Looks like that toned 23-S MS65 Peace $ is up for auction again...

[TonerGuy]

Here's the first toned Peace to break the $10,000 mark...

 

http://www.legendmorphyauctions.com/search/details/c/Classic_U.S._Coins/g/Silver_Dollars?id=100643&lotId=1031

 

And now its back up for auction at Heritage...

 

http://coins.ha.com/c/item.zx?saleNo=1201&lotIdNo=146001

 

So does it break it's earlier records and go higher or does it come back down and sell in a range more commensurate with its grade ?

[brg5658]

I don't get what people see in that coin. I wouldn't pay even one tenth of it's Legend sale price.

[MarkFeld]

I don't get what people see in that coin. I wouldn't pay even one tenth of it's Legend sale price.

 

I do. I viewed the coin prior to its last sale and It's one of the most beautifully toned Peace Dollars I have seen.

[Kurtdog]

Wow. What a kid could do with a chemistry set.

[brg5658]

I don't get what people see in that coin. I wouldn't pay even one tenth of it's Legend sale price.

 

I do. I viewed the coin prior to its last sale and It's one of the most beautifully toned Peace Dollars I have seen.

 

Well, I guess it's just personal preference then...that or the images are absolutely horrendous. Based on the Legend and HA images, and using my imagination, I don't see a $10K coin. Not even close.

[L1ncolnF4n]

I don't get what people see in that coin. I wouldn't pay even one tenth of it's Legend sale price.

 

I do. I viewed the coin prior to its last sale and It's one of the most beautifully toned Peace Dollars I have seen.

 

Well, I guess it's just personal preference then...that or the images are absolutely horrendous. Based on the Legend and HA images, and using my imagination, I don't see a $10K coin. Not even close.

 

You have to remember that a white example of that date/grade is worth $6.5k+ So that's giving a 60% premium for color. Nothing out of the ordinary in terms of that %.

[brg5658]

I don't get what people see in that coin. I wouldn't pay even one tenth of it's Legend sale price.

 

I do. I viewed the coin prior to its last sale and It's one of the most beautifully toned Peace Dollars I have seen.

 

Well, I guess it's just personal preference then...that or the images are absolutely horrendous. Based on the Legend and HA images, and using my imagination, I don't see a $10K coin. Not even close.

 

You have to remember that a white example of that date/grade is worth $6.5k+ So that's giving a 60% premium for color. Nothing out of the ordinary in terms of that %.

 

You have to remember this coin used to be in an MS64 holder (I can't find the old thread)...so it's already been "market graded" up to a 65 probably because of the supposed eye-appeal.

 

People can spend their money however they'd like, but not my cup of tea.

 

Here's the thread from back when we discussed this coin in Feb 2013.

 

 

[brg5658]

I don't get what people see in that coin. I wouldn't pay even one tenth of it's Legend sale price.

 

I do. I viewed the coin prior to its last sale and It's one of the most beautifully toned Peace Dollars I have seen.

 

Well, I guess it's just personal preference then...that or the images are absolutely horrendous. Based on the Legend and HA images, and using my imagination, I don't see a $10K coin. Not even close.

 

You have to remember that a white example of that date/grade is worth $6.5k+ So that's giving a 60% premium for color. Nothing out of the ordinary in terms of that %.

 

PS -- where did you get the $6.5K value? The last few in PCGS holders were from $3600-$4100 as listed in the Legend auction link...

[kryptonitecomics]

Well I hope it sells and the owner pays me back the money he has owed me for a year.....

[MarkFeld]

I don't get what people see in that coin. I wouldn't pay even one tenth of it's Legend sale price.

 

I do. I viewed the coin prior to its last sale and It's one of the most beautifully toned Peace Dollars I have seen.

 

Well, I guess it's just personal preference then...that or the images are absolutely horrendous. Based on the Legend and HA images, and using my imagination, I don't see a $10K coin. Not even close.

 

You have to remember that a white example of that date/grade is worth $6.5k+ So that's giving a 60% premium for color. Nothing out of the ordinary in terms of that %.

 

You have to remember this coin used to be in an MS64 holder (I can't find the old thread)...so it's already been "market graded" up to a 65 probably because of the supposed eye-appeal.

 

People can spend their money however they'd like, but not my cup of tea.

 

Here's the thread from back when we discussed this coin in Feb 2013.

