A Pure Points Play! posted by GSA_Gem_Quest

[CSJournals-migration]

How I added 1,320 points to my Registry Set AND put $710 in my pocket!!

 

There seems to be a lot of active discussion and controversy on Collector's Society Journals lately related to Registry points and how they are not fair, or seemingly random, and don't reflect current market prices or rarity of the coins. I now join the fray.

 

Can you imagine NGC trying to determine the points assigned to each coin in an attempt to fairly represent the worth and rarity of a particular coin in a particular series? It is an impossible job, but a job that I think NGC has performed admirably and responsibly. I commend them for tackling this herculean effort, and for the most part, getting it right.

 

There are those among us, myself included, who study the coin points in relation to rarity in relation to cost to acquire, and seek to gain the most advantage for their Registry Set at the least cost. I have read several journals of collectors that actually track the cost per point for particular coins, and seek to maximize their points, while minimizing their costs. Since the point system is not perfect, one can sometimes actually pay less for a coin that generates more points, depending on market conditions that may not be reflected in point scores, or vice versa.

 

Here is the situation, as it relates to my set (The Newport Ridge Collection-GSA Carson City Morgans):

 

Coin in collection:

 

1885-CC MS 66 - Value: $2,550 - Points: 1,658 ($1.54 per point) - Population: 189 in MS66

 

Coin for possible acquisition:

 

1885-CC MS65* VAM 4 (star graded coin) Value: $1,840 Points: 2,978 ($0.62 per point) - Population: 10 in MS65, and only 2 in MS65*

 

So, based on the above facts, should I "trade down" my MS66 for an MS65? While some might still want to keep the higher graded coin, this was a no-brainer for me. I sold my MS66 for $2,550 and bought the MS65* VAM 4 for $1,840, thereby putting $710 in my wallet, and gaining 1,320 points. Not a bad day's work on the old collection, in my opinion.

 

I think NGC got the points right in this case, based on the rarity of each coin. This rarity, however, has not yet been reflected in market pricing of each coin.

 

See more journals by GSA_Gem_Quest

[MarkW]

I fully agree with the move. NGC has a very tough job in keeping everyone happy in points assigned to coins in various grades and designations in registry set slots. It would be nearly impossible to tabulate the differences in rarity and grade amongst certain dates throughout every series. I, too, look at points per $ in an attempt to rationalize and maximize my upgrades in my sets. While an MS66 is a higher grade, in this case, the MS65* VAM 4 is a rarer coin and therefore should command a higher reward in points. The VAM 4 has a value based upon its "parent coin". That is an 1885CC in MS65*. The VAM 4 is a "Hot 50" VAM. with a Vamview value of $2500.

Also, as an addendum, I, personally, wouldn't question GSA Gem Quest's knowledge of GSA dollars as his knowledge is far above mine regarding rarity and availability.

BTW, in regards to your other post requesting toned GSA's. My GSA set is at 100%, and none are significantly toned.

 

[coinsbygary]

I seems the real wild card in your trade is the fact you are acquiring a VAM-4 in the trade. VAM's have their own rarity scale and market values. This plus the fact you purchased a star grade with increased points maximizes your point totals. I do not understand how NGC assigns points, but I think they have a standard weighted formula that they equitably apply to all coins within a series. I agree that for the most part NGC gets the points right and that they are fair. However, I do not understand how an 1894-O Morgan Dollar can get 366 points in AU-50 and 3 points in XF-45, maybe there should be a more graduated decline in points in circulated grades. Perhaps by a steep drop off in points, NGC is encouraging collectors to purchase finer coins for their collections. It worked in my case and I'm happy with the coin I own. All things aside, I love your 1885-CC MS-65* Morgan Dollar, it surely is worth every point it earned.

Gary

[cpm9ball]

I'm not a participant in the Registry, but I find it interesting how you develop the value/points relationship, and I have some observations for which I would appreciate your comments.

 

I assume that your 1885-CC VAM-4 garnered the star for the crescent toning. Correct?

 

While the 2011 VAMView Price Guide lists this coin at $2500, would the "Star" attribute add a premium to this?

 

Also, I noted that there was a recent sale, 1/02/11, of an NGC MS65 for $965 listed on the VAMWorld page. Of course, it doesn't specify that it was in a GSA holder, but I would think it might be because it was graded by NGC. In any case, what do you think could be the reason for such a disparity in pricing?

 

I'm interested because I have a VAM-4 that I purchased unattributed in a PCGS MS65 back in 2007. I resubmitted it to PCGS in 2008 for the attribution. I'm curious to know what it's value might be since it isn't attributed as a GSA in the PCGS slab.

 

I hope you won't mind, but I've posted photos of it. Don't worry! I have a thick skin, so I would appreciate your honest opinion of the coin. Please ignore the goldenish hue. That is simply an artifact of my lousy photographic skills. In hand, it is satiny white.

 

Thanks!

 

Chris

 

[cpm9ball]

Hello! ??

 

Chris

[GSA_Gem_Quest]

Sorry - I don't check the boards that often.

 

I assume that your 1885-CC VAM-4 garnered the star for the crescent toning. Correct?

 

Yes, the star grade was given for the toning.

 

While the 2011 VAMView Price Guide lists this coin at $2500, would the "Star" attribute add a premium to this?

 

The rule of thumb that I use is the star grade adds 25% to the value of the coin. For a coin with full face toning, the premium would probably be more.

 

Also, I noted that there was a recent sale, 1/02/11, of an NGC MS65 for $965 listed on the VAMWorld page. Of course, it doesn't specify that it was in a GSA holder, but I would think it might be because it was graded by NGC. In any case, what do you think could be the reason for such a disparity in pricing?

 

Just because it is NGC does not necessarily mean it is still in the GSA holder. They will grade it either way. Not sure why there is such a price disparity, but the GSA holder coin will typically sell for a premium.

 

I hope you won't mind, but I've posted photos of it. Don't worry! I have a thick skin, so I would appreciate your honest opinion of the coin. Please ignore the goldenish hue. That is simply an artifact of my lousy photographic skills. In hand, it is satiny white.

 

Your coin is a beauty! I think it is a higher 65 than mine. I would consider mine to be in the lower range of 65, and yours to be in the higher range.