CaptHenway

Joined a long time ago, but have not been active.

It is an arcade token. Buy a handfull of them and go play video games.

On 9/15/2019 at 1:27 AM, Conder101 said:

Specific gravity or test it with a XRF gun..  Color is not definitive, weight is the same for both types, ring test is not definitive either in my opinion.

Bob, if you have a error 1946 nickel on a silver war nickel planchet, does it magically grow a large mintmark on the back?

The specific gravity of a regular copper-nickel coin will be approx. 8.92. The s.g. of a wartime alloy coin will be approx. 9.32. Properly done, s.g. is accurate to roughly 0.1, so that should work.

Personally, I do not think that the color indicates wartime alloy.

TD

On 9/16/2019 at 8:36 PM, jgenn said:

So when did this extend to dollars? My understanding, from a quote by John L Riddle, melter and refiner at the New Orleans mint, in his "Monograph of the Silver Dollar, Good and Bad", 1845, was that "The policy of our government has been to issue a great preponderance of halves, and the smaller denominations of coins, under the impression that they would be less likely to be exported from the country."

That makes sense, but logic is not always so. 

What did I miss?

CaptHenway

Replica. No value.

Your coin is a crudely cast replica that is made to be sold as souvenirs to tourists at the gift shops at many historic sites. These replicas are very common and have been extensively produced.

This

Very Nice!

I'll tee it up: #199

As I have stated earlier, the use of a genuine legal tender host coin does not automatically make something made from it automatically legal.

The example I cited was a counterfeit 1909-SVDB cent we saw at ANACS which was struck over a genuine 1960-D Lincoln cent. That coin was made with intent to deceive and defraud, and is a counterfeit by any tortured interpretation of the law.

Mr. Carr's overstrikes are NOT made with intent to deceive or defraud. However, the fact that they are struck over genuine, legal tender U.S. coins does not make them exempt from the provisions of the Hobby Protection Act, just as the 1909-SVDB cent cited above is not exempt from the anti-counterfeiting laws.

I'll take 100 on this bobsled ride to hell

 

mark

Hell, Michigan?

Saw this on Facebook, from Coin World, about the 1922-D halves:

http://www.coinworld.com/news/us-coins/2016/08/1922-d-half-dollar-struck-at-private-mint.1.html

This illustrates a valuable point. The average person looking up a non-existent date in a standard reference work will NOT, upon seeing the date not listed, assume "Oh, it must be a fantasy coin created by a private minter" and shrug it off. He or she WILL assume that it is a fabulously rare coin that must be worth a lot of money. This is why such pieces are supposed to be marked in accordance with the Hobby Protection Act of 1973.

 

TD

 

Yet every time you or I (or any other poster) brings up that point, we are written off as stupid, naïve, and "grasping at straws." Maybe this will cause people to wake up. The HPA and counterfeiting statutes are not written for informed collectors and numismatists, but the "average" American - think lowest common denominator.

It is hard to fight greed with logic.

TD

Not to beat on a dead horse too long, but the linked CoinWorld article points out the real problem with these fantasy coins:

 

https://www.coinworld.com/news/us-coins/2016/08/1922-d-half-dollar-struck-at-private-mint.html

 

To quote from the article:

 

"Unfortunately, every now and then one of these overstrikes ends up in the possession of someone who is not familiar with them. The phone call I received concerning the 1922-D Walking Liberty half dollar began with the following message: “I may have a really rare coin — it is not listed in any of the price guides.” It did not take too long for me to identify the piece as a Dan Carr overstrike, although the disappointed caller probably contacted a few more people before accepting what I told him."

 

Simply, the noninformed person running across these can be swindled. Most of the world has no idea these 'fantasy' pieces exist. Those that don't call and are influenced by someone with apparent 'expertise' that has unsavory intentions can be convinced that these are a real and a rare US mint product. Since these pieces don't have the word 'Copy' or 'Fantasy' or something on them, these people can be had by the unscrupulous. It is just a matter of time until we hear about some senior citizen that was convinced to pay alot of money for one or more of these only to find out later they were had. Hence for consumer protection reasons, I am not sure why the feds haven't stepped in on this - I guess they have bigger fish to fry but it is only a matter of time probably.

 

Best, HT

 

This illustrates a valuable point. The average person looking up a non-existent date in a standard reference work will NOT, upon seeing the date not listed, assume "Oh, it must be a fantasy coin created by a private minter" and shrug it off. He or she WILL assume that it is a fabulously rare coin that must be worth a lot of money. This is why such pieces are supposed to be marked in accordance with the Hobby Protection Act of 1973.

TD

Ok I'm sure this won't end well but I am curious. ATS a thread was started asking if anybody had a Dcarr peace dollar slabbed by PCGS. It sounds like they will now grade these. My question is will NGC also slab these currently or in the near future? Does anyone on these boards have one in PCGS plastic?

 

Nick

 

Here's the link ATS for those interested.

 

https://forums.collectors.com/messageview.aspx?catid=26&threadid=966937&enterthread=y

I would assume that the post mint damage would disqualify them from slabbing.

I'm glad the auction is ending on Feb 14th. Easy to remember!

I know! It's my wife's dog's birthday!

Thanks for the links!

Is there a link to the Great COllections sale yet?

I wonder if an Uncirculated piece will ever be found?

My guess is that they are "magician's/smuggler's" coins, hollowed out with a smaller coin inside. I've received at least one of them in change. These will have a very narrow tell-tale seam just inside the rim on one side. Another tell-tale sign is that these sometimes have an apparent rotated die reverse due to the alignment being off when the two shells are assembled.

Well, he said that they ring normally.

Could just be rolled-thin errors, though those have always been a hard sell as they look so normal.

Conder, could you please send me that in PDF? I have Ed Fleischmann's copy of the original book, but I can never find it when I need it.

FWIW, Fleischmann compiled that information in loose-leaf form from U.S. Mint reports and personal observations taken while working at Collector's Clearinghouse and (later) ANACS. At one point he copied the information over fresh and sold his original notes to error dealers Steiner and Zimpher. They published it in book form without asking Ed's permission, which he then gave after the fact.

My copy has a few marginal notes which might be of interest should anybody ever publish a new edition of this.

TD

How accurate is your scale? Might I suggest that you take a coin of a known weight, such as a silver eagle, and weigh that to see how close it gets?

As in "Plonk your magic twanger, Froggy!"?

Rick Snow reported ATS seeing a raw XF at the Baltimore show. Will eventually go in for slabbing.

ttt