Do the errors cancel out the cleaning?

[noow]

This coin is priced as an MS64FB exactly in terms of FMV (seller says it is a 64, I agree too). However, the coin is cleaned. But it also has a clip, clash, and is in an NCS holder to pick up the value. Do the positives erase the negatives?

[physics-fan3.14]

Sometimes, yes. On that coin, no.

 

Once the coin has been cleaned like that, by which I mean harshly polished to within an inch of its life, giving it a grade like 64 makes no sense. It has UNC details, and nothing more. If I were interested in the coin, I would start with an offer of maybe $75.

[noow]

Thanks for the response

[Kurtdog]

How many 1919 10Cs with curved clips and clashed dies in MS64FB do you think are out there? To a serious error collector, this coin is indeed important, dead surface, notwithstanding. I also like how NGC handled this one. Everything is right there, out in the open, noted on the slab, and let the market take it from there.

 

FWIW, I'm not a serious error collector; I'd pass on this one.

[physics-fan3.14]

How many 1919 10Cs with curved clips and clashed dies in MS64FB do you think are out there? To a serious error collector, this coin is indeed important, dead surface, notwithstanding. I also like how NGC handled this one. Everything is right there, out in the open, noted on the slab, and let the market take it from there.

 

FWIW, I'm not a serious error collector; I'd pass on this one.

 

Very few - but how many people care that its a 1919? Curved clips on Mercs are scarce, but available. Nobody collects them by date (that would be pretty much impossible). Error collectors most often collect by type of error, or if something looks cool. A much later date with a similar error but in a nicer condition would generate a lot more interest.

[WoodenJefferson]

A numerical grade should never pass the lips of a seller or buyer...UNK DETAILS is the correct description for this coin and assigning a phantom numerical grade for price fixing is just all wrong.

 

The coin can stand on it's own merits as a certified error.

[noow]

How many 1919 10Cs with curved clips and clashed dies in MS64FB do you think are out there? To a serious error collector, this coin is indeed important, dead surface, notwithstanding. I also like how NGC handled this one. Everything is right there, out in the open, noted on the slab, and let the market take it from there.

 

FWIW, I'm not a serious error collector; I'd pass on this one.

 

Very few - but how many people care that its a 1919? Curved clips on Mercs are scarce, but available. Nobody collects them by date (that would be pretty much impossible). Error collectors most often collect by type of error, or if something looks cool. A much later date with a similar error but in a nicer condition would generate a lot more interest.

This one has 2 errors and FB.

[physics-fan3.14]

How many 1919 10Cs with curved clips and clashed dies in MS64FB do you think are out there? To a serious error collector, this coin is indeed important, dead surface, notwithstanding. I also like how NGC handled this one. Everything is right there, out in the open, noted on the slab, and let the market take it from there.

 

FWIW, I'm not a serious error collector; I'd pass on this one.

 

Very few - but how many people care that its a 1919? Curved clips on Mercs are scarce, but available. Nobody collects them by date (that would be pretty much impossible). Error collectors most often collect by type of error, or if something looks cool. A much later date with a similar error but in a nicer condition would generate a lot more interest.

This one has 2 errors and FB.

 

Clashes are not significant, either in terms of interest or premium. FB are also not significant at this level. Actually, things like high grade, rare coins, or strike premiums are often less desirable on error coins - the premium and the interest is in the error.

[Kurtdog]

I'm just trying to figure out where we have an issue. Are you folks saying you think this coin should have been given a "no grade" for the improper cleaning? Understand, "improperly cleaned" knocks the coin's market value way down, already, while a "no grade" effectively takes the coin off the market, at least, to the describing TPG.

[physics-fan3.14]

I'm just trying to figure out where we have an issue. Are you folks saying you think this coin should have been given a "no grade" for the improper cleaning? Understand, "improperly cleaned" knocks the coin's market value way down, already, while a "no grade" effectively takes the coin off the market, at least, to the describing TPG.

 

No, the TPG and the slab are just fine. But noow and the seller are both trying to describe it as an MS-64 with cleaning - which just doesn't make sense.

[Kurtdog]

I'm just trying to figure out where we have an issue. Are you folks saying you think this coin should have been given a "no grade" for the improper cleaning? Understand, "improperly cleaned" knocks the coin's market value way down, already, while a "no grade" effectively takes the coin off the market, at least, to the describing TPG.

 

No, the TPG and the slab are just fine. But noow and the seller are both trying to describe it as an MS-64 with cleaning - which just doesn't make sense.

Son of a gun, I'm reading these things too quickly! I see what you mean, now. I had just looked back at the slab. For some reason it was stuck in my mind that it had been slabbed "MS64 improperly cleaned!"

 

OK, so you're thinking the grade should be irrelevant on a coin like this? Certainly, I consider the surface an important component of the technical grade. Thus, to call this a technical MS64, is to ignore that component. It's not a technical MS64 (at least, the way I technical grade these), when the surface is that impaired.

 

I'm going to have to think on this one a little more, but my eyesight is good, now, i.e., I think I see what you're saying.

 

PS: At least I figured out the 3.14 in your username is for pi (so, I'm not that clueless).

[Frank Provasek]

Silver coins are often polished to hide light wear. Once polished, it really can't be determined if the coin is AU or Unc, since the luster is been polished away, so even the Uncirculated designation is generous IMO. Claims to MS64 are preposterous.