Bent = no grade?

[RockMyAmadeus]

So, I have a 1922 plain 1c, strong reverse, but with a tiny bit of a bend in it. Is this going to be body bagged by PCGS or NGC automatically? Should I post pics?

[TomB]

Bent coins, which were not made with the bend, are bagged as post-Mint damage.

[RockMyAmadeus]

 

[RockMyAmadeus]

Bent coins, which were not made with the bend, are bagged as post-Mint damage.

 

Regardless of the degree of damage?

 

 

Are there other options?

[BillJones]

I'm guessing by the uneven wear on the reverse that it is bent in the area of "O" in "ONE." In that coin, the coin looks like a Fine with out the damage which would net grade it Choice Good IMO. Most collectors would prefer a Good without the damage.

 

I've read that there were some Type Gold dollars that were struck bent. My guess is that those coins would get body bagged despite the fact that they have been that way since day one.

[TomB]

The as-issued bent coins that I was thinking of are certain varieties of the Pine Tree shilling that were made on wavy planchets that appear bent.

[James_OldeTowne]

Numerous bust and early coppers are also essentially struck on bent planchets (technically "cupped"), and sometimes, they are bagged. Yet another reason certified early coins don't interest me much.

 

I know that straightening coins can be very successful, and I have done it a handful of times with great success.

[World Colonial]

Not a US coin but early 18th century Spanish silver also has a wavy planchet. I have five of them in NGC and PCGS holders.

[Conder101]

I've read that there were some Type Gold dollars that were struck bent.

How do you strike a coin with a pair of dies that are essentially flat and strike the coin bent?

 

The as-issued bent coins that I was thinking of are certain varieties of the Pine Tree shilling that were made on wavy planchets that appear bent.[/quote

The S wave in the Pine tree shillings comes from the use of a rocker press. It is a characteristic of that type of press.

 

Is it possible the Spanish pieces mentioned were also struck on a rocker press? If so then the wave would be a normal feature of the coin and so it wold be slabable. (Likewise for the Pine tree shillings)

[RockMyAmadeus]

Sooo....any options on my '22?

[James_OldeTowne]

Sooo....any options on my '22?

"Fine" details, but a no-grade for sure. It's dented, and even after the dent is removed, the wear pattern will not look right.

[L1ncolnF4n]

Go ANACS. They'll give it a genuine details grade.

[123cents]

NCS, ANACS, and ICG will slab the coin.

[MBA101]

I have an 1809 O-107A CBH that is bent. I was always wondering about how it got that way because the bend is only slightly noticeable, and has caused excessive wear to the bust. It must have been struck that way. This also has a severe die crack...ANACS gave it a VF 20 with no mention of the bend.

 

[James_OldeTowne]

I have an 1809 O-107A CBH that is bent. I was always wondering about how it got that way because the bend is only slightly noticeable, and has caused excessive wear to the bust. It must have been struck that way. This also has a severe die crack...ANACS gave it a VF 20 with no mention of the bend.

This is exactly what I wrote about earlier. The coin is (likely) not bent, but was actually struck bent. That is also why the die crack is present. The obverse die was no longer "flat", and thus the resulting coins it struck would not be "flat".

[MBA101]

I have an 1809 O-107A CBH that is bent. I was always wondering about how it got that way because the bend is only slightly noticeable, and has caused excessive wear to the bust. It must have been struck that way. This also has a severe die crack...ANACS gave it a VF 20 with no mention of the bend.

This is exactly what I wrote about earlier. The coin is (likely) not bent, but was actually struck bent. That is also why the die crack is present. The obverse die was no longer "flat", and thus the resulting coins it struck would not be "flat".

 

Isn't this stuff cool?

[mrstock]

All circulated coins have post mint damage dont they? the only issue I would see would be whether or not it would fit correctly in a slab being bent.

[BillJones]

All circulated coins have post mint damage dont they? the only issue I would see would be whether or not it would fit correctly in a slab being bent.

 

While it is true that all circulated coins (an almost all Proof and Mint State coins because anything below MS-70 has something wrong with it) the type and degree of damage is what counts. Wear over the surfaces of a circulated coin translate into the grades from Poor-1 to AU-58. Beyond that, scratches, corrosion (environmental damage), nicks and holes all take their toll and reduce the value of the coins even within the same grades.

 

Collectors disagree as the exact hierarchy of problems, but I think that you will find that almost all collectors rate a hole, which should not be there (there are a small number coins and a much larger number of tokens and medalet where a hole is okay), is the worst. Generally any kind of damage that shows signs of having been done intentionally is also bad. Bent, be it intentional or not, is also a major problem even if the coin was struck that way. Bent is generally worse than a scratch unless the scratch is very large and noticeable. Bent is even worse than light corrosion in the opinion of many collectors.

 

Earlier it was noted that some Massachusetts silver coins, which are sometimes inaccurately lumped together as the “pine tree shillings, are on wavy planchets because they were struck on a device known as a rocker press. Despite the inherent nature of this “defect” I will guarantee you that a straight piece of Massachusetts silver will sell for more than a bent one if the two coins are in the same sharpness grade. A bent coin is an eyesore to many collectors, and it becomes an even bigger problem when a less than honest dealer uses artifice to hide that problem. And I can tell as a long time collectors that some dealer will do just that if given the chance.

 

[World Colonial]

On the Spanish silver that I mentioned, I cannot say whether all of them are struck on wavy planchets or not. I have not handled enough of them to know, there are no reference books for my coins and though I have seen many other images, its hard to tell. But if I ever do see enough in hand and they are all like that and then I came across one that was not, I might question its authenticity.

[gbsten]

Back to the '22 Lincoln...

 

Isn't it odd that the bend, which IF in the area of the "one", would correspond to the mint-mark area? Aren't these cents notorious for removed mint-marks? Even with the bend and the cleaning it would be nice to certify as "genuine".

[BillJones]

Going by the photos, the diagnostics look right to me for a 1922 Plain. (“L” of “LIBERTY” is hard against the rim, the whole “LIBERTY” looks right). But the coin might seem different in person.

[RockMyAmadeus]

Back to the '22 Lincoln...

 

Isn't it odd that the bend, which IF in the area of the "one", would correspond to the mint-mark area? Aren't these cents notorious for removed mint-marks? Even with the bend and the cleaning it would be nice to certify as "genuine".

 

The bend is nowhere near the mint mark area. If you look at Lincoln's jacket, you'll see where it is. The "O" in "ONE" corresponds with Lincoln's shoulder.

 

The mint mark area corresponds with field to the right of the "E" on the reverse.

 

The coin has not been cleaned, and it's genuine. All diagnostics are fulfilled.