Did NGC make a mistake ? AT or NT Ike ?

[TonerGuy]

Always hard to tell from photos but I think the coin on Ebay is NT.

 

Is NGC getting tough on toning ?

 

Here's the Ebay listing on the supposed AT coin....

 

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=130362929420&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT

 

I have several with similar toning in NGC slabs - none recently graded though...here's one as an example...and I have pulled other toned examples from Dansco albums with the same toning patterns....

 

 

Thoughts ?

[L1ncolnF4n]

Looks like mint celo toning to me

[physics-fan3.14]

I have no problem with that one. I have seen some incredibly wild Ikes, including one Shane showed me at FUN that he swears is NT. But the one in the OP is actually quite attractive.

[MarkFeld]

I would have guessed NT on the Ebay item. actually, I still do guess NT on it.

[TomB]

Sets stored longterm in Capital Plastics holders also can have Ikes with lilac, blue and pink shades throughout.

[Coindude]

I like the coin, but in today's coin society where the coin doctors are getting so good I can understand why they might question the toning. Unfortunately, I think this happens a lot because of them.

[kryptonitecomics]

Here's mine...I bought it as NT and I believe it to be NT and I let James Segoja see it at the FUN show and he thought NT and gave me a ballpark of what he'd pay if I get it into a PCGS holder. Obviously his thoughts mirror a lot of our thoughts surounding just how tough it is to get toned coins in holders these days...so I am going to submit the coin through a friend and I don't think I have better than 50/50 odds regardless of what I believe

 

The original coin in question looks NT to me....it may be accelerated from being stored in a certain type of album but I still but it took 5 to 10 years and to me that's NT

 

 

[Coindude]

I don't think it will cross because of the reverse. The obverse looks OK.... but the reverse has the mottled toning that I think raises too many flags.

[TonerGuy]

Kryptonite -- what holder is it in now ?

 

And I have to add that I dont think it would cross either. Beautiful coin and it might be NT but I think as coindude said the mottled toning raises flags. I havent seen a mottled toned Ike - not that I have seen every example of toned Ikes but mostly the ones I have seen have more uniform color or distinct album/rim toning.

[Tradedollarnut]

AT or NT doesn't matter since neither can be proven in the grading room. Market Acceptable or not is the determination - and the market has tightened in response to the coin doctors.

[kryptonitecomics]

Kryptonite -- what holder is it in now ?

 

And I have to add that I dont think it would cross either. Beautiful coin and it might be NT but I think as coindude said the mottled toning raises flags. I havent seen a mottled toned Ike - not that I have seen every example of toned Ikes but mostly the ones I have seen have more uniform color or distinct album/rim toning.

 

 

Coin is raw....just happens to be one of those pl;astic snaptite holder....

 

I agree with TDN....even if I had 10 years of video tabe showing the coin resting in an album, all that matter is whether the TPGs think it's market acceptable.

[coinman1794]

Always hard to tell from photos but I think the coin on Ebay is NT.

 

Is NGC getting tough on toning ?

 

Here's the Ebay listing on the supposed AT coin....

 

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=130362929420&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT

 

I have several with similar toning in NGC slabs - none recently graded though...here's one as an example...and I have pulled other toned examples from Dansco albums with the same toning patterns....

 

 

Thoughts ?

 

That appears to be a very natural IKE dollar. Clad coins OFTEN develope colorful toning due to the oxidation of residues that coat the coins from the moment of striking. And, mint packaging from the 1960s-1980s created a very bad environment for long term storage. Often, its not actual toning, but haze and surface contamination, but that's the case with toning on a lot of coins in general.

 

I agree that grading services have tightened on toned coins, but that doesn't mean the baby should be thrown out with the bath water. Modern coins tone very nicely when given the chance.

[coinman1794]

Here's mine...I bought it as NT and I believe it to be NT and I let James Segoja see it at the FUN show and he thought NT and gave me a ballpark of what he'd pay if I get it into a PCGS holder. Obviously his thoughts mirror a lot of our thoughts surounding just how tough it is to get toned coins in holders these days...so I am going to submit the coin through a friend and I don't think I have better than 50/50 odds regardless of what I believe

 

The original coin in question looks NT to me....it may be accelerated from being stored in a certain type of album but I still but it took 5 to 10 years and to me that's NT

 

 

 

I have not seen a Silver IKE tone this way, and I think that color is questionable. Also, it should not be compared to the 1971 clad IKE. The "toning" on copper-nickel is a completely different reaction.

