The Langbords vs. The Astronauts.

[SkyMan]

As most of you know, the Langbord's Double Eagles were lost to the US Government. Obviously there were real questions as to whether the coins were obtained legitimately or not.

 

It helps if you are a public hero.

 

I've been chewing my nails for about two years now as the US Government was trying to take away items from Mercury/Gemini/Apollo era astronauts (and the people they had sold them to), saying that the (ex-NASA) era items were never "properly" given to the astronauts, so that in actuality the title to the items still resided with the US Govt.

 

It had been the tradition back in the 1960's and early 1970's that the Smithsonian got first dibs on anything it wanted. Whatever it didn't want the astronauts could claim and WERE GIVEN THEIR SUPERIOR'S UNWRITTEN BLESSINGS.

 

Early last year Ed Mitchell, the lunar module (LM) pilot of Apollo 14, tried to auction off a camera (these sort of items had been previously auctioned off for decades with no issue). Furthermore, the camera had been designated to have been left in the LM upper stage which was then deliberately crashed into the Moon's surface when it undocked from the Command Module (CM), so the camera would have been destroyed if Mitchell hadn't saved it. Anyhow, the Feds claimed the camera once it had been listed in the auction catalogue. FWIW the camera would have most likely sold in the $50,000 - $75,000 range. Mitchell did not have the sort of money necessary to fight back given the amount the camera was worth.

 

The US Govt. then proceeded to get more and more aggressive in claw backs. That was capped off when late last year Jim Lovell, the Commander of Apollo 13, auctioned off the CM log of Apollo 13 dealing with the explosion. The log went for ~ $375,000, and AFTER THE SALE, the Feds went after the log. At that point various of the astronauts started talking to lawyers, politicians etc. Earlier this year, 2012, a bill was introduced into Congress to confirm the astronaut's possession of these items. This weekend past it was passed by the Senate (I'm not sure by what margin, but I expect pretty huge), it was passed UNANIMOUSLY by the Congress, and today it was signed into law by the President. Needless to say, IMO justice was done... of course, I have a financial interest in the astronaut's having retained title.

 

I do find it interesting how political pressure can affect collecting. I'm glad to see this one come out "right".

[Mr.Mcknowitall]

A question, please. What is the meaning of lost to the Government?

 

Do you mean the passage of time before the coins "surfaced"?

 

The question of title has never been relinquished by the U.S Government (nor by the individuals that had physical control. for that matter).

[cpm9ball]

It's unfortunate that you have to be someone of such stature and fame as the astronauts who risked their lives to pioneer space exploration and travel to be able to get something done. Good for them!

 

Chris

[WoodenJefferson]

Course it is common knowledge that anything that is purchased with US Governments funds legally belongs to the government, forever...there are no real statutes of limitations, especially on military hardware.

 

NASA is 100% funded by the US Government hence when the space shuttle Columbia broke up on re-entry, pieces that immediately started showing up on e-Bay were claimed the property of the US Government and if not surrendered immediately, prosecution to recover the artifacts would commence.

 

Items that are retained by the astronauts for sentimental value (did they conceive at that time that these items would become extremely collectible and therefore command hefty prices?) still belong to the Government, but I'm glad that their efforts to preserve these items was challenged and they won.

 

Still though, is it ethical for them to profit from the sale of something that has flown in space or been on the moon that once belonged to Uncle Sam?

[cpm9ball]

Still though, is it ethical for them to profit from the sale of something that has flown in space or been on the moon that once belonged to Uncle Sam?

 

I believe that Sy had mentioned in another thread that it was very difficult for them to get life insurance, so, why not?

 

Chris