Just back from NGC-Cool story

[prudden]

Hey all,

First,I need to say,that without the critiques of my posted coin pictures and the expertise and especially patience of you all here, I'm sure my submission results would have been very different. I've learned a lot about what things to look for before even thinking of getting coins graded.

Just got my last submission back from NGC. It was pretty much what I expected,though I have a real gripe on two coins that I'm sending back for designation review.. That said ,nine out 11 Morgans graded.Two were body bagged with Obverse improperly cleaned.

The best one was this 1880S. I bought this coin at auction on Ebay about 8 months ago. It was shown in the auction with a nice picture of an ordinary Proof Like 80 S with no distinguishing marks or toning at all and that was what it was selling as. So,I bid and won and when the coin came it was this one. It didn't look exactly like it does now when it came.It arrive in an old torn and pinholed flip.The fields were kind of hazy and spotted and to say the least, I was pretty upset. I let the sellers know exactly how I felt. They made some excuses about the pictures and something about it sitting in a draw for thirty years.They did say they would take it back.

I was all set to return it when my landlord told me I should hold on to it. So,I did.After awhile I heard about ways to "fix" spotting and hazing without causing damage. So,I sent off a couple coins to a forum member and had it done. This is the result. I turned a purchase of $30.00 into a $200+ coin. 64 DPL baby!!This and my MS 63 1878 7/8 Morgan made the whole thing worth it.I got the 7/8 Morgan for around $60.00. Even though it's just as nice with or without the grade it's just a fact that if you sell your coins raw you'll never get market price. I also want to say,I don't recommend using Acetone on coins unless you know what you are doing or you know someone who does.

 

[bsshog40]

That's a nice looking Morgan Prudden!!

[123cents]

DPL...Wow! Congratulations.

[coinman1794]

Hey all,

First,I need to say,that without the critiques of my posted coin pictures and the expertise and especially patience of you all here, I'm sure my submission results would have been very different. I've learned a lot about what things to look for before even thinking of getting coins graded.

Just got my last submission back from NGC. It was pretty much what I expected,though I have a real gripe on two coins that I'm sending back for designation review.. That said ,nine out 11 Morgans graded.Two were body bagged with Obverse improperly cleaned.

The best one was this 1880S. I bought this coin at auction on Ebay about 8 months ago. It was shown in the auction with a nice picture of an ordinary Proof Like 80 S with no distinguishing marks or toning at all and that was what it was selling as. So,I bid and won and when the coin came it was this one. It didn't look exactly like it does now when it came.It arrive in an old torn and pinholed flip.The fields were kind of hazy and spotted and to say the least, I was pretty upset. I let the sellers know exactly how I felt. They made some excuses about the pictures and something about it sitting in a draw for thirty years.They did say they would take it back.

I was all set to return it when my landlord told me I should hold on to it. So,I did.After awhile I heard about ways to "fix" spotting and hazing without causing damage. So,I sent off a couple coins to a forum member and had it done. This is the result. I turned a purchase of $30.00 into a $200+ coin. 64 DPL baby!!This and my MS 63 1878 7/8 Morgan made the whole thing worth it.I got the 7/8 Morgan for around $60.00. Even though it's just as nice with or without the grade it's just a fact that if you sell your coins raw you'll never get market price. I also want to say,I don't recommend using Acetone on coins unless you know what you are doing or you know someone who does.

 

 

Nice coin! Acetone is one of the safest (on the coin) and easiest chemicals to use on coins, however, there are definitely ways of doing to wrong, so...good advice!

[James_OldeTowne]

AWESOME results!!!!!!!!!!

 

And... in response to your PM, YES I remember this coin .

 

[realone]

I just wanted to add another side to the issue at hand. I rather own an ugly and most likely original coin than one that is cleaned or dipped with acetone and therefore not original, jmho. And I say this just so newbees understand that with the use of acetone you may have a prettier coin after but the top layer has been removed and thus the coin isn't as original as it once was before.

[physics-fan3.14]

I just wanted to add another side to the issue at hand. I rather own an ugly and most likely original coin than one that is cleaned or dipped with acetone and therefore not original, jmho. And I say this just so newbees understand that with the use of acetone you may have a prettier coin after but the top layer has been removed and thus the coin isn't as original as it once was before.

