Help identifying early 20th century Chinese coins

[JKK]

I would try inserting the actual images, but they are much larger than what the forum guidelines suggest. Unfortunately, they have to be due to the wear--they are hard enough to read as it is. I have researched them using Krause and have a good idea of their timeframe and denominations, but there are so many similar coinages of the same types that it's very hard to figure which exact coin it is.

 

The first is a late Imperial (pre-Republic) 10 cash. Near as I can tell, the mint is the small character in the obverse center. Diameter is roughly 27.7mm:

 

Imperial 10 cash obverse

Imperial 10 cash reverse

 

The second is an early Republic 10 cash. Diameter roughly 27.7mm, same as the first. If it were crucial, I might be able to get a better obverse image.

 

Early ROC 10 cash obverse

Early ROC 10 cash reverse

 

The third is an early Republic 200 cash, a big 35.5mm hockey puck:

 

Early ROC 200 cash obverse

Early ROC 200 cash reverse

 

Any wisdom or assistance appreciated!

[Conder101]

On the first one the province looks like Chihli and the date is 1906. Looks like Y 10c.

 

Second one looks like Y 307

 

Working on the third one, did the other two this morning and then lost internet connection before I could respond. Don't have much time right now so I may not get the third one til tomorrow morning.

[JKK]

On the first one the province looks like Chihli and the date is 1906. Looks like Y 10c.

 

Bang. Now that I look at it, there's little doubt. Mint mark matches.

 

Second one looks like Y 307

 

Looks like it to me too, doesn't seem to have any of the subtypes of Y307.

 

Working on the third one, did the other two this morning and then lost internet connection before I could respond. Don't have much time right now so I may not get the third one til tomorrow morning.

 

Heh, no hurry. I'm just grateful for the help. Numista doesn't have the weights, so I'll have to weigh them and send the info along. If it would contribute to knowledge, I can post them here as well.

 

I'm wondering if it's Y 464, Szechuan. Color looks like copper, not brass; edge is plain. I'm not finding many issues in that denomination, which seems to narrow it down quite a bit.

[Conder101]

It is Szechuan, and it is in the Y 464 family. It is NOT 464 which has leaves overlapping the border around the 200 not blossoms. It is not 464.2 because it doesn't have the dot in the center of the first 0. And it is not 464.1 because the edge isn't reeded. The question is how many other 464 variations are there? Back when the Krause catalogs first came out they listed all(?) of the varieties of the Chinese coins with pictures. But over the years as the book got bigger and bigger they started dropping more and more of the varieties out of the catalog, and then even more as they started dropping more and more of the pictures to save room. When you are dealing with China you will often find that your coin doesn't quite match the ones shown in the current book. The only way to really be sure what variety you actually have is to have access to all of the back issues as well. Many times I have to go back years in my catalogs to find a specific variety. I do have all of the Krause catalogs all the way back to 1972 but I don't have them HERE. They are over at my fathers house and I don't go over there too often. I don't know if the Numismaster website still has all of the varieties in their database, or just the ones listed in the current catalog. No just the current ones and they don't have pictures of all of them.

[JKK]

I guess I can see where the Krause folks were coming from, though it impacts me adversely in this case. At least I'm a lot closer than I was before, so thank you very much for all the help with all three. I certainly can't ask anyone to go dig through a pile of old books, so I guess my next question would be asking for research tips on how I can figure out the exact variety. You probably already checked the most mainstream ones; where/how would you continue the search if the coin were yours?

[Conder101]

Actually I just searched through the copy of the 20th century Krause catalog that I have on my laptop, and through the Numismaster website (Which only duplicated the information on my laptop.) You aren't going to like the answer but if the coin was mine I would go over to my father's house and check out some of the early issues of the catalog to see if other varieties of the Y 464 were listed. If they did then I would start with the first issue and start trying to match the variety. Unfortunately I don't know any other books to search for variety information on these.

 

I've copied the images and if I can I will try to do some further checking but I warn you these next two weeks I am going to be fairly busy so I don't know for sure when I will be able to get to it.

[JKK]

It might not be the ideal answer but it's reality, so got to roll with it. If it's enjoyable for you to keep looking when you can, and have time, wonderful and thanks much. If that doesn't work out, thanks for all the help so far--I'm much closer than I was on one coin, and the other two are taken care of. I'll keep looking myself, and checking back as well just in case there's news.

[JKK]

Got weights on these now, sharing the information as planned:

 

The first is a late Imperial (pre-Republic) 10 cash. Near as I can tell, the mint is the small character in the obverse center. Diameter is roughly 27.7mm:

 

Imperial 10 cash obverse

Imperial 10 cash reverse

 

This Y 10c is 7.4g Cu.

 

The second is an early Republic 10 cash. Diameter roughly 27.7mm, same as the first. If it were crucial, I might be able to get a better obverse image.

 

Early ROC 10 cash obverse

Early ROC 10 cash reverse

 

This Y 307 is 6.8g Cu.

 

The third is an early Republic 200 cash, a big 35.5mm hockey puck:

 

Early ROC 200 cash obverse

Early ROC 200 cash reverse

 

This Y 464.? is 14.2g Cu.