disappointed with first NCS/NGC submission

[BillJones]

Pictures can't tell the whole story, but from what I see, the only coin for which you might have a beef is the 1814 half dollar. That coin kind of has an "orgiinal now" loook to it in that it may have been lightly cleaned long ago and now has so new toning. Why you would want NCS or an of those coins "conserved" (i.e. dipped) is beyond me. There is nothing that conserving could do for them.

 

The Barber coins are really bad, and are naked eye body bag or NCS coins. The gold dollar appears to have been cleaned harshly at least on the obverse. The 1827 half appears to have cleaned and probably given a coat of AT.

 

Sadly I don't think that you have a real complaint here. It is a shame that you used your freebies on these coins, but perhaps it can be a learning experience for you.

 

[ctrl-migration]

Ctrl, Have you called NGC/NCS yet?...Mike

I have now. They gave me NGC credit for the missing coupon, which is appreciated. I still wish they would have conserved the dime, even if it was marked as cleaned I wanted the green removed, and I would have loved to have had the imaging done. But that was their decision as the experts and I certainly don't want to spend any more money on it, so it is what it is now. Thanks to NCS for the credit, though I'm not sure about this hobby anymore.

[MikeInFL]

Thanks for the update, Ctrl.

 

Don't lose heart...this is a cool hobby once you get past some of the potholes (and there are others that are, in my opinion, far more disconcerting than this issue).

 

I feel badly for you. Perhaps I can help.... If you will send me the coins, I'll image them for you and ship them back, free of charge. I don't like to toot my own horn, but I think its safe to say that I can do a much better job than NGC when it comes to photography (you can see samples in my registry set, linked below). I'll even soak the dime in acetone to (hopefully) remove the green.

 

Please send me a PM if you're interested. Sincerely..Mike

[World Colonial]

Ctrl, Have you called NGC/NCS yet?...Mike

I have now. They gave me NGC credit for the missing coupon, which is appreciated. I still wish they would have conserved the dime, even if it was marked as cleaned I wanted the green removed, and I would have loved to have had the imaging done. But that was their decision as the experts and I certainly don't want to spend any more money on it, so it is what it is now. Thanks to NCS for the credit, though I'm not sure about this hobby anymore.

 

I do not believe it is necessarily accurate that NCS will not conserve a cleaned coin but they might do it only under certain circumstances. I have sent several coins for conservation and they were conserved and did come back "improperly cleaned". But one difference might have been that it was not possible to perform this evaluation before the conservation took place because the residue obscured the surface of the coin. In one case, the NGC grader at the ANA convention told me the cojn was cleaned, but I wanted the coin conserved anyway. And after i got it back, it was in an NCS holder but it looked much better.

 

Another thing to consider is that sometimes NGC will reject a coin one time and then grade it on the second try. On my first submisison, I submitted a 1770 Bolivia pillar 4R and it came back "scratched". Then I sent it in to NCS and it ended coming back NGC XF-40 which I believe was the correct grade because even under magnification I could not see what NGC presumably saw the first time. I found it annoying to pay the fee twice but nobody is perfect.

[MikeKing]

Regarding the dime: It was most certainly not conserved, it looks the same and I was not charged for conservation. You guys might think it's trashable, but it was one of my favorites from an inherited set and I wanted it to be professionally conserved not only to improve the appearance by removing the green globs on it, but also to protect it from those spots damaging it more in the future.

 

I've read of cases where NCS conserved a coin only for it to be labelled as 'improperly cleaned'. I did not think this one would be body-bagged, so I was not knowingly asking NCS to 'unclean' a cleaned coin. I know that. I wanted the green removed regardless and they didn't do it. I don't care that it was ineligible to go to NGC before or after conservation. I disagree that it was "a service that could not be performed".

 

Regarding the coupon: I paid the same amount as I would have if I had not included the coupon, correct? Or is it the case that if a coin won't make it to NGC, you have to pay BOTH NGC *and* NCS?

 

I'm sure these actually are all dumb statements and questions. I am clearly 'over my head' and shouldn't be doing any of this.

 

The dime is important to you. If they did not remove the green stuff (which could be pvc, verdigris, who knows what), I would call them up and tell them you want to resubmit the coin for proper conservation ACCORDING to your specification (i.e. remove the green) at no cost. Explain to them both on the phone and in writing o the submission slip that the coin is sentimental to you and you want the green removed.

 

NCS may have made the judgement that removing the green might make the coin worse, because they don't know what is UNDER the green. But if you are willing to risk this, you should tell them this is what you want done. That's what you paid for. And yes, you paid for it. I don't think they discriminate amongst collectors.

 

You got a great amount of really really good advice from so many people above. This is a great learning experience for you, and anyone who takes the time to read through this whole post, so I have nothing else to offer.

 

 

 

 

[ant]

ncs is very cool about things like that. i recently had a coin not make it into a ncs slab and explained what i needed and they said mark it on next submit and they will correct.

