1817 15 star cent, 1828 12 star half cent.

[RI AL]

Good afternoon guys.

 

Just kind of brousing through the new 2009 redbook that arrived yesterday and stumbled on the 1817 15 star cent and the 1828 12 star half cent. Just curious, are these just goofs on the part of the mint? I MAYBE could see how 12 stars might get by, but the 15 star error (is it an error?) is a bit of a stretch. Does anyone know the story about these 2 coins?

 

RI AL

 

 

I don't have the 1817 cent...yet...

 

[jesbroken]

RI AL, Welcome back, hope they got your meds straight. I had this coin, last year, but was offered so much I let it go. Never had the 1817-15 star and probably will not either(at least in any upper tier condition). Beautiful coin regardless of the holder. (thumbs u

Jim

[RI AL]

Yea...the holder is a bit of an embarrassment, but the coin is not too bad.

 

Thanks for the note.

 

RI AL

[Toad]

There were 15 States at the time and someone got the bright idea of putting 15 stars on the coins. I guess someone realized they'd run out of space eventually and decided to revert to the original 13 stars to signify the original 13 States.

 

As to the 12 Stars, it was a goof. I think the criteria for working at the mint was you had to spend half your paycheck at a bar owned by the Mint Director's brother in-law, so he would appease his wife because when she was happy, he was happy and if he was happy, the workers would have it easier. Or maybe it was something else?

 

Ribbit

[okbustchaser]

There were 15 States at the time and someone got the bright idea of putting 15 stars on the coins. I guess someone realized they'd run out of space eventually and decided to revert to the original 13 stars to signify the original 13 States.

 

As to the 12 Stars, it was a goof. I think the criteria for working at the mint was you had to spend half your paycheck at a bar owned by the Mint Director's brother in-law, so he would appease his wife because when she was happy, he was happy and if he was happy, the workers would have it easier. Or maybe it was something else?

 

Ribbit

 

Actually, there were 19 (and late in the year with the addition of Mississippi, 20) states in 1817. The mint discontinued adding a star per state in 1796 with a 16th star for the state of Tennessee. The 15 star cent as well as the 12 star half cent were both engraving errors.

[MikeKing]

was the intent to have 16 stars then, and 15 placed accidentally?

[BillJones]

was the intent to have 16 stars then, and 15 placed accidentally?

 

I don't know what was going on in the engraver's mind in 1817. Like a previous post stated there were, what, 19 states at the time the coin was issued. I understand that there was a lot drinking in the old days. Perhaps that explains the 1817, 15 star cent.

 

I think the neatest of all the early 16 star coins was the 1797 dime. If you look at the stars on that coin with a strong glass, you will see little scratch marks where the engraver laid out the star placement before he punched them in. Some people claim that the stars were double punched, but that clearly is not the case IMO. It was the die maker trying to avoid running out of room or leaving the stars misplaced.

[Toad]

I think it's stuff like this that makes collecting the older coinage more interesting. It isn't just a piece of metal, there's a story behind so many of them and the story changes so often. (thumbs u

 

The newer coinage, in my opinion, isn't as interesting, although some of the more recent coinage is starting to be like the old coinage, which maybe due to an increase in drinking at the Mint recently? Maybe the Mint Director's wife hasn't been appeased properly, what with all the new regulations against that now?

 

Ribbit

[RI AL]

Interesting replies. I knew that in 1797 there were 16 states because I have a 10x6 dollar. I don't know how many states, if any were added between 1797 and 1817 but someone else suggested 19 in total? That would crowd the obverse just a bit if 19 stars were required, to be sure.

 

So it appears as if both coins are errors. Very interesting. Like you said, Toad, they aren't just hunks of metal, they are pieces of history (to paraphrase). Anyway, I wonder if the mint employees bar and watering hole had a happy hour....at 10 AM??

 

I was casually hunting on E-Bay for the 1817 15 star...thinking I could pick one up reasonably 9for my budget)...MAN...have prices gone WAY up or WHAT!

 

RI AL

[okbustchaser]

PET PEEVE ALERT!!!!!

 

So it appears as if both coins are errors.

 

Actually neither of these coins are errors. They are exact replications of what should occur when using these obverse dies. They are varieties. One can even state that the working dies were errors. The coins themselves, howver, aren't.

 

 

[BillJones]

You can slice the hairs if you like, but the 1828 12 star half cent was a blundered die. How about that?