Can somebody explain this to me?

[gbsten]

I'm just dumb-founded by the pricing some people are asking (and getting!) for State Quarters and Presidential Dollars! Why purchase coins at 400-2000x face for an issue that's only 5 years old??? I don't claim to be intelligent, but I can't understand why people would pay these prices for coins that IMO have only one direction to go in value.

Also the fact that many of these have mintages in the 10's of millions, and most people I know have rolls (and bags) of these stashed. I would imagine there's ten's of thousands of MS 67/68 coins stashed that have never been graded! I know the easy answers...(1)I'm stupid or (2) people that buy them are, but really, can someone enlighten as to some of the rational as to why these are an "investment grade" issue?? Call me old-fashioned but I still purchase coins to collect for their beauty and history.

[EZ_E]

Your instincts are spot on! There's nothing wrong with you recognizing irrational behavior.

 

Ultra high grade moderns, in general, are just a fad that will never sustain their current prices over the long term. Many have already fallen drastically in value over the past couple of years.

 

Lots of the demand placed on the MS and PR70 coins are from registry set participants. PCGS is usually less liberal in the 70 grades than NGC, hence the drastic price differentials.

 

However, there are legitimate condition rarities among clad coinage, especially from the late '60's through the '70's. Many non silver Ikes are extremely difficult to find above MS65, same goes with many of the quarter issues in mint state.

[James_OldeTowne]

The way I look at it, many people collection coins with total disregard for price, and that's something I respect. I recently paid an outrageous amount for a meal at a restaurant that I could have had at home for 1/10 the price. But, that's just me.

[PerryHall]

The way I look at it, many people collection coins with total disregard for price, and that's something I respect. I recently paid an outrageous amount for a meal at a restaurant that I could have had at home for 1/10 the price. But, that's just me.

 

Why would you respect someone that overpays for coins or anything else?

[BillJones]

The way I look at it, many people collection coins with total disregard for price, and that's something I respect. I recently paid an outrageous amount for a meal at a restaurant that I could have had at home for 1/10 the price. But, that's just me.

 

Why would you respect someone that overpays for coins or anything else?

 

It's not a matter of respect; it’s a matter of the competitiveness that is built into a lot of us who have been successful in other fields. You look at your spot on the registry, and you have this urge to go higher in the rankings. That little bug bites me every once in while, but intellectually I’ve learned to resist it.

 

I looked at one of the people who is ahead of me in the type coin area and have analyzed what is going on. He spends big bucks for 20th century coins in high grades and gets lots of points. His early coins are mostly low grade, like FR-02 and Good-4. In one instance he has placed an 1804 restrike cent in MS-65, brown in the Draped Bust cent slot and gets the registry points for an MS-65 coin. He has taken a coin that is worth $2 grand and gets credit for a coin that sells for $20 grand. That’s just not right.

 

My early coins from 1792 to 1807 range in grade from a low of VF-25 for my 1796 Quarter to MS-62, Brown for my 1795 cent. The average falls around EF-45 to AU-50. When it comes to early coins, you don’t get many registry points given their market values. If you collect quality early coins, you don’t get the points you deserve. But I’m not going to change my collection for the sake of the registry.

 

My goal is completeness and education. I want to be one of the few collectors who has a 100% complete collection in a tough series. I post photographs of all my coins, and this year I’m going to beef up more of my notes about them. I’ve won the “best presented” award a couple of times, and to me that means more than winning a trophy for the most points with a display with no pictures and no write-ups.

 

And don’t get me started on these “obscured sets.” They should not be in the running for anything. Giving any award to an obscured set is just not right.

 

[James_OldeTowne]

The way I look at it, many people collection coins with total disregard for price, and that's something I respect. I recently paid an outrageous amount for a meal at a restaurant that I could have had at home for 1/10 the price. But, that's just me.

 

Why would you respect someone that overpays for coins or anything else?

What makes you think he overpaid? He enjoys the coins, and he didn't need the money (we can assume) to satisfy any other needs.

 

I paid $35 for a sit down meal that I literally could make for $4. But I did not overpay.

 

My point is, someone need not just "pay for a coin". They "pay for a coin plus the enjoyment of ownership". And, nobody can determine for others what "enjoyment of ownership" costs.

 

To give another example, I don't frown one bit on people who like colorized coins. Some say it's ridiculous to pay $20 for a colorized state quarter, but if the buyer feels he's getting his money's worth out of it, who am I to criticize?

[Cimm]

nobody can determine for others what "enjoyment of ownership" costs - James_EarlyUS

 

New sig line!

[BillJones]

My point is, someone need not just "pay for a coin". They "pay for a coin plus the enjoyment of ownership". And, nobody can determine for others what "enjoyment of ownership" costs.

 

To give another example, I don't frown one bit on people who like colorized coins. Some say it's ridiculous to pay $20 for a colorized state quarter, but if the buyer feels he's getting his money's worth out of it, who am I to criticize?

 

Joy of ownerhsip is one thing. Setting a precedent for a coin at a wildly inflated price is very much of another. Yes, adults are entitled to spend their money as they choose so long as they don’t expect others to compensate them for their mistakes or stupidity. But when less than honest dealers use runaway prices as method to convince new collectors to “follow the lemmings,” the lemmings deserve to be warned. If they go ahead anyway, well that’s the way it goes.

[Jakeblue]

Count me as an modern collector who "learned" to appreciate some finer coins and currency from 1800's and early 1900's. While I did not seek high grade quarters, I did seek plenty of them.

 

I am much happier now; and the investment should hold true as long as I stick close to market value. If not, I will not regret one cent spent (pun) in the pursuit of some of the nicest coins (my opinion) that I can afford.