[Oldtrader3]

If you specifically ask for a cleaned coin to be conserved and submit it to NCS for that purpose, they will conserve it. I have an 1913-S dime which a coin doctor had cleaned the cheek on over a dimple and had puttied the coin to cover up the dimple and the cleaning. I sent this coin to NCS with instructions to conserve the coin and they removed the putty and slabbed it in an NCS holder. This was after spending money (and losing the cost of) to slab the coin, which was body bagged by NGC.

 

What happened to you has happened to many others as well. NGC did not refund my grading fee for BBing the dime. You were lucky, you complained and they gave you credit for not grading and BBing a cleaned coin. Normally you would not get your money back. Plus, I had to spend additional money with NCS to have the coin conserved and slabbed.

 

The coin with the dimple and removed puuty is shown beow and, if you look carefully, you can see that the coin was cleaned around the dimple in the cheek.

[prudden]

I sent in my first five coins awhile back.One was a crossover. Two came back graded(one was undergraded!!!!) and slabbed. One came back improperly cleaned(I still disagree),another came back "artificial color" and the last came back"altered surfaces".I got almost the whole range Sure,I was upset,but I've gotten over it(mostly). It was a nerve wracking learning experience. Funny thing is, they sent the "cleaned" coin back with a note to send it to NCS for conserving and not for an NCS details slab. So,if you can just keep collectig what you like and if you really have to have a coin graded,bring it or send it to a GOOD reputable coin shop first. You can always post pictures here and ask these guys. They'll be right 99.9% of the time!! The most important thing is Have Fun.

[cpm9ball]

When I spoke to David Lange at FUN about a Morgan that I had BB'ed for "Altered Surfaces", he said that this classification was sort of a catch-all for a variety of causes. In my case, he felt that conservation would probably provide a cure and it would probably grade through NGC afterward.

 

You might want to consider contacting NGC to find out what specific problem was detected for your "Altered Surfaces" coin. Maybe it can be fixed.

 

Chris

[MarkFeld]

When I spoke to David Lange at FUN about a Morgan that I had BB'ed for "Altered Surfaces", he said that this classification was sort of a catch-all for a variety of causes. In my case, he felt that conservation would probably provide a cure and it would probably grade through NGC afterward.

 

You might want to consider contacting NGC to find out what specific problem was detected for your "Altered Surfaces" coin. Maybe it can be fixed.

 

Chris

If "altered surfaces" was noted, it is highly unlikely that NGC would have any additional information on record for the coin and its particular problem.

[cpm9ball]

When I spoke to David Lange at FUN about a Morgan that I had BB'ed for "Altered Surfaces", he said that this classification was sort of a catch-all for a variety of causes. In my case, he felt that conservation would probably provide a cure and it would probably grade through NGC afterward.

 

You might want to consider contacting NGC to find out what specific problem was detected for your "Altered Surfaces" coin. Maybe it can be fixed.

 

Chris

If "altered surfaces" was noted, it is highly unlikely that NGC would have any additional information on record for the coin and its particular problem.

 

I should have worded my response more carefully. I meant that it would require someone from NGC to examine the coin to determine if conservation could remedy the problem.

 

Chris

[ant]

When I spoke to David Lange at FUN about a Morgan that I had BB'ed for "Altered Surfaces", he said that this classification was sort of a catch-all for a variety of causes. In my case, he felt that conservation would probably provide a cure and it would probably grade through NGC afterward.

 

You might want to consider contacting NGC to find out what specific problem was detected for your "Altered Surfaces" coin. Maybe it can be fixed.

 

Chris

If "altered surfaces" was noted, it is highly unlikely that NGC would have any additional information on record for the coin and its particular problem.

 

which i think would be a good idea to start . the comic graders can show that they graded a book. you can call and they will pull up notes from grader(s). in coins they look and if they BB a coin they cant even tell us why later.

 

i had a fellow jeweler test my ring and they couldnt even write up a simple thing that they looked at it. so i didnt pay and being that they didnt have proof they even did a job i wasnt required to pay.

i do like and use ngc but this service would do 2 things, proov that they even looked at the coin, provide a buyer recourse to find out about a coin in a slab.and why the said coin graded the way it did.

 

cgc will talk to you about the book as though they still had it in hand.

 

hint hint ngc!

[Conder101]

You can always post pictures here and ask these guys. They'll be right 99.9% of the time!!

Really? That's pretty good considering the professional graders at the services are only consistantly on target 75 - 80% of the time. And they are looking at the actual coin while we would only be looking at pictures. I guess if we could see the coin itself we'd pick up that last .1%

[prudden]

You can always post pictures here and ask these guys. They'll be right 99.9% of the time!!

Really? That's pretty good considering the professional graders at the services are only consistantly on target 75 - 80% of the time. And they are looking at the actual coin while we would only be looking at pictures. I guess if we could see the coin itself we'd pick up that last .1%

 

Alright.You got me.