VAM help?

[cmorg-migration]

A person was harassing me this evening through ebay messages because I had “VAM” in the titles of two of my listings of GSA Morgans without knowing exactly what the VAMs are. I don’t know if he or she is bored or just mean, but the person wrote to me that I should send my NGC graded coins to ANACS if I don’t know the exact VAM and threatened to report both coins for having “false details.” I removed “VAM” from both titles in order to get the person to leave me alone. Ironically, he or she has only one coin listed among some toys and other collectibles and its title and description don’t match the grade on the ANACS slab pictured.

 

The coins I have listed both have doubled dates and I know they are varieties. The 87-P has some characteristics of the VAM 4 and the 80-S appears similar to the VAM 105, but I don’t think either is an exact match. To all the VAM folks, I apologize for not having joined the group yet. I get excited every time I see a die crack or a broken letter on a coin, but I’m spread so thin that I can’t imagine joining anything else right now.

 

I realize it’s a lot to ask, but if anyone with knowledge in this area can check the listings and let me know if I’ve done anything wrong, I’ll be very appreciative. Here are links to them:

 

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1887-P-GSA-Morgan-Silver-Dollar-NGC-MS63-Doubled-Date-18-7-Non-CC-Hard-Case-/171538235910?ssPageName=STRK:MESE:IT

 

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1880-S-GSA-Morgan-Dollar-NGC-MS64-Doubled-Profile-Date-Tripled-Cap-Non-CC-/171538223284?ssPageName=STRK:MESE:IT

 

[RWB]

If you use the abbreviation "VAM" you should be able to tell potential buyers which variety it is. If you can't determine the variety after going through the VAMworld site lists, then describe what you think are the interesting features of the coin.

 

Please understand that mechanical doubling is common on Morgan and Peace dollars, and imparts only curiosity value.

[messydesk]

Look at 1887 VAM 11 on VAMWorld, and if you think it's a match, put it in the title and report the bidder for harassing you. Not sure what the 80-S is. It looks like there's doubling on the surface of the first 8 that will be helpful, but there are several different VAMs that show that. Check the mint mark, too, as that can make it easier to narrow things down.

 

The bidder that's harassing you may be full of cräp, but asserting "VAM" without a number is meaningless, and saying something like "1887 Dollar with VAM" is gibberish that makes you look ill-informed. All Morgan and Peace dollars are some VAM number, as that refers to a die marriage, not a feature. Most VAMs are not interesting or valuable, even if rare (the whole supply and demand thing), but some are. Unfortunately, neither of yours look like varieties that would garner any premium.

[asdfgh]

I agree that anyone should not be hassling you. If they just wanted to let you know and then leave it be, i think that would be ok. The problem is that quite a few people list the exact VAM they think it is and it is not. I personally do not buy VAM's that are not noted by NGC,PCGS,ANACS or stickered by VSS.

I can not determine enough features using pictures and not having the coin in hand.

[cmorg-migration]

Thank you all for your kind responses. I am ill-informed about VAMs and admittedly so. More often than not I cannot determine with certainty a coin’s VAM, even with a good loupe and light, and I won’t list a number without being 100% certain that it’s correct. Two large mistakes that I see I’ve made from your responses are in equating VAM with the word “variety” and in not understanding mechanical doubling.

 

I bought all the books I could find online earlier this year including the Encyclopedia of Morgan and Peace Dollars 4th Edition, Top 100, Hot 50, Hitlist 40, 8TF, 8/7 TF, Hot 50 Peace as well as books for other denominations. I’ve also spent a good number of dollars with grading services trying to determine VAMs, usually without results. This is something I could easily obsess over if I had the time. That’s something that we’re actually trying to determine right now, whether I’m going to give up some other interests to devote more time to coins and make this more than a hobby or simply continue paring down the collection.

 

VAM 11 for the 87-P was the other variety I considered but I couldn’t locate a die chip between the loops of the 8 and have just read the end of the sentence, “in some specimens,” so that’s probably what it is because the date doubling is unmistakable. I blocked the bidder because I’d rather not sell something than deal with someone who threatens me and whose actions seem unethical. Even though I told the person about the mistake in his or her own listing, no change has occurred in it. He or she sent another message this morning stating, “I buy a lot of Vams from the experts on Vam World for your info” and that s/he’d love to buy at least one if I get it verified. This is the type of thing that keeps me in the paring down mode even though I do enjoy coins immensely.

 

The 80-S was the really interesting one to me and I spent several hours Monday evening looking at it through the loupe. My family has come to accept this about me and now goes on with other activities without me when I’m coining. The doubling on top of the first 8 is most easy to see. The mint mark is more difficult but appears to have the same type of doubling at the bottom of the S. The most exciting parts to me are the heavy lines at the top of the cap and on the cotton bolls. I don’t know what variety it is and do understand what you say about it not garnering a premium. Thank you for that. I think I’ll leave the listing for the 87 non-specific and will begin again with the 80-S, eliminating the details of most of what I see since I don’t understand mechanical doubling. Ebay problems are things I try very diligently to avoid. And I’ll leave the letters VAM out completely in the future unless I’m absolutely certain about an associated number. Thanks again. You all have been very helpful.