 

 

I remember that discussion and having studied the coin quite carefully at the Legend-Morphy lot viewing. I thought it was absolutely fine as a 65. And that criticisms of the assigned grade were overblown, possibly as a result of knowing the previous grading history.

[TonerGuy]

 

I remember that discussion and having studied the coin quite carefully at the Legend-Morphy lot viewing. I thought it was absolutely fine as a 65. And that criticisms of the assigned grade were overblown, possibly as a result of knowing the previous grading history.

 

So does it have a chance at a + or a 66 ?

[MarkFeld]

 

I remember that discussion and having studied the coin quite carefully at the Legend-Morphy lot viewing. I thought it was absolutely fine as a 65. And that criticisms of the assigned grade were overblown, possibly as a result of knowing the previous grading history.

 

So does it have a chance at a + or a 66 ?

 

Since the coin is coming up for sale again, I prefer not to make any comments about it (whether positive or negative) that I didn't already make, previously.

[brg5658]

 

I remember that discussion and having studied the coin quite carefully at the Legend-Morphy lot viewing. I thought it was absolutely fine as a 65. And that criticisms of the assigned grade were overblown, possibly as a result of knowing the previous grading history.

 

So does it have a chance at a + or a 66 ?

 

Since the coin is coming up for sale again, I prefer not to make any comments about it (whether positive or negative) that I didn't already make, previously.

 

Wise move, since you also work for the company selling it this time around.

[MarkFeld]

 

I remember that discussion and having studied the coin quite carefully at the Legend-Morphy lot viewing. I thought it was absolutely fine as a 65. And that criticisms of the assigned grade were overblown, possibly as a result of knowing the previous grading history.

 

So does it have a chance at a + or a 66 ?

 

Since the coin is coming up for sale again, I prefer not to make any comments about it (whether positive or negative) that I didn't already make, previously.

 

Wise move, since you also work for the company selling it this time around.

Yes, I was trying to be subtle.

[WoodenJefferson]

A spectacular coin should be advertized with spectacular images...course the buyer, if there is one, will probably have already seen the coin in hand so I guess it doesn't matter.

 

Not to degrade the auction house, but going off the images provided does not do this coin any sort of justice.

 

Just something I had to say.

[bochiman]

I don't get what people see in that coin. I wouldn't pay even one tenth of it's Legend sale price.

 

I do. I viewed the coin prior to its last sale and It's one of the most beautifully toned Peace Dollars I have seen.

 

Well, I guess it's just personal preference then...that or the images are absolutely horrendous. Based on the Legend and HA images, and using my imagination, I don't see a $10K coin. Not even close.

 

You have to remember that a white example of that date/grade is worth $6.5k+ So that's giving a 60% premium for color. Nothing out of the ordinary in terms of that %.

 

You have to remember this coin used to be in an MS64 holder (I can't find the old thread)...so it's already been "market graded" up to a 65 probably because of the supposed eye-appeal.

 

People can spend their money however they'd like, but not my cup of tea.

 

 

 

So it was graded 64 before and 65 now. Why are you the one to say it was upgraded for the toning giving it eye appeal? Maybe when it was originally graded, the graders felt 64, but later, they actually felt it was 65...for the technical grade?

 

Too many assumptions, particularly when bashing on a coin/price that one is not even interested in.

 

There is no way in HE&& that I would pay that kind of money for that coin, but I also don't bother to come on here and bash on it and criticize the grade since I have not seen it in person.

[TonerGuy]

Anyone want to take a stab at setting the over/under ?

[RWB]

Seems like a lot of zeros on the wrong side of the decimal point to me.

[orifdoc]

The funny thing is that if toned Peace Dollars were as common as toned Morgans, nobody would think a thing of paying a toning premium of 100%. As has been said, a blast-white PCGS MS65 CAC coin would easily sell for $5-6k.

[RWB]

All toning is ephemeral -- it will change with time.

[brg5658]

I don't get what people see in that coin. I wouldn't pay even one tenth of it's Legend sale price.

 

I do. I viewed the coin prior to its last sale and It's one of the most beautifully toned Peace Dollars I have seen.

 

Well, I guess it's just personal preference then...that or the images are absolutely horrendous. Based on the Legend and HA images, and using my imagination, I don't see a $10K coin. Not even close.

 

You have to remember that a white example of that date/grade is worth $6.5k+ So that's giving a 60% premium for color. Nothing out of the ordinary in terms of that %.

