Monster toned coin. Or Is it really?

[Wihlborg]

I posted to a thread about toning earlier and it made me think about a related topic that I have been thinking about off and on for some time now. Has anyone else noticed how it seems that almost any coin being sold with a bit of toning on it, no matter how unattractive it may be, is being called ‘rainbow toned’ or ‘monster toned’ nowadays? And worse yet, some that sell these so-called ‘monster’ toned coins want a premium for them!

 

Before we go any further, let me say that I am using the term ‘monster’ in general. You my substitute any other term you like.

 

It is a fact that TRUE ‘rainbow’ or ‘monster’ toned coins are indeed rare, there are certainly not enough of them to satisfy demand, and in today’s market, true ‘monsters’ carry a steep premium that unfortunately prices most of them out of the reach of most collectors, myself included. Sure, depending upon the series, if you look hard enough, and are lucky enough, every once in a while you may be able to buy a true ‘rainbow’ or ‘monster’ toned coin for less than the price of a new BMW. However, in general, if you want to add a TRUE ‘monster’ toned coin to your collection, you had better be ready to get up off the porch and run with the big dogs! But it seems almost every collector wants toned coins nowadays, so we now have coins with so-so or even unattractive toning that are much more common, being called ‘monster’ toned coins to satisfy the demand for toning.

 

Just do a search on eBay for ‘toning’, ‘rainbow’, or ‘monster’ and look at what comes up. Are most of these coins the types of toned coins that you would call ‘monster’ toned? And it’s not just eBay, check out some of the dealers web sites. I have nothing against someone buying these coins if they like them, but are they, and should they be called ‘monsters’? Has the required eye appeal factor for ‘monster’ toned coins fallen and no one told me? Or could it be that the desire to own a ‘monster’ toned coin is so great that some are being duped into believing that these are what ‘monster’ toned coins look like?

 

Most importantly, will this hurt the hobby in the long run? After all, The true ‘monsters’ have the eye appeal to justify their premium to the well-heeled collectors who chase after them, and they are rare. The so-called ‘monsters’ on the other hand do not, so anyone paying a premium for them would be hard pressed to recoup the premium if they want to sell the coin to a dealer or knowledgeable collector.

 

While I realize the premium that the so-called ‘monsters’ bring is in almost all cases much less than that of a true ‘ monster’, it is never the less a premium. No one likes to learn that they over paid for something that was misrepresented, much like when someone buys an overgraded coin.

 

What do you think?

 

 

John

[Hoot]

I have thought for quite some time that what you are saying is true, John. It has gotten to the point that I totally ignore such claims and simply wish to view the coin and decide for myself just how monstrous the toning is. Besides, I think the term is stupid in the first place. Why not just state the obvious - darkly toned, concentric rainbow toning, pastel toning, light toning, transparent rainbow toning, etc., etc. These terms are more descriptive and the person looking at the coin can decide if it "grabs them like a monster" or not.

 

Most pictures of toned coins do poorly to represent the coin. It's definitely a challenge to capture the right colors, let alone the quality of the toning being depicted.

 

Hoot

[Leothelion]

I can only speak for the FS Jefferson nickels! But yes, they can be found and I'm finding them and I'll be finding them for a long time! Here's one that I wouldn't consider it a rainbow toned coin (see attachment). I'm hoping for a redish gold toned monster but the seller didn't say that, I'll need to wait a while to find out. Another term would be 'bullseye" toning, they are nice too, when they can be located, that is!

 

Leo

[TomB]

I agree that the terms are overused, abused and have truly become spam. There are those rare pieces that qualify, however, their price tags are typically commensurate with their quality. Therefore, most people will not buy them.

 

I don't see this hurting the hobby/industry as it is one thing to be deceived by a deliberately false grade, in example a coin claimed MS65 when in reality it is MS62, and quite another to have someone tell you that a coin is a "monster rainbow" when it really has a tiny bit of brown encrustation within the peripheral letters. You'd have to be awfully foolish and willingly blind to purchase the latter piece.

[dragon]

Wihlborg,

 

The terms 'rainbow' and 'monster' and whatever else have been misused and overused and done to death for many years now, both on Ebay and elsewhere.

 

Actual 'monster' or otherwise incredibly beautiful toned coins (Morgans in particular) are really NOT all that rare. There are actually many thousands of them that exist, and perhaps a thousand or so that could really be considered as 'world class monster toned' IMO. The problem is that the majority of them are not offered for sale very frequently if at all these days. It's been my experience that collectors of really nice toned pieces usually buy them and hold on to them like grim death. I actually still have a couple toned dollars that I purchased out of Superior auctions in the mid 80's. Most collectors of these types of coins know that once sold, they are very difficult to replace at ANY price down the road.

