What are your thoughts on proof-like coins?

[coinsandmedals]

I recently purchased a 1943 S steel cent graded by NGC as MS-63 PL and I was just wondering what other people think of proof-like coins? Do you think there is a strong demand for PL designated coins (other than Morgan Dollars and modern coinage), and do you think that demand for these coins will increase in the future? What kind of premium if any would you expect to see for a PL designated coins, to keep this simple let’s just restrict the answers to NGC and PCGS graded coins. I purchased this coin because I wanted something different to add to my type set, I could have easily just picked up a MS-67 example, but that seems to take some of the fun out of it.

[SkyMan]

IMO, just like any other coin, some PL's are quite attractive and worth a premium, while others are not.

[JIM F.]

I like PL's especially 19th century gold.

 

 

[coinman_23885]

IMO, just like any other coin, some PL's are quite attractive and worth a premium, while others are not.

 

This. There is a demand for quality proof like pieces. I collect prooflike coins and intentionally seek them out (as do a handful of other board members).

[JIM F.]

IMO, just like any other coin, some PL's are quite attractive and worth a premium, while others are not.

 

This. There is a demand for quality proof like pieces. I collect prooflike coins and intentionally seek them out (as do a handful of other board members).

 

Kenny, do you go for raw and/or PCGS coins that are not designated? If so, what is your success rate in getting them in NGC PL holders? Personally, I only buy NGC PL pieces because I don't want to take a chance.

 

 

 

[messydesk]

IMO, just like any other coin, some PL's are quite attractive and worth a premium, while others are not.

Aye. This. Also, some are easy to find, and some aren't.

[jpcienkus]

I like to collect them as well. I also look for DPL in the Morgan's I purchase. They can be tough to judge via pictures.

 

Agree with Skyman about whether they should carry a premium. But if you like the coin for your collection, than just buy it.

[BKW]

I like the look and collect pieces I think are nice. They are also one of the best ways to illustrate to novice collectors the difference between scratches and die polish lines.

[coinman_23885]

IMO, just like any other coin, some PL's are quite attractive and worth a premium, while others are not.

 

This. There is a demand for quality proof like pieces. I collect prooflike coins and intentionally seek them out (as do a handful of other board members).

 

Kenny, do you go for raw and/or PCGS coins that are not designated? If so, what is your success rate in getting them in NGC PL holders? Personally, I only buy NGC PL pieces because I don't want to take a chance.

 

 

 

Personally, I will buy any quality proof-like coin meaning that it is problem free, is relatively mark free and lacks marks that severely impede the mirrors, and the coin must have highly reflective mirrors. As a result I have and do buy raw coins, coins certified by PCGS and other companies. Also keep in mind that for non-Morgan Dollar U.S. type coinage, the PL and DPL designations were not always used; thus, there are even some pieces in older holders that have not been designated. (If you're curious, I believe NGC expanded the use of PL and DPL designations to all U.S. coins only within the last decade).

 

Most of my prooflike coins were purchased in NGC holders, and since I am not building a registry set per se, I haven't really bothered to cross most of my other coins to NGC (at least not yet). If I do, I'll happily share the results to you. Also, as an aside, I am a little turned off by NGC's relatively recent (within the last year and a half or so) cross-over policy, which requires that non PCGS coins be cracked out of their holders prior to grading. This increases the risk to submitter in my opinion, especially when I have seen some coins designated by old ANACS, for instance, hold their own weight and sell for decent premiums.

 

P.S. Since I know Physics will chime in soon and comment, I will preemptively qualify my last statement. There are nice coins in old ANACS holders that are designated and that are fully PL; however, the company also went through liberal periods in applying the designation, even back then. Each coin should be evaluated with caution. When properly imaged or seen in person, my experience is that the old ANACS coins can and do hold their own weight among collectors.

[physics-fan3.14]

Please post pictures of your PL Steelie - I am extremely interested in seeing it.

 

I am a huge fan of PL coins. You have to seek out the best examples, and the premium is different for every series. There are no rules.

 

Also - PCGS, in their infinite wisdom, does not designate PL on anything outside of the Morgan and a select few moderns. NGC, as usual, is the superior service in this regard.

 

For much more about the PL's, I would direct you to my Registry set, linked in my sig below.

[coinman_23885]

IMO, just like any other coin, some PL's are quite attractive and worth a premium, while others are not.

 

+1.

[jom]

Generally speaking I've never been a big fan of proof coins. Proof-like circulation strike coins I like even less...generally speaking. The reason I often dislike the latter is due to the fact many of these have dies that were polished leaving striations that show up on the coin (raised lines). To me these "look" like hairlines (obviously they aren't)...there are usually a LOT of them too. It's a matter of eye appeal for me.

 

To each their own I guess.

 

jom

[FishyOne]

I like truly PL coins however the premiums for them often keep me from buying them. Same with toners. Most attractively toned coins bring big premiums that I don't pay.

 

Lastly, I like attractive coins. Bronze, silver, gold, you name it. Someday, if my financial resources permit I will be buying more PL and toned pieces. For now I am quite content with what is available at reasonable price points. It seems to be a bit of a buyer's market on widgets these days. Widgets are coins too!

[nk1nk]

I think the demand for pl coins is growing. I like them but the premiums and lack of examples in most series keep me out of the game. I think to get the best prices and hard to find pieces you have to really know what your looking for and take chances on raw and pcgs coins. I think as popularity continues to grow you will see more graded by NGC. I think a lot of coins don't get sent in by less knowledgeable collectors because the polish lines do look like hairlines. Show us a picture, with only 10 graded pl wheat back cents you have a pretty rare coin.

