of course is based on the silver content, but why do they list it this way and say contents may be in any denomination? I was adding up the values, like 4 silver quarters is the same amount of silver as 10 silver dimes (1 dollar face value), but a silver dollar by itself contains more silver that 4 quarters, 10 dimes, or 2 halves. It's not significantly more, but this difference would add up in larger face value bags. I guess my question is, why aren't the Silver dollars made slightly thinner or smaller in diameter so the smaller denominations are actually fractions of it in bags? It seems strange to me that all the silver coins can nicely be put into simple fractions of face values but silver dollars can't. Have you ever wondered this? Thanks for your response. I can't seem to find anything about this just googling.

[Coindude]

You will never see a silver dollar in those type of bags. What you will mostly see is dimes which a lot of times sell for less than melt. Don't ask me why but they do.

[cpm9ball]

Blame it on Congress because it was they who set the standards.

 

Chris

[DaveG]

Subsidiary coins (half dollars, quarters, dimes, etc.) contained the proportional-to-the-dollar amount of silver until 1853, when their weight was reduced due to the increase in the price of silver as the result of the California Gold Rush. The silver dollar wasn't changed because of the bi-metallic standard.

 

In 1873, the weight of the subsidiary coins was increased a little bit (but not back to the pre-1853 standard).

 

As has been said, because silver dollars weigh more than subsidiary coins, you won't see mixed bags, but instead bags of subsidiary coins and bags of silver dollars.

[joes2001]

Ok. Thank you everyone for replying, and especially your reply Dave. It really cleared it up for me.

[$ilverHawk]

I know you have seen sellers on ebay or elsewhere selling bags of say 5 or 20 dollars face value of silver coins. The price of course is based on the silver content, but why do they list it this way and say contents may be in any denomination? I was adding up the values, like 4 silver quarters is the same amount of silver as 10 silver dimes (1 dollar face value), but a silver dollar by itself contains more silver that 4 quarters, 10 dimes, or 2 halves. It's not significantly more, but this difference would add up in larger face value bags. I guess my question is, why aren't the Silver dollars made slightly thinner or smaller in diameter so the smaller denominations are actually fractions of it in bags? It seems strange to me that all the silver coins can nicely be put into simple fractions of face values but silver dollars can't. Have you ever wondered this? Thanks for your response. I can't seem to find anything about this just googling.

 

The purchasing of silver coins for silver value should always be done by weight not denomination. If you purchase by denomination you are ignoring silver content lost through circulation.

 

Just a thought.

 

Carl

[joes2001]

You're right. But when you do it by weight, then what's the forumla? I'm not the wisest collector, so sorry if my questions are a bit newbie-ish. Let's say you got 2 pounds. I'm not sure what you break that next into, ounces or grams? And then you would multiply by .10 and minus that from the weight to take off 10% of the weight (since these are 90% silver coins. Okay, that gets the actual silver weight, before minusing wear (am i correct so far?). I've read once on this website that wear is .175 or something like that. Is that correct? That would take off around 17% i think and that seems crazy. I must be remembering wrong. Maybe it's .0175, but in any case i remember this site saying there's a standard decimal like this dealers use or factor in. Any input on all this would help me! Thanks

[wdrob]

I will bet this web site, along with the Frequently Asked Questions link at the bottom of the site will answer all your questions in your last post.

 

Coinflation

 

 

[$ilverHawk]

You're right. But when you do it by weight, then what's the forumla? I'm not the wisest collector, so sorry if my questions are a bit newbie-ish. Let's say you got 2 pounds. I'm not sure what you break that next into, ounces or grams? And then you would multiply by .10 and minus that from the weight to take off 10% of the weight (since these are 90% silver coins. Okay, that gets the actual silver weight, before minusing wear (am i correct so far?). I've read once on this website that wear is .175 or something like that. Is that correct? That would take off around 17% i think and that seems crazy. I must be remembering wrong. Maybe it's .0175, but in any case i remember this site saying there's a standard decimal like this dealers use or factor in. Any input on all this would help me! Thanks

 

By weight, if you are dealing in 90% silver, if you have 10 ounces then you have 9 ounces of silver. If you deal by weight, there are no calculations that need to be made for for wear or anything else. I believe you may be getting caught up with the verbiage of various sellers/web sites.

