Reproductions into the secondart market

[drwstr123]

I posted ATS but thought some who don't visit might have interest.

This effects on-line purchases of raw coinage.

LINKY

[x2rider]

Having read the post ATS is just goes to show that you can make money from a cheap coin .

 

If they sell that coin for $5 I bet the manufactuire cost was less than 5cents . Thats quite a return

I thoguht the idea put forward by Capt Henway was scary to say the least . A master hub with the date and mint mark punched in later

 

 

[coinman_23885]

I fully agree. Most numismatic reference books that I have read on detecting counterfeits all mention that it is unusual for a coin worth less than $100 to be counterfeited (or those in grades below EF for that matter although the counterfeit in question appears to grade much higher). Apparently, someone is playing on this and the naivety of new collectors.

[Conder101]

I thoguht the idea put forward by Capt Henway was scary to say the least . A master hub with the date and mint mark punched in later

Nothing really surprising about that statement. They have been using that technique for years. That's why when you find a counterfeit it helps to look for a "marker" because you will often find counterfeits of other dates with that same marker. There is a particular marker I look for every time I look at a draped bust dollar. I have seen every date in the series with that same marker but I have never seen it on a genuine piece. I would imagine there is one genuine piece out there with it, the coin they used for their master. In books on detecting counterfeits they will talk about "repeating defects" If you see several coins that have the same contact marks you know you have a counterfeit. If you see coins of different dates that have the same contact marks on the dated side then it is obvious that the counterfeiters are using an undated master hub and then dating the individual dies.

 

Most numismatic reference books that I have read on detecting counterfeits all mention that it is unusual for a coin worth less than $100 to be counterfeited (or those in grades below EF for that matter although the counterfeit in question appears to grade much higher).

These books were written years ago before the widespread Chinese counterfeiting. Cost in the US for creating dies and acquiring the needed equipment were considerably higher and in the US you needed a higher rate of return to make it worthwhile. In China they could do it for a smaller profit margin.. The book Numismatic Forgery mentions the counterfeiting of a wide variety of lower value coins as a way of "staying under the radar" because faking high grade keys will get your products discovered quickly, but better grade commons will get you a good return but are much less likely to be noticed because they are less likely to have to be certified in order to sell them. As Captn Henway said in the other thread "What does a MS-60 1917 cent sell for?" And how many insist on a 60 being slabbed? Cost to make A couple dollars maybe

[BillJones]

I’ve heard that the Chinese counterfeits are now showing up a flea markets and small shows. One dealer at this week's Summer FUN show who also sets up a flea markets told that there has a been a rash of fake silver bars at the flea markets too. The bars are made of silver coated brass or steel.

 

The counterfeiters can mass produce these things at cheap money per unit and make strong percentage profits from $5 to $50 or $60 items. They have further advantage the buyers are not will educated collectors and can be fooled easily.

 

I'm giving a show counterfeit class at my next club meeting. I'm going warn these guys that they should not think that they are immune to this counterfeiting problem because they only buy "cheap coins." If anything they might even be more susceptible.

 

[PerryHall]

Conder made an interesting observation concerning looking for repeating defects on counterfeit coins. Frequently, a counterfeiter will use the same reverse die in combination with numerous different dated obverse dies. An example of this is the Indian $5 gold coin series where one counterfeiter used a single S mintmarked die with numerous dated obverse dies. This reverse die has an added engraved S mintmark that looks more like a worm than the proper S mintmark used for this series.