 

All the pl wheats are 43 S. Does anybody have other years they think are pl (wheats only)

 

Nick

[RWB]

To me, PL coins are something of a acquired taste - much like "surstroemming."

 

A coin with minimal marks can be very impressive, but the polished fields emphasize every tiny nick and scrape. This makes many PL coins unattractive where with normal surfaces they would look much nicer.

 

[BillJones]

To me, PL coins are something of a acquired taste - much like "surstroemming."

 

A coin with minimal marks can be very impressive, but the polished fields emphasize every tiny nick and scrape. This makes many PL coins unattractive where with normal surfaces they would look much nicer.

 

This is my problem with most P-L Morgan dollars. If the coin is graded MS-63 or 64, it's affordable, but they are usually so marked up that they unattractive. If the coin grades MS-65 or higher, it is attractive,but the price is through the roof. When I was dealer, I'd find a lower grade P-L that was attractive, and I'd buy it. It would sell either at the same show or the next one.

[coinsandmedals]

I literally just purchased this coin two nights ago, and it’s currently on its way to my house. With that being said I’m still in school and will be for three weeks until summer, and as such I won’t have the coin in hand for three weeks (complete torture between my last submission and now this!). I’m going to post the sellers pictures as well as the cert number; the seller’s pictures are not very good but at least you will see what I got. Thanks for the comments thus far, a lot of my suspicions were confirmed about general opinions regarding PL coins, and a few new points have been brought to my attention. The cert number is 3510706-001

[coinsandmedals]

I’m not sure what happened with the pictures guys sorry, I have a class in 15 minutes but when I get out of the lab later tonight I will try to fix the issue.

[Mozin]

I collect NGC PL coins, and started collecting them back in 1999. I doubt anyone has as many Classic Commemoratives in NGC PL holders than I. If anyone thinks they can better my numbers, please email me. We need to communicate about our precious PLs.

 

A fellow by name of Bagne collected any NGC PLs he could find in certain series. A few years ago he dumped his collection into a Heritage auction. Of course the prices dumped. The prices are now about where they were before that auction. If I can recall, this man had about two dozen 1937 S Boones in NGC PL holders, some nice and some not so nice.

 

CAC often does not believe some issues of Classic Commemoratives NGC PL coins are indeed prooflike, so those with the CAC sticker are often pretty hard to find. Other issues in PL are usually stickered.

[JIM F.]

How can you not like these?

[Mozin]

Or not like these?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[cladking]

I confess I'm one of those who mostly likes only the nice attractive PL's. This is probably a bad attitude since PL's are so scarce and most PL"s aren't very attractive. PL's show up flaws much more readily than non-PL's which makes finding nice ones even tougher.

 

I used to just spend unattractive PL's until recently when I realized that these would still make a remarkable, stunning, and scarce collection even with their many scratches.

 

Some coins like '74-P clads are just too scarce in PL to be ignoring.

[World Colonial]

My opinion on PL is that they are significant first when there is no proof issue for the date and second, or if proofs exist but the number of survivors is "low". This is the criteria that I would generally use in determining how much I wanted to pay since logically, a PL is the closest substitute.

 

In the example of this 1943 steel cent, since there are no proofs, I would prefer it over an "equivalent" coin that has them and would pay proportionately more or a lot more. I'm not sure I would care for one in a grade of 63 but I would have to see the coin first. I have only owned one PL for one of my non-US coins which was graded 64 RB and it was a very high quality coin.

[coinman_23885]

Generally speaking I've never been a big fan of proof coins. Proof-like circulation strike coins I like even less...generally speaking. The reason I often dislike the latter is due to the fact many of these have dies that were polished leaving striations that show up on the coin (raised lines). To me these "look" like hairlines (obviously they aren't)...there are usually a LOT of them too. It's a matter of eye appeal for me.

 

Not all PL coins are overly saturated with die polish lines.

[Mr Bo Jingles]

I never gave PL and DPL coins much attention because I collect Morgans and there are many slabbed PL and DPL coins that are fugly and really make me wonder how it was designated as a prooflike coin.

 

Recently, I picked up an 1884 GSA MS65DPL that has a green bean and when it arrived in the mail I think I must have studied it for an hour or two before I sat it down. It is stunning.

 

Then I got another...and now I think I am hooked. Considering the minting process of the day, to find a graded morgan in PL or DPL is fairly uncommon, especially in GSA holders. Check the pops out if you haven't already. I think you may be surprised.

 

Happy Collecting!

 

Bo

[KeyMan64]

I'd like to have a small hoard of PL Mercury Dimes one day...

[RWB]

Bag worms....

[coinsandmedals]

Alright, I managed to get the pictures a little bigger. When I get back home I will take a few better pictures myself but this is all I have to offer at this moment. I’m a little confused by your comment RWB could you clarify?

[physics-fan3.14]

I'd like to have a small hoard of PL Mercury Dimes one day...

 

I only have 2, although I have owned a couple others previously The trick is to get them from different dates.

 

Coinsandmedals - congrats on that steel wheatie. If you ever decide you get tired of it and want to sell it, I will offer you a very strong price for it.

[dimefreak]

That'd look nice truviewed!!! Id also offer a strong price for it!