 

It is a learning process and one that I can see will probably never stop.

[EZ_E]

It is a learning process and one that I can see will probably never stop.

 

Exactly. And I strongly disagree with James' opinion that it doesn't matter if one overpays as long as one is satisfied with the purchase. It is human nature to hate to see their purchase worth only a fraction of what they paid for it whether now or later once they gain more knowledge.

 

When I was a nube, I was talked into paying $300 for a Binion dollar that I later sold for $50. I did not appreciate that lesson or many similar ones like it at all.

 

I have bought some PR70 coins for my type set when they were very cheap for their added point value and I don't regret those purchases.

 

I should pick up another one just so that I can pass TomB again on our registry sets and spit in his eye when I pass him.

 

And Bill, look at my registry set, there is a Roosevelt dime and a Washington quarter that are worth hella points for very little cash. I had noticed them on another set and thought the same as you so I decided to immolate them instead of stewing. (thumbs u

[Schatzy]

My point is, someone need not just "pay for a coin". They "pay for a coin plus the enjoyment of ownership". And, nobody can determine for others what "enjoyment of ownership" costs.

?

 

Great point!! I hate it when people tell me that I am wasting my money buying modern coins, last time I checked I was spending my money!! When I was in the Navy I usually dropped $400 to $500 a month on my bar tab. I don't go to bars anymore and I buy coins instead!!

[lehigh96]

I really wish more collectors thought that way Jaime. My brother spends $10K/year on a country club membership. I think paying that much to play a game that is similar to torture is insane. But if it makes him happy, more power to him.

 

If a knowledgeable collector wants to "overpay" for a coin because he really wants the coin, that does not make him a fool. Despite the incessant attempts by most collectors to judge the prowess of a coin collector on his ability to strike good deals and obtain coins at wholesale prices, I would rather overpay for all my coins. Coins that drive premiums usually do so for a reason. Coins with superior eye appeal are rarely found in the bargain bin. I am certain that if I ever sell my collection, I will lose money. That money lost is the price I paid to enjoy owning those coins and IMO, money well spent.

[bartlesvilleok]

I really wish more collectors thought that way Jaime. My brother spends $10K/year on a country club membership. I think paying that much to play a game that is similar to torture is insane. But if it makes him happy, more power to him.

 

If a knowledgeable collector wants to "overpay" for a coin because he really wants the coin, that does not make him a fool. Despite the incessant attempts by most collectors to judge the prowess of a coin collector on his ability to strike good deals and obtain coins at wholesale prices, I would rather overpay for all my coins. Coins that drive premiums usually do so for a reason. Coins with superior eye appeal are rarely found in the bargain bin. I am certain that if I ever sell my collection, I will lose money. That money lost is the price I paid to enjoy owning those coins and IMO, money well spent.

 

I agree with both of you to a point. If the coin they purchase is close to what the coin is selling for at the time. I am not sure what the LP2 rolls are going for on ebay now for example but people have said they are on the rise with the errors being found. To me buying them on ebay is kind of nuts when you can still get them at the mint.

[EZ_E]

Paying above sheet value for a killer coin is not the same thing as overpaying for a coin. Take TomB for example, he has quality coins because he is willing to pay for them. The truly nice coins in my type collection, I paid quite a bit over "market value" for the grade. I even paid nearly 3 times for one of them. This is not a bad purchasing decision, IMO. But paying $300 for a P & D roll of presidential dollars is a bad decision unless one can sell them for more. I think that $8.95 for $1 worth of 2009 Lincoln cents is ridiculous, let alone a hundred bucks. Given a chance to grow and mature in the hobby, most will learn to recognize the land mines vs the cherry trees.

[James_OldeTowne]

And I strongly disagree with James' opinion that it doesn't matter if one overpays as long as one is satisfied with the purchase. It is human nature to hate to see their purchase worth only a fraction of what they paid for it whether now or later once they gain more knowledge.

Victor, great discussion!

 

Let's please understand that I do not advocate running out to the bourse and paying ten times retail for everything in sight. What I am saying is that sometimes, I don't really care what something is going to cost me, because I want it at any price. It just isn't possible for us to sit in judgment of others when we have no idea what their motive is for wanting something so badly.

 

 

[EZ_E]

Let's please understand that I do not advocating running out to the bourse and paying ten times retail for everything in sight. What I am saying is that sometimes, I don't really care what something is going to cost me, because I want it at any price. It just isn't possible for us to sit in judgment of others when we have no idea what their motive is for wanting something so badly.

 

That I can agree with as well as every passionate collector should. (thumbs u

[Didz]

If I see something I want... I either buy it or leave it regardless of price. I've over paid for a lot of things is life.. houses, tools, coins, cars, motorcycles.. women

 

My collection consists of mainly modern coins and some higher quality older coins. I'm a bit of a perfectionist so I lean towards brite shiny new perfect coins. Its one thing to pay to much.. its another to be foolish. I typically shop around but sometimes I am limited to one source and that source is not always the best or least expensive. I am all for what makes a person happy. You can't take it with ya.. so might as well enjoy it. (thumbs u

[gbsten]

Thank you for everyone's input on this thread! My intent was not to ridicule or start a war and your posts have been very informative! It got me to thinking about my $800.00 pool cue and my $1,500.00 golf clubs and I gained an understanding. I guess it boils down to a simple premise...passion! The market and demand dictate price and obviously

that is what supports these prices. Also it never occured to me about the registry aspect

of these coins. Like the many things I purchase for a higher price, the reason is I WANT it! Thank you for explaining this to me in a way I could gain understanding as to the aspect of pricing and purchases. One thing is for sure, my golf clubs will never go up in value, I just wanted the best! Thank you for enlightening me.