 

Acetone will not remove the top layer of the coin. An acetone treated coin is perfectly original. Acetone will only remove foreign and potentially damaging contaminants from the surface of the coin, such as PVC. So you would rather own a coin with active PVC eating into the surface than one from which the PVC has been removed, thus saving the coin?

 

Now, dipping a coin, on the other hand, will remove the surface of the coin. Dip and acetone are not the same thing, behave in completely different manners, and have completely different results. The two should not be confused.

 

 

[James_OldeTowne]

I agree completely that from a numismatic perspective, acetone has no impact on the original quality of a coin. If the acetone does change a coin's appearance because of reaction with some contaminant on the coin's surface, then the coin was not original to begin with (again from a numismatic perspective).

[prudden]

I just wanted to add another side to the issue at hand. I rather own an ugly and most likely original coin than one that is cleaned or dipped with acetone and therefore not original, jmho. And I say this just so newbees understand that with the use of acetone you may have a prettier coin after but the top layer has been removed and thus the coin isn't as original as it once was before.

 

 

Is it a silver or copper coin?I have heard of,but never seen adverse reactions with acetone and copper. Also,I've only used it on Uncirculated silver.Many of these coins have been contaminated with all sorts of things from PVC from being stored in old plastic to finger/skin oils.As you can see in the pictures the coin still has the original toning. Acetone won't even touch natural toning.Dip will remove toning.

[physics-fan3.14]

I suppose I should pull out the two threads I started on the Acetone subject:

 

PVC and Acetone: A Step by Step Guide

 

What You Need To Know about PVC

[Schatzy]

[prudden]

Hope I haven't opened up a can of worms here.I could have, and maybe should have,left out the part about the Acetone treatment,but it seemed at the time a necessary part of the story on the coin.I don't know. You think NGC will take away my grade now?!!

[physics-fan3.14]

Oh, no, prudden, I completely am in favor of acetone treatment, and I think most people are. Just out of curiosity, do you have "before" pictures to illustrate the transformation?

[realone]

When I haer that a coin has been dipped, are you saying that term doesn't mean acetone was used?

[physics-fan3.14]

When I haer that a coin has been dipped, are you saying that term doesn't mean acetone was used?

 

Correct. Dip and acetone refer to two different things. The two terms are not used interchangeably, because they act on the coin in very different ways. Acetone is acceptable and encouraged by most, dip is frowned on by most.

[realone]

Then I made a mistake, it is confusing to me, the reason being depending to whom one speaks with, dipping is acceptable and doesn't hurt the coin, many dealers recommend it. I am a wus and want a coin to be as original as possible so I have shied away from applying anything to a coin's surface for fear of ruining, altering, or changing the surfaces of a coin.

 

If acetone can be proven to only affect pvc etc and not affect the coins surfaces and/or remove any metal then I can accept it's use to protect the coin.

[prudden]

Oh, no, prudden, I completely am in favor of acetone treatment, and I think most people are. Just out of curiosity, do you have "before" pictures to illustrate the transformation?

 

Well, I had posted a before and after quite awhile ago. I did that with this one and an 86 Morgan in totally different posts.I found the 86 DMPL.But not this coin.The 86 graded too.But they messed up on that one. .Besides.the pictures I used must not have been very good,because the responders didn't see much difference. Here are the only before pictures I have. I think if I had submitted it in this condition It would have been body bagged?Or a lower grade maybe. Here it is. I think they show that the graded coin has a pretty big decrease in the haze and spottiness.?

 

 

[coinman1794]

Then I made a mistake, it is confusing to me, the reason being depending to whom one speaks with, dipping is acceptable and doesn't hurt the coin, many dealers recommend it. I am a wus and want a coin to be as original as possible so I have shied away from applying anything to a coin's surface for fear of ruining, altering, or changing the surfaces of a coin.

 

If acetone can be proven to only affect pvc etc and not affect the coins surfaces and/or remove any metal then I can accept it's use to protect the coin.

 

Acetone is a solvent that dissolves contamination off the surface of coins. Dip is an acid that eats a layer of the coins surface away. Many people have no problem with dipping, and this is where the confusion occures...because dip is an irriversable alteration, on a microscopic level, of a coin's surface, yet because you cant always see the affects, its accepted in most circles.

[RareSov]

Well said !

 

Which is why dip should be used very sparingly and washed off quickly, while acetone is a bath. I know many of you love your acetone bath !