[kryptonitecomics]

Here's mine...I bought it as NT and I believe it to be NT and I let James Segoja see it at the FUN show and he thought NT and gave me a ballpark of what he'd pay if I get it into a PCGS holder. Obviously his thoughts mirror a lot of our thoughts surounding just how tough it is to get toned coins in holders these days...so I am going to submit the coin through a friend and I don't think I have better than 50/50 odds regardless of what I believe

 

The original coin in question looks NT to me....it may be accelerated from being stored in a certain type of album but I still but it took 5 to 10 years and to me that's NT

 

 

 

I have not seen a Silver IKE tone this way, and I think that color is questionable. Also, it should not be compared to the 1971 clad IKE. The "toning" on copper-nickel is a completely different reaction.

 

 

I know many have not...one look at James's registry set and you should see a few examples with similar colors. Now that's doesn't guarantee the coin is NT but I will tell you that I owned two PCGS Clad piece that had very silimar toning to my silver Ike so I know that it can happen and they have graded them in the past. Would they grade it today.....I think it's a coin toss. Regardless I have my reasons for believing the toning is legit and I don't think I could convince to many people that it is and possibly not the TPGs either but I willing to pay the fees and take my chances. What you will not see is me posting the coin in a genuine holder followed by me complaining that I got ripped off by PCGS/NGC I'll pay for an opinion and they will provide one....whether I agree or not is irrelevant

 

as an example of just how colorful clad Ikes can tone...here are a few coins in the top PCGS registry sets.....2 of the 3 are clad and we all know that silver is much more reactive then clad

 

 

 

 

[gbsten]

That's interesting toning on those 3 Ikes! It looks like the center one is the silver?

[Coindude]

Honestly Shane, I see only a resemblance to yours in that the third one you showed has similar toning to the obverse of the original that you posted. But, the reverse is what raises flags for me, not the obverse.

[RareSov]

Those PCGS slabbed toners are very nice. Even colour progression, not at all patchy

 

That's the main thing I've having trouble with. The patches on the reverse

 

Impossible to tell without the coin in hand in a darkroom with proper lighting

[kryptonitecomics]

I am not trying to convince you that mine is NT...just trying to show you and others some of what's out there currently in PCGS plastic....and there are many many more including coins that look just like mine. If I had 50 of them though....it doesn't mean mine is NT.....that's just a personal feeling based on what I have seen vs potentially what you and other have seen.

 

No real way to prove it one way or the other conclusively as I haven't owned the coin since it's release (thumbs u

[coinman1794]

Here's mine...I bought it as NT and I believe it to be NT and I let James Segoja see it at the FUN show and he thought NT and gave me a ballpark of what he'd pay if I get it into a PCGS holder. Obviously his thoughts mirror a lot of our thoughts surounding just how tough it is to get toned coins in holders these days...so I am going to submit the coin through a friend and I don't think I have better than 50/50 odds regardless of what I believe

 

The original coin in question looks NT to me....it may be accelerated from being stored in a certain type of album but I still but it took 5 to 10 years and to me that's NT

 

 

 

I have not seen a Silver IKE tone this way, and I think that color is questionable. Also, it should not be compared to the 1971 clad IKE. The "toning" on copper-nickel is a completely different reaction.

 

 

I know many have not...one look at James's registry set and you should see a few examples with similar colors. Now that's doesn't guarantee the coin is NT but I will tell you that I owned two PCGS Clad piece that had very silimar toning to my silver Ike so I know that it can happen and they have graded them in the past. Would they grade it today.....I think it's a coin toss. Regardless I have my reasons for believing the toning is legit and I don't think I could convince to many people that it is and possibly not the TPGs either but I willing to pay the fees and take my chances. What you will not see is me posting the coin in a genuine holder followed by me complaining that I got ripped off by PCGS/NGC I'll pay for an opinion and they will provide one....whether I agree or not is irrelevant

 

as an example of just how colorful clad Ikes can tone...here are a few coins in the top PCGS registry sets.....2 of the 3 are clad and we all know that silver is much more reactive then clad

 

 

 

 

 

Shane, I'm the one who said, in this post, that clad IKEs DO develope great color, but I would call those coins AT every time, based on the pictures. They are not the same as what I have seen and believe to be natural rainbow color. I dont care what the grading services say.

[coinman1794]

Those PCGS slabbed toners are very nice. Even colour progression, not at all patchy

 

That's the main thing I've having trouble with. The patches on the reverse

 

Impossible to tell without the coin in hand in a darkroom with proper lighting

 

Color progression and splotchiness are not signs of AT. MOST natural coins are not evenly toned or showing a nice color progression. Those that do command a premium for that reason. That is not to say that some AT coins are not splotchy.