 

You have to remember this coin used to be in an MS64 holder (I can't find the old thread)...so it's already been "market graded" up to a 65 probably because of the supposed eye-appeal.

 

People can spend their money however they'd like, but not my cup of tea.

 

 

 

So it was graded 64 before and 65 now. Why are you the one to say it was upgraded for the toning giving it eye appeal? Maybe when it was originally graded, the graders felt 64, but later, they actually felt it was 65...for the technical grade?

 

Too many assumptions, particularly when bashing on a coin/price that one is not even interested in.

 

There is no way in HE&& that I would pay that kind of money for that coin, but I also don't bother to come on here and bash on it and criticize the grade since I have not seen it in person.

 

Man it's a touchy day. Must be something with the stars aligning to make everyone so grumpy. For the record, if you read the old thread from back in February 2013 (which I linked), it wasn't me who suggested such an upgrade. But, the coin was unquestionably traced through CoinFacts images to have gone through the phases of MS64 to MS64+ then to MS65. But, thanks for your ever-so-enlightening two cents -- I always love when someone comes over to the NGC boards from ATS for the sole purpose to belittle and criticize here.

 

For the record, if Mark Feld (who I respect) said that he thought it was an MS65, then so be it -- I trust him and his opinion. Having not seen the coin in person yourself, you sure do also seem be throwing around just as many if not more assumptions than I did. Again, if you read the entire thread, my point was that, unless the coin looks WAY better than both the Legend and HA images make it look, then it's not attractive IN MY OPINION. That's all. I also stated more than once that if someone wants to spend that kind of money on a coin like that, then more power to them. It's a free country.

 

I'm sure if this coin were in an NGC holder, and the same historical "upgrade" information sale prices were known, everyone and their grandma ATS would be throwing a fit. Take a deep breath, drink your kool-aid, and maybe spike it with a bit of vodka so you can settle down. Good grief.

[coinman_23885]

What is bizarre to me is that the coin was purchased in February of this year where it sold for very strong money ($11.5k), so I a bit surprised to see if for sale so soon. I think I know who owns this coin, and the said individual often seeks to flip for a profit. (I won't reveal and will respect the consignor's privacy). With that said, I'm not sure there is much upside for this coin. I like it personally, but I thought $11,500 was too high for this piece and with the buyer's fee effectively being eaten by the consignor, this looks like a losing situation to me.

[bochiman]

I don't get what people see in that coin. I wouldn't pay even one tenth of it's Legend sale price.

 

I do. I viewed the coin prior to its last sale and It's one of the most beautifully toned Peace Dollars I have seen.

 

Well, I guess it's just personal preference then...that or the images are absolutely horrendous. Based on the Legend and HA images, and using my imagination, I don't see a $10K coin. Not even close.

 

You have to remember that a white example of that date/grade is worth $6.5k+ So that's giving a 60% premium for color. Nothing out of the ordinary inš terms of that %.

 

You have to remember this coin used to be in an MS64 holder (I can't find the old thread)...so it's already been "market graded" up to a 65 probably because of the supposed eye-appeal.

 

People can spend their money however they'd like, but not my cup of tea.

 

 

 

So it was graded 64 before and 65 now. Why are you the one to say it was upgraded for the toning giving it eye appeal? Maybe when it was originally graded, the graders felt 64, but later, they actually felt it was 65...for the technical grade?

 

Too many assumptions, particularly when bashing on a coin/price that one is not even interested in.

 

There is no way in HE&& that I would pay that kind of money for that coin, but I also don't bother to come on here and bash on it and criticize the grade since I have not seen it in person.

 

Man it's a touchy day. Must be something with the stars aligning to make everyone so grumpy. For the record, if you read the old thread from back in February 2013 (which I linked), it wasn't me who suggested such an upgrade. But, the coin was unquestionably traced through CoinFacts images to have gone through the phases of MS64 to MS64+ then to MS65. But, thanks for your ever-so-enlightening two cents -- I always love when someone comes over to the NGC boards from ATS for the sole purpose to belittle and criticize here.

 

For the record, if Mark Feld (who I respect) said that he thought it was an MS65, then so be it -- I trust him and his opinion. Having not seen the coin in person yourself, you sure do also seem be throwing around just as many if not more assumptions than I did. Again, if you read the entire thread, my point was that, unless the coin looks WAY better than both the Legend and HA images make it look, then it's not attractive IN MY OPINION. That's all. I also stated more than once that if someone wants to spend that kind of money on a coin like that, then more power to them. It's a free country.

