This PCGS thing IRKS me!

[Tradedollarnut]

Truthfully, the mantra espoused ATS is usually "buy the coin, not the holder", and many threads discuss NGC in a positive light, and PCGS in a negative light (constructively, not in a "bashing" way that gets one banned).

 

Actually, I think the mantra is "buy the coin, not the holder, but the nicest and best coins are always in PCGS holders so those are the only ones you should look at". There is very little unbiased chatter over there. It is not only very pro-PCGS, but also anti-NGC/ICG/ANACS. Pro-PCGS is fine if that's what you like, but anti-NGC/ICG/ANACS is just being a clueless Kool Aid drinker.

 

I agree Greg. I've seen coins in both holders and respect both slabs. I don't think that one is over the other.

 

I do - the PCGS slab is vastly superior in optical quality to the NGC slab. Especially when compared to ones formed from that micro etched clear plastic that they used for a few years.

[bsshog40]

I guess beauty is in the eye of the beholder. I actually like the white inserts in the NGC slab better. I think it sets the coin out better.

[stinkycheese1]

Personally I've always liked PCGS slabs over NGC slabs. I love the saint gaudens design on the back in the hologram,and I noticed when I cracked out my saint in the PCGS holder to the NGC holder the coin seemed to look much better in the PCGS slab.

 

 

[Houston Investor]

I don't take that stuff seriously. I go for the coin.

[chinook]

Based on what I've read, PCGS is the household 'royalty' if you will when it comes to grading, and then NGC.

 

What do you expect on the PCGS forum?

 

Rather than gripe about something so trivial why not invite the poster, DoubleGoldEagles1, to the NGC boards?

 

 

What do you expect on the NGC forum? Someone griping about something ATS. Dont concern yourself with others' ideology. Instead focus on why you collect what you do. It is good mental health.

[cpm9ball]

Personally I've always liked PCGS slabs over NGC slabs. I love the saint gaudens design on the back in the hologram,and I noticed when I cracked out my saint in the PCGS holder to the NGC holder the coin seemed to look much better in the PCGS slab.

 

 

Stinky, the only thing I don't understand is why would you put the 1908 slab on top of four hot dogs to photograph it?

 

Chris

[Just Bob]

[physics-fan3.14]

Personally I've always liked PCGS slabs over NGC slabs. I love the saint gaudens design on the back in the hologram,and I noticed when I cracked out my saint in the PCGS holder to the NGC holder the coin seemed to look much better in the PCGS slab.

 

 

Stinky, the only thing I don't understand is why would you put the 1908 slab on top of four hot dogs to photograph it?

 

Chris

 

It tastes better that way, seems obvious to me.

[stinkycheese1]

Personally I've always liked PCGS slabs over NGC slabs. I love the saint gaudens design on the back in the hologram,and I noticed when I cracked out my saint in the PCGS holder to the NGC holder the coin seemed to look much better in the PCGS slab.

 

 

Stinky, the only thing I don't understand is why would you put the 1908 slab on top of four hot dogs to photograph it?

 

Chris

 

It tastes better that way, seems obvious to me.

 

 

That's the funniest thing I've heard for awhile!

Those are my fingers....although now that you mention it, they do look like hotdogs, or hotdog buns!

[ldhair]

I get a bit upset with folks on both boards that go out of the way to bash the other.

 

What makes it tough is that some bash the members, some bash the actual plastic and others have problem with the company behind the plastic.

 

I like both boards and the plastic the companies behind them put out.

Because of my poor imaging skills I will admit, I hate those white rings.

 

 

[BULLY]

My opinion about the white NGC holders "setting the coins off" better varies from the previous post.

 

Actually, it really depends on the coin.

 

For a larger coin, the white holder from NGC does just fine. Where I think NGC can go awry is with smaller coins, and the white holder tends to almost help the coin get lost. For example, a $10 Platinum American Eagle, or a $5 Gold American Eagle, both 1/10th oz. coins, the smaller in the 4 coin sets.

 

The white slabs are also thick, and the aforementioned coins almost seem to get lost in the DEPTH of the white display.

 

Larger coins, however, do seem to pop.

