Does NGC have a VAM attribution guarantee?

[moosesr]

I may have to put this question on the Ask NGC forum, but does anyone know for sure if NGC has a VAM attribution guarantee? I have heard they don't have one.

 

The reason I ask is on one of my recent submissions NGC rejected a 1889-O as an oval o that was previously in a PCI AU oval o attributed holder. I already have a lower grade 1889-O oval o attributed by NGC that has the exact same shape mintmark. The o mintmark has a narrow slit type center but not a oval shape on the outside. If NGC has a attribution guarantee I would like to send this coin back to them for another look to make sure they got the attribution correct.

 

Has anyone had any experience with sending back a incorrectly attributed VAM to NGC or could this actually be considered an oval o because of the shape of the opening?

 

Here is a picture of the mintmark in question.

 

Thanks,

Charlie

 

 

[RI AL]

Well, I'll, tell ya, This was interesting. The oval O is a VAM variety but has a BREEN number of 5606. So I checked out Breen 5606 and he refers to the oval O variety as VAM 2.

 

Breen 5606, "Oval O slit openings, VAM 2, Forms a minority of survivors.

Breen 5607 Round O, Wide Opening, at leats 13 minor varieties, with repunching on ON DATE or O

 

Now, looking at your photo, it certainly appears to be the slit opening, but in my humble opinion, the shape of the O is too round to be the OVAL O variety. Could it be a round O with repunching to cause the slit effect but really being the round O? I will leave that to those far more knowledgable than I, but I am attaching pictures from the VAM book, P.91, The Top 100 Morgan Dollar Varieties: The VAM Keys by Michael S. Fey PH.D and Jeff Oxman.

 

But...on further investigation and comparing the 2 VAM book photos again to your coin, there is a "ribbon point" just above the oval O but I don't see the ribbon point on the round O. Your coin shows the same ribbon point. Maybe the round O point is pointing slightly more upwards and missed the photo).

 

You Morgan guys out there...can you give me a hand here...I've stepped in it up to my whozits and sure could use a help out.

 

To answer the question about NGC offering guaranties for their attributions, I just checked out that part of their site and I saw no mention of it, only that they offer the attribution service.

[RareSov]

Looks like the oval to me. And quite clearly, by the size of the inside of the o

 

I would send an email to service AT ngccoin.com or give them a phone call, for a quicker answer

[MAULEMALL]

You have to pay for a VAM attribution.. If it wasn't checked on the submission sheet they will not VAM it.. If you want it attributed then you have to submit it for attribution....

 

 

If you bought it like it is then it needs to be resubmitted. NGC only attributes top 100 and hot 50..... I am not sure about hit list 40 though ...

[moosesr]

It was checked on the submission sheet and they put a note on the coin stating it was not an oval o VAM. But, I already have a lower grade 1889-O oval o attributed by NGC that has the exact same shape mintmark and that is why I asked the question about a guarantee. If the coin shown in the photo above is not an Oval o, then the one I already have in a NGC holder is also not an Oval o.

[RI AL]

I know nothing about this stuff...only what I can look up, but it would seem to me that the direction that the left ribbon point just above the O is facing might be of some use here in determining round or oval O. ?

 

RI AL

[Conder101]

From their Guarantee page of the website

 

All U.S and World coins - including but not limited to Pattern coins, Varieties, Tokens and Medals, Mint Errors, American Colonials, Confederation coinage and Private and Territorial Gold - are guaranteed for grade and authenticity only.

 

If you have a coin slabbed as a given variety and it turns out they were wrong, and you sent it back to them they probably would compensate you just like for years they stood behind their product if the coin turned out to be fake even thogh they did not specificly guarantee authenticity. But the wording of the guarantee does give them a loophole to deny responsibility it they were to choose to do so.

[moosesr]

But...on further investigation and comparing the 2 VAM book photos again to your coin, there is a "ribbon point" just above the oval O but I don't see the ribbon point on the round O. Your coin shows the same ribbon point. Maybe the round O point is pointing slightly more upwards and missed the photo).

 

I had not noticed that before, that's good to know.

 

Thanks!