 

Bottom line, exactly how much silver are you buying?

[FishyOne]

You're right. But when you do it by weight, then what's the forumla? I'm not the wisest collector, so sorry if my questions are a bit newbie-ish. Let's say you got 2 pounds. I'm not sure what you break that next into, ounces or grams? And then you would multiply by .10 and minus that from the weight to take off 10% of the weight (since these are 90% silver coins. Okay, that gets the actual silver weight, before minusing wear (am i correct so far?). I've read once on this website that wear is .175 or something like that. Is that correct? That would take off around 17% i think and that seems crazy. I must be remembering wrong. Maybe it's .0175, but in any case i remember this site saying there's a standard decimal like this dealers use or factor in. Any input on all this would help me! Thanks

 

Just take the weight in troy ounces times 0.90 and you'll have the actual silver weight in troy ounces. There's no need to subtract anything because you're buying by weight. It's very simple. Don't make it complicated.

 

Most people buy 90% junk (dimes, quarters, halves) silver using the 0.715 multiplier and that accounts for about 2% wear. This method is (Spot Price) X (0.715) X (Face Value) = $$ worth of silver.

[joes2001]

"Just take the weight in troy ounces times 0.90 and you'll have the actual silver weight in troy ounces. There's no need to subtract anything because you're buying by weight. It's very simple. Don't make it complicated."

 

Okay, this is very clear. You make a good point. Thanks.

 

"Most people buy 90% junk (dimes, quarters, halves) silver using the 0.715 multiplier and that accounts for about 2% wear. This method is (Spot Price) X (0.715) X (Face Value) = $$ worth of silver."

 

I see what you're saying here, but this is where I think it gets confusing, with the inclusion of the face value and that .715 multiplier. For some reason I think this is all rather confusing. Probably is to most, I don't know. The answer before yours seems to be different. I bet a lot of collectors would give different answers to these silver things.

 

[FishyOne]

...I see what you're saying here, but this is where I think it gets confusing, with the inclusion of the face value and that .715 multiplier. For some reason I think this is all rather confusing. Probably is to most, I don't know. The answer before yours seems to be different. I bet a lot of collectors would give different answers to these silver things.

 

0.715 for junk silver comes from the fact that all U.S. silver coins (except dollars) that are commonly traded contain 0.7235 troy ounces of silver per $1 of face value. The number is "rounded down" to 0.715 to account for the wear on "average circulated" coins.

 

You can easily calculate where the 0.7235 came from too. Just divide the number of grams of silver in $1 face value of a dime, quarter, or half by 31.1 grams (one troy ounce).

 

A silver half dollar = 12.5 grams of 90% silver which equals 11.25 grams of silver. Times 2 equal 22.50 grams in $1 face value divided by 31.1 grams in a troy ounce = 0.7235.

 

Say silver is $20.00 an ounce and you have two silver halves ($1 face value). Then $20 X 0.715 X $1 = $14.30 worth of silver.

[joes2001]

Thanks so much for all the details. It's becomming clearer to me. I have a master's degree too (not in math!), and this is serious stuff. My wife is educated too and i bet she wouldn't understand this that well! I think, like anything, it takes a while to get familiar with it. Anyways, i'm used to hearing someone sell, let's say a 20 dollar face value bag, and just giving a price. I guess it's up to the buyer to check into all the basics like you detailed to make sure they're getting a good deal. Important stuff to know! Thanks again

[coinman_23885]

I think buying by face value is fine, but you may want to discount the price by ~5% to make up for wear.