 

NGC does have a bit of a double-standard for their holders though. Look at the 5-coin multi-holder for instance, for example, one with 5 state quarters. While it has a white background, the coin slot is HUGE compared to what the quarter actually needs, thus providing the quarter with a CLEAR background for almost half an inch around it, and THEN the white background. They don't do that for individual state quarter holders.

 

[MikeKing]

hey there, whatever, WHATEVER it is, it's boring the mess out of me.

I took a gander over there, honestly, what the ???!!!

Am I gross with my foul language?

I couldn't find any better words, I'm sorry.

 

No I'm not.

 

 

[Connecticoin]

Truthfully, the mantra espoused ATS is usually "buy the coin, not the holder", and many threads discuss NGC in a positive light, and PCGS in a negative light (constructively, not in a "bashing" way that gets one banned).

 

Actually, I think the mantra is "buy the coin, not the holder, but the nicest and best coins are always in PCGS holders so those are the only ones you should look at". There is very little unbiased chatter over there. It is not only very pro-PCGS, but also anti-NGC/ICG/ANACS. Pro-PCGS is fine if that's what you like, but anti-NGC/ICG/ANACS is just being a clueless Kool Aid drinker.

 

Well from my point of view, this seems exaggerated. Given your past experience with PCGS, I am not surprised this is your point of view.

[Frank Provasek]

Particularly tiresome are posters who call NGC a fraud because of the higher number of moderns that NGC grades 70. If you mention the fact that many or most moderns probably DO grade 70, that NO 70 is "perfect in every way" or the possibilty that PCGS rations 70s to manipulate the supply and price, you will be gang attacked..called a crook, unethical, your website inventory will be searched for the ugliest coin possible, which will be linked to as a representative example of the "junk" you sell, etc.

 

While it's an unpardonable sin to mention, say how the war affects gold prices, (You Traitor, or more often, "traiter" ) any criticism of HRH, AT coins in PCGS slabs, or support of CAC or Laura, is dealt with swiftly and harshly.

[BULLY]

Particularly tiresome are posters who call NGC a fraud because of the higher number of moderns that NGC grades 70. If you mention the fact that many or most moderns probably DO grade 70, that NO 70 is "perfect in every way" or the possibilty that PCGS rations 70s to manipulate the supply and price, you will be gang attacked..called a crook, unethical, your website inventory will be searched for the ugliest coin possible, which will be linked to as a representative example of the "junk" you sell, etc.

 

While it's an unpardonable sin to mention, say how the war affects gold prices, (You Traitor, or more often, "traiter" ) any criticism of HRH, AT coins in PCGS slabs, or support of CAC or Laura, is dealt with swiftly and harshly.

 

I have to agree with Frank AND disagree with Frank.

 

I couldn't agree more that NGC is a top-tier service and anything BUT a fraud. NGC is definitely not "handing out" 70 graded coins. NGC has returned 70 graded coins from PCGS because they would NOT cross, though I recognize that this is anecdotal. I do wonder if there are statistics available on this.

 

However, what is not anecdotal is that NGC is the official grading service of the ANA (American Numismatic Association) and the Professional Numismatists Guild (PNG). The ANA endorsement was only recently renewed after careful review by the ANA, so that should stand for something, and does in the eyes of this collector, and for many in the hobby and the profession.

 

In fact, some will argue that other services, such as ICG or ANACS are more prone to handing out 70s, not being "top-tier" as they are. If you have ever tried to cross their coins, you may find that a 70 from ICG or ANACS does not a 70 from NGC make! This is NOT anecdotal, it is commonplace. I don't know if NGC keeps statistics on it, but the numbers I've seen fail to cross, or cross several (even 5 grades or more) lower is significant.

 

Other grading services (and I use the term loosely) are even LESS reliable. So much so that when eBay worked with the ANA to establish a policy for the selling of CERTIFIED COINS, it established a policy which allows coins from ONLY the following services to be listed as "certified" - others can be described and shown, but can't be called "Certified as PF69 Ultra Cameo" for instance.

 

(In no particular order)

 

1. NGC

2. PCGS

3. ICG

4. ANACS

5. NCS

 

Where I respectfully disagree is that I don't suspect the possibility that PCGS is "rationing" 70s to manipulate price. While I am a conspiracy theorist on MANY things, this isn't one of them, at least not from PCGS, which, like NGC, I consider to be a "top-tier" company, even if it's not the official grading service of the ANA and PNG.