 

I'm sure if this coin were in an NGC holder, and the same historical "upgrade" information sale prices were known, everyone and their grandma ATS would be throwing a fit. Take a deep breath, drink your kool-aid, and maybe spike it with a bit of vodka so you can settle down. Good grief.

 

 

Dude, grow up. I don't play the 'their forum vs our forum' BS that you obviously do. I'd make the same comment, given your post that started it all, regardless.

 

You made the comment in this thread about the upgrade being die to toning.... don't try to cower behind someone else's thread.

 

No, I haven't seen it and I didn't comment on whether kt deserved the grade or not...I commented on YOU stating it was due to the toning.

 

Your jab at me being on the PCGS board, as well as here, is precisely my point in a post here the other day, in response to a post Scott made..... that certain folks over here go out of their to badmouth others from the PCGS boards that come here. Must be great to feel elite and better than others, eh?

Assumptions made about how others would feel based on the plastic and applying those assumptions to everyone not part of your clique.....

[MarkFeld]

I like it better when we talk about coins, rather than other forums and/or forum members. Can/will you guys work with me to turn this into a positive thread? I know that you have the knowledge and wherewith-all.

[Tradedollarnut]

I saw the coin in hand. It's beautiful and a gem

[Jim Beam]

This coin, as are most on auction at the big houses, is way out of my reach. It does look like a very nice coin but very expensive. My question to everyone is: At the high price this coins has brought, do you think very soon we will see many more toned peace dollars coming out of the woodwork?

[brg5658]

If coins like this are so great, why do they get passed around from person (dealer?) to person (dealer?) in multiple auctions over short periods of time like some sort of currency. If it truly is a beautiful gem as Mark and Bruce attest, then I hope it goes into an actual collectors hands for many years.

 

When I buy a coin I think is splendid, I don't put it back up for sale 10 months later. And, yes I've heard the "hardship" excuse before -- but if you are someone who has $11.5K to spend on a coin in the first place, I have a hard time believing that person has fallen on hard times and now needs the money.

 

Good luck to anyone bidding. I'm done with this thread and the insults of our fortnightly visitor from ATS.

[coinman_23885]

If coins like this are so great, why do they get passed around from person (dealer?) to person (dealer?) in multiple auctions over short periods of time like some sort of currency. If it truly is a beautiful gem as Mark and Bruce attest, then I hope it goes into an actual collectors hands for many years.

 

When I buy a coin I think is splendid, I don't put it back up for sale 10 months later. And, yes I've heard the "hardship" excuse before -- but if you are someone who has $11.5K to spend on a coin in the first place, I have a hard time believing that person has fallen on hard times and now needs the money.

 

There are some individuals that will attempt to flip exceptional coins with the hopes of making a huge profit regardless of whether the extra money is "needed" or not. I don't think there is a lot of upside on this particular piece, but it certainly wouldn't be the first time I have been wrong in predicting a price.

[TonerGuy]

My question to everyone is: At the high price this coins has brought, do you think very soon we will see many more toned peace dollars coming out of the woodwork?

 

As someone who has had an interest in toned Peace $ for 15 years I can say that you are already seeing it. It started several years ago.

 

I think this coin going for $11,500 is a result of the run-up on the price of all toned Peace $. 15 years ago when I first started asking for toned Peace from dealers at shows I would simply get laughed at and then the dealer would try to sell me a much prettier toned Morgan.

 

Now when I ask for toned Peace $ many dealers actually have 1-2 in their inventory. Some dealers even have up to 6/7 examples in their cases. And the prices have doubled to tripled over the last several years.

[MarkFeld]

If coins like this are so great, why do they get passed around from person (dealer?) to person (dealer?) in multiple auctions over short periods of time like some sort of currency. If it truly is a beautiful gem as Mark and Bruce attest, then I hope it goes into an actual collectors hands for many years.

 

When I buy a coin I think is splendid, I don't put it back up for sale 10 months later. And, yes I've heard the "hardship" excuse before -- but if you are someone who has $11.5K to spend on a coin in the first place, I have a hard time believing that person has fallen on hard times and now needs the money.

 

Good luck to anyone bidding. I'm done with this thread and the insults of our fortnightly visitor from ATS.

 

I don't think the frequency of appearances is necessarily a fair measure of whether a coin is great, good, poor, etc..