 

I have made the huge mistake of selling a few of my exceptional toned pieces a few years ago, and have regretted it ever since

 

dragon

[mommam17]

Yes, John. They are overused. Probably so sellers will have their coins looked at in searches for rainbow and monster. So many times I go to look at a coin listed as rainbow and find nothing close.

[Leothelion]

There's a FS nickel dealer out there who likes to overuse the words; monster, wow, blazer, super! My question has always been, which superlative is greater then the other?

 

Leo

[Wihlborg]

Dragon,

 

I agree that there are probably a couple/few thousand true ‘monster’ coins that exist, and that there are probably more ‘monster’ toned Morgan dollars than any other type of coin, but when I referred to true ‘monster’ toned coins being rare I did not mean in the sense that very few exist, although an argument could be made that if one were to look at the total mintage of coins compared to the number of true ‘monster’ toned coins in existence, they are indeed ‘rare’.

 

What I meant when I called them rare was as I said ‘there are certainly not enough of them to satisfy demand’. I also agree that when an astute collector does acquire a true ‘monster’ they tend to hang onto it for dear life.

 

In this market, it seems that color is king. Almost everyone wants a ‘monster’ toned coin, but due to the fact that true ‘monster’ toned coins are available infrequently, and when they are available usually trade for a substantial premium, they are not really within reach of the average collector. IMO this had led to the practice by some of calling almost any toned coin a ‘monster’, because some beginning or inexperienced collectors may be fooled into buying or paying a premium for a coin that a more experienced collector would offer less for, or pass on altogether.

 

Will this be the ruination of coin collecting? Of course not, but it just ticks me off seeing this type of thing going on. If it were I doing it, I don’t know how I would be able to look any knowledgeable collector in the eye, because I would know in my heart what they must think of me.

 

P.S. Hang onto those last few ‘monsters’ of yours!

 

John

[michael]

i think true monster toned coins have always been in demand and always will be

 

the proof is in the pudding if a coin is all there and a true monster then it will sell for a strong price easily to a strong buyer base

 

all the other so called monster toned coins that are sold to many unknowledgable price buyers well.............

 

has always happened in the past with coins is happening now in coins and i am sure will continue in the future

 

in the end when all is said and done true extra special extraordinary true monsters will always be in demand and sell for strong prices

 

also you might want to consider true really neatly to monster toned pre 1915 coins in proof and mintstate as many times these coins bring little to no premium for the toning and are rarely if ever seen so demand is there just not rabid and also these coins are extremely beautiful and currently with many series are basically undervalued coins

 

also a wonderful way to collect is not by date but by type and the coins all together look wonderful and something that is not easily duplicated

 

rare coins undervalued and just plasin beautiful additions to your collection

 

PLEASE SEE ATTACHMENT OF WHAT I AM TALKING ABOUT try to go find a coin that looks like this in a gem/superb gem holder

you cant!!!!!!

but when they are occasionally available they do not bring monster money!! even though they are monster toned and also gem or superb gem!!

 

what great values!! great looking!!! this is the key to any coin----- EYE APPEAL------ and has room for growth is a proud addition to your collection and i guarantee you when you go to sell you will find strong ready buyers!

 

michael

[jom]

This is a MONSTER thread with KILLER comments. I appreciated the RAINBOW of ideas and I'm sure they are RARE an PQ to boot!

 

Truly STUNNING!

 

 

jom

[spy88]

Between coin doctors and natural toning, even the TPGs are wary of slabbing any toned coin, and with reason. It is getting harder and harder to differentiate between the two as the docs get better and better at their "trade".

 

One fairly easy way to consider AT or NT is to look at the rarity of the coins date/mm/grade. Most ATed coins will be in the range of MS/PR64-67. MOST, (and I stress the MOST), doctors will not mess with a $10,000 coin in an attempt to increase the premium for eye appeal. The usual coins used are desired for their date/mm but not to the point of pop-tops. And there is also the aspect of ATing a coin to hide hairlines, minor nicks, scratches, etc.

 

As for Johns original question, I have to agree with his and many others assessment of overuse of tone terms, especially "monster". But as much as I hate the word, if it is used in a auction for a date/mm I am interested in, I will check it out. And usually end up passing on it.

[MastaHanky]

I posted to a thread about toning earlier and it made me think about a related topic that I have been thinking about off and on for some time now. Has anyone else noticed how it seems that almost any coin being sold with a bit of toning on it, no matter how unattractive it may be, is being called ‘rainbow toned’ or ‘monster toned’ nowadays?

 

I don't know what you're talking about.

 

[TomB]