 

[Frank Provasek]

 

Other grading services (and I use the term loosely) are even LESS reliable. So much so that when eBay worked with the ANA to establish a policy for the selling of CERTIFIED COINS, it established a policy which allows coins from ONLY the following services to be listed as "certified" - others can be described and shown, but can't be called "Certified as PF69 Ultra Cameo" for instance.

 

(In no particular order)

 

1. NGC

2. PCGS

3. ICG

4. ANACS

5. NCS

 

Where I respectfully disagree is that I don't suspect the possibility that PCGS is "rationing" 70s to manipulate price. While I am a conspiracy theorist on MANY things, this isn't one of them, at least not from PCGS, which, like NGC, I consider to be a "top-tier" company, even if it's not the official grading service of the ANA and PNG.

 

 

Of course, PCGS "rations" 70s by being more strict, often to the point of "how perfect is perfect" I have seen many PCGS 70s and PCGS 69s which I cannot tell apart, but with NGC I do see a difference in their 70s and 69s.

[Conder101]

However, what is not anecdotal is that NGC is the official grading service of the ANA (American Numismatic Association) and the Professional Numismatists Guild (PNG). The ANA endorsement was only recently renewed after careful review by the ANA, so that should stand for something, and does in the eyes of this collector, and for many in the hobby and the profession.

Actually it stands for very little because it is a purchased endorsement. The company that gives the ANA the best package deal in cash, advertising commitments and sometimes free gradings is given the endorsement. of being the "Official grading service". Same goes for the PNG endorsement.

[BULLY]

However, what is not anecdotal is that NGC is the official grading service of the ANA (American Numismatic Association) and the Professional Numismatists Guild (PNG). The ANA endorsement was only recently renewed after careful review by the ANA, so that should stand for something, and does in the eyes of this collector, and for many in the hobby and the profession.

Actually it stands for very little because it is a purchased endorsement. The company that gives the ANA the best package deal in cash, advertising commitments and sometimes free gradings is given the endorsement. of being the "Official grading service". Same goes for the PNG endorsement.

 

 

While I think it true that along with being the official grading service comes with it certain responsibilities, such as advertising, no-membership-required grading submissions for ANA members, etc., this would have been true with NGC, PCGS, or whatever service won the designation. In fact, the ANA discloses the terms of this in its announcement public announcement.

 

However, in its announcement, the ANA indicated that its selection recognizes NGC, (part of Certified Collectibles Group, CCG) for the following:

 

"CCG is an industry leader in third-party grading and certification of collectibles. All five CCG member companies have a reputation for integrity and impartiality, and are firmly rooted in supporting educational initiatives. CCG and the ANA have had a longstanding relationship that has been beneficial in promoting and supporting the best interests of the hobby."

 

The final decision was not made before a temporary extension to NGCs contract was made in March-May 2007. According to the ANA, the additional time allowed for additional request for proposals (RFPs), review of proposals, and determining which company or companies would be selected as an official ANA grading service. The release indicates that the ANA did not want to rush the process, and solicited feedback from members about grading service agreements and expectations.

 

http://www.money.org/AM/Template.cfm?Section=Search&section=February12&template=/CM/ContentDisplay.cfm&ContentFileID=2153

 

Terms of the deal are disclosed when NGC is selected:

 

http://www.money.org/AM/Template.cfm?Section=Search&section=June13&template=/CM/ContentDisplay.cfm&ContentFileID=2505

 

Personally, I like the open nature of the ANA process, it maintains the appearance of propriety.

 

 

[Connecticoin]

I There were a couple of posters from ATS that came over and called it childish to watch how long they would last and reminded us that we are “guests in the forums.”

 

 

Yeah, there maybe be one or two Kool-Aid drinkers who pop-in and act as self-appointed moderators, but I think you will see that more than 90% of the others do not share that view.

[WinstonWare]

I There were a couple of posters from ATS that came over and called it childish to watch how long they would last and reminded us that we are “guests in the forums.”

 

 

Yeah, there maybe be one or two Kool-Aid drinkers who pop-in and act as self-appointed moderators, but I think you will see that more than 90% of the others do not share that view